Hearthstone
Nightmare On Emerald Street - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread
Submitted 2 years, 11 months ago by
ShadowsOfSense
Competition Theme: Nightmare On Emerald Street
It's time to turn our dreams into reality! But our sleep has been far too restless lately... oh dear...
- You must create a Druid card themed around the Emerald Nightmare
- It's not been touched upon too much in Hearthstone, so there's lots of free space to work with!
Our very own linkblade91 is looking for a different kind of Druid this week. Dream up some nightmarish cards for him!
As always, I can be reached through Discord or here on the site via PM if you have any issues to report.
Competition Phases
Here are the phases of this card design competition
- Submission Phase: Starts on Mon, Dec 27 17:00 EST (GMT -0500). Runs until Sat, Jan 1 17:00 EST (GMT -0500)
- Voting Phase: Starts on Sat, Jan 1 17:00 EST (GMT -0500). Runs until Sun, Jan 2 16:00 EST (GMT -0500)
- Finalist Phase: Starts on Sun, Jan 2 17:00 EST (GMT -0500). Runs until Mon, Jan 3 17:00 EST (GMT -0500)
- Winner Selected: After finalist voting concludes and we validate votes.
Discussion Thread Rules
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Competition Theme: Nightmare On Emerald Street
It's time to turn our dreams into reality! But our sleep has been far too restless lately... oh dear...
Our very own linkblade91 is looking for a different kind of Druid this week. Dream up some nightmarish cards for him!
As always, I can be reached through Discord or here on the site via PM if you have any issues to report.
Competition Phases
Here are the phases of this card design competition
Discussion Thread Rules
No thread rules were added to this season. Please populate and manually edit this thread with them.
Welcome to the site!
If I'm not mistaken, Satyrs are basically corrupted Night Elves, so I thought about implementing this mechanically. I put it in the mini set because the Corrupted version is a non-Warlock/DH Demon, which was kind of an Outlands only thing.
For those not in the know, the Emerald Nightmare is a corrupting influence on the Emerald Dream, which is a spirit realm watched over by Ysera. Those affected by the Nightmare are driven to madness and (generally) lost forever, but it can also make them incredibly powerful in the process. The Emerald Nightmare originated from when the roots of the World Tree grew so far into the ground that they touched the prison of Yogg-Saron, Hope's End, although N'Zoth, the Corruptor has also had an influence as well. It is also a WoW raid, featuring numerous bosses (including Il'gynoth, a corrupted Cenarius, and Xavius as the final boss).
If you're looking to create Legendary minions, I would start with either "Xavius, Nightmare Lord" or a corrupted version of Ysera or Cenarius. There are also the "Dragons of Nightmare", which include Emeriss. For non-Legendaries, satyrs are a good one: corrupted minions in general are a great starting point. Druids of all races, night elves, wildlife, and green dragons are the most susceptible to the Nightmare. "Evil" spells focused on death and decay are another option.
In terms of art, red is the primary color of the Nightmare, followed by black and purple.
In terms of expansions, either a custom watermark, Whispers of the Old Gods, or Madness at the Darkmoon Faire would probably be best, unless you can find a reason for the card to be situated elsewhere.
That should be enough to get you started; you can always dig deeper if you'd like :)
Here's an attempt at using the Dormant keyword, but since we're talking about Nightmares and Corruption I tried to push it into a more aggressive direction.
Dormant heroes can't attack, be attacked, take damage or be healed (just like Dormant minions - duh!). This card is meant to set up Two-Turn-Kills, by effectively 'freezing' your opponent's Health between two turns.
How about...a Corruptible Hero card? I had the art for a Nightmare-Ysera, and found a similar pose for regular-Ysera, so why not, right? Edit: No wonder that art exists: it's the art for Ysera the Green, the Battlegrounds skin lol whoops.
I see this card kind of like the split between Drek'Thar and Vanndar Stormpike, to be honest: you play the regular version or the Corrupted version for different reasons. The original is the top-end of a Treant or Aggro/Token deck, where you play a bunch of cheap minions and then turn them into badasses. The Corrupted Ysera card, conversely, is for a Control Druid that wants to keep removing the enemy's board before turning the tables with the Hero Power.
The former's Hero Power is stupid easy to upgrade, so I am concerned about that, but I want the base effects to remain the same for each (because that's what Blizzard would probably do, I think, to keep things simple and understandable). Only the Battlecry and the upgrade part are different. Edit: Maybe they should both say "Give a minion +1/+1 this turn"? That way the normal version would run out of steam, and the minions would revert to their small selves afterward.
