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Legends of Runeterra | Posted by | 4 years, 3 months ago
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Final Meta Changes - Pre Expansion

We got some pretty big shifts in the S tier again.

Not gonna waste much time.

Pirate aggro is in S tier again, some would argue mostly me that it never left based solely on the numbers it just got outshined by pre nerf Poppy.

Scouts, hey can't complain about this deck being in S tier, it has a clear champ focused wincon and Quin is just kinda cool from a design perspective.

Spiders drops down, to A only because one pure aggro deck gets to be in S tier and pirate aggro has always been more consistent for like the last two years...but it's nice to see the rankings reflect the obvious.

Zed rally drops down too, mainly because Kenin Ahiri can stun Zed all day and rallies become useless.

Honestly minus Kenin it's basically Bilgewater meta, and if you liked that you will be happy, if you hated it well too bad.

We'll talk about something other than meta shifts when there is something else to actually talk about.

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  • We got some pretty big shifts in the S tier again.

    Not gonna waste much time.

    Pirate aggro is in S tier again, some would argue mostly me that it never left based solely on the numbers it just got outshined by pre nerf Poppy.

    Scouts, hey can't complain about this deck being in S tier, it has a clear champ focused wincon and Quin is just kinda cool from a design perspective.

    Spiders drops down, to A only because one pure aggro deck gets to be in S tier and pirate aggro has always been more consistent for like the last two years...but it's nice to see the rankings reflect the obvious.

    Zed rally drops down too, mainly because Kenin Ahiri can stun Zed all day and rallies become useless.

    Honestly minus Kenin it's basically Bilgewater meta, and if you liked that you will be happy, if you hated it well too bad.

    We'll talk about something other than meta shifts when there is something else to actually talk about.

    • I honestly don't know where you get your meta reports from. Maybe just browsing the tier list on Mobalytics? Wherever you get your reports, you need a new source.

      Here you go, all gift wrapped and served on the proverbial platter. That guy posts a new report every Monday to the LorCompetitive subreddit.

      If you don't like that one, Dr. Lor also makes a weekly meta report. He's late for this week, but here's a link that will take you to his list of reports.

      Now, with all that out of the way, I'll summarize what the first link says about the meta.

      Top 6 decks by playrate (in order): Scouts, Darkness, Lurk, Kennen Ahri (Shurima), Zilean Zerath, Kennen Ahri (SI).

      Top 7 decks by winrate (in order): Kennen Ahri (Shurima), Taric Pantheon, Kennen Ahri (SI), Fizz Lulu, Scouts, Shyvana Pantheon, Elise Trundle

      Not exactly dripping with Bilgewater. Also, no spiders at all. No pirates either.

      • Quote From sto650

        I honestly don't know where you get your meta reports from. Maybe just browsing the tier list on Mobalytics? Wherever you get your reports, you need a new source.

        Here you go, all gift wrapped and served on the proverbial platter. That guy posts a new report every Monday to the LorCompetitive subreddit.

        If you don't like that one, Dr. Lor also makes a weekly meta report. He's late for this week, but here's a link that will take you to his list of reports.

        Now, with all that out of the way, I'll summarize what the first link says about the meta.

        Top 6 decks by playrate (in order): Scouts, Darkness, Lurk, Kennen Ahri (Shurima), Zilean Zerath, Kennen Ahri (SI).

        Top 7 decks by winrate (in order): Kennen Ahri (Shurima), Taric Pantheon, Kennen Ahri (