In building your deck towards one or the other, normal or Corrupted, you are demonstrating your allegiance between The Dream or The Nightmare.
This may be a great flavor comp, but it's difficult to think of a good card to use here.
But here's some opinions to keep everything rolling.
Perhaps I'm horribly misunderstanding what this is supposed to do, so please enlighten me if this is the case.
A Corrupt hero card is great. This one in particular however… I'm not that fond of. Namely because the Corrupt ability is a huge deviation to what Corrupt effects tend to be. Corrupt effects tend to be either just a stat/keyword buff, or a smooth and logical upgraded version of what the baseline effect is and not something completely and utterly different like this card is.
And because the effects are so drastically different from each other, the effect feels way too sidegrade-y for a Corrupt card. True, Circus Medic (and to some extent, Felsteel Executioner) is a sidegrade rather than a strict upgrade, but like the other Corrupt cards, it's a simple, logical progression of the base effect (damage instead of healing) and the 4 damage will be better than the 4 healing in a majority of cases. Whatever the better form on Ysera is though, is very board dependent and instances of the base form being the optimal form is much more common than instances where the base form of Circus Medic is optimal, and I don't like using Corrupt in this way.
Balance, art, etc. and everything else is otherwise fine.
Well, satyr and dreams make me think of a Pan figure. Not sure if this is too op, you have to "sacrifice" a minion for 2 turns to get it going but it might allow for some OP combo idk. Druid man, always some combo around the corner, almost as bad as warlock.
I'll boop you
I don't really like any of my own ideas... so as any idea that presented here.
I agree with Demon's criticism, so I decided to go for a new idea.
If regular Druid is about gaining Mana, evil Druid punishes your opponent for using theirs.
The first version is like Time Out!, in that you spend 3 Mana to prevent (or discourage) your opponent from doing something.
The legendary feels appropriate for this effect, but maybe it's too polarizing depending on whether your opponent can remove it cleanly or not, but I guess that can be said about a lot of cards.
I used "after" instead of "whenever" so that your enemy can still heal or gain Armor, but maybe the core idea is too toxic in itself. I don't know, it's a bit tricky, I think.
I'll try giving feedback later.
Thank you, linkblade, for the thorough explanation. I don't know much about WoW lore myself, except the bits and pieces I get from Hearthstone. I believe this should be on-theme:
The idea behind it is that the Emerald Nightmare starts these outgrowths on some of the roots of the World Tree, which is taxing on the nature around it. In practice, it's a control tool that punishes decks that rely too heavily on extra card draw.
I don't like Fever Dream. It just feels like on-curve damage with extra steps and it's kinda boring, since it doesn't interact with the board. You should probably go with Nightmare Lord Xavius instead, since it gives your opponent the opportunity to minimize the damage making it much more interactive.
That being said, it is a tech card and doesn't seem too game-changing, so I think it'd be more fitting in Neutral.
Maybe make the stacking effect only count for the next time you use your Hero Power. Then the normal one could upgrade it wherever you summon a minion and the Corrupted whenever ANY minion dies (since that includes the ones you summon that should be somewhat of an upgrade). It's possibly too weak, but it's just an example to give an idea of what I'm talking about while still staying true to the flavor of your card.
Gotta admire the use of Corrupt on a Hero card, though.
Feedback, as promised.
Besides that, the idea is quite original, but a bit strange.
How's this for an update on the Hero card?
Now the Corrupt is blatantly better, summoning upgraded Treants. They also can feed into Nightmare's Embrace immediately (by trading), meaning Corrupted Ysera gets a head-start on her Hero Power usage. I kept regular-Ysera's Hero Power as Play instead of Summon mostly because it wouldn't fit without looking ugly.
Sadly can't show you the Treant token, 'cause I've run out of room *shrugs* It would just be an evil tree, functioning as a "vanilla" 4/4/4 with Rush.
I will say that I'm not personally as thrilled about this current iteration, because I wanted to keep the Twisting Nether/better Poison Seeds connection to the Nightmare, being a realm of death, but if people prefer this version than that's fine. I'd rather win than soothe my ego lol.
I'll provide feedback later.
I also prefer the previous version.
Wow, I really have nothing for this one so far. I've submitted a card for every comp so far, and I'm not going to let this one be the first one that I don't enter. For the Christmas comp, I ended up having to submit a card I made in less than a minute without any feedback and I surprisingly made it to the finals with it, so I guess that may happen here as well.
But here's a follow-up to my original feedback.
I'm going to have to agree and say that two turns of immunity is quite strong. Druid can easily just choose a meaningless 1/1 token to make Dormant almost completely negating the downside and then buff the Immune minion. Immune in general is a touchy keyword to explore because it can easily become problematic. It also feels a bit weird in flavor as well.
I'm not sure that's what's going on here. I encourage you to keep the original Battlecry. It turned a strong summon into a perhaps even more powerful destruction. It fits the prompt perfectly, turning the effect around in a evil and (often) profitable way, similar to Circus Medic. I should have mentioned this in my original feedback, but my feedback tends to get pretty long, so I often focus on improvements.
I enjoy cards that are a bit more out there and have unique effects. Those cards do make it to the finals, but in my experience, it tends to be the saver (whatever that means) cards that win. But I don't think you should let that limit your creativity. And most certainly don't mistake your own creativity for ego.
I'd like to make a Xavius Prime, but I'm too busy now to come up with good 'Prime' effect.
Sorry, I'll try to leave feedback tomorrow.
EDIT: no, I'll make feedback now. From last to first.
What's really difficult is trying to come up with something that makes sense for the competition, but at the same time, not going against the core philosophies of how Druid cards are designed. Some designs I can think of in my mind that make sense are like "oh, that's kinda cool, but... it I can't break that weakness of Druid."
Nonetheless, I did manage to get something out that doesn't fall into that trap.
That being said, the Prime effect isn't very interesting to me. It already exists on Ysera the Dreamer and why Dream cards? Isn't Xavius suppose to be on the opposite side?
However, I just don't think it's very appealing. It's effectively a hard reset, which makes the match progress very slowly and will remove the advantage of any extra mana crystals Druid is so fond of getting.
Here's my feedback, a day late and a dollar short. Meant to get it up yesterday but I was having too much fun playing Gunfire Reborn lel:
Demonxz95 - You really like resetting the game to the start lol :P I am not a fan, to be honest, because as AeroJulwin alluded to there isn't much advantage to be had here. Celestial Alignment's positives can be exploited; this is just a hard reset that drags out the game and/or forces you to double-down on the ramp to get back up to speed.
R - Going the Prime route is a great idea; kind of upset I didn't think of it first. That said Xavius Prime should not produce Dream cards, unless it is explicitly Nightmare. It's a major disconnect to the whole flavor. I would not be against something as simple as "Add three copies of Nightmare to your hand", to try and extend for lethal, although I imagine there are more creative things to do with it.
AeroJulwin - I think the card is neat, but I wonder if I would ever use it. Theoretically the Druid wouldn't be as punished because ramp can mitigate the cost, but I wonder if such a thing would make more sense in the Warlock. That or some other class that can burn through its deck faster; lets you screw with your opponent without hurting yourself as much. If your deck is slower, you have more to lose from this.
Wailor - My concern with this effect is that you would just use it to guarantee someone's death: if they're low on Health they literally can't do anything but skip their turn and await your lethal hit. Fever Dream is especially bad because you can cast it twice in a round for double the trouble. Xavius might be fine, given it's an expensive Legendary, but it's definitely not a fun card to be around IMO.
BasilAnguis - Immune is dangerous; always makes me nervous. Two turns is a lot, as well. I don't know, it just seems like a small downside when you can turn off like a token or something small for what could be a major play.
TheHoax91 - It's certainly an interesting idea: you would naturally play this last in a turn, after doing what damage you can. I think it might seem unintuitive for some, and that could cost you points.
No, its like after Nightmare Lord Xavius's death Emerald Dream is freed from the corruption. (:
Updated my Prime version!
Yeah, not a great idea from the start but when you're frazzled for something, you just gotta do with what you got.
But I did nonetheless come up with something else. Tried to spin around Druid's tendency to benefit from a wide board (particularly modeled after Soul of the Forest) into building one from your opponent.
I wasn't sure if 4 was the right cost for the card. I just thought "Vivid Spores is 4 mana, and this basically that card in reverse so, 4 again? It does have the potential to allow for some wide board building, though Druid doesn't have strong AoE to combo with it.
Good luck everyone :)
Congratulations to AeroJulwin!
420 blaze it!
You officially have the highest-scoring card in the entirety of our WCDCs.
Congratulations to AeroJulwin!
I notice I am confused. Something I believe isn't true. How do I know what I think I know?
Harry James Potter-Evans-Verres, hpmor.com
Very cool card, congrats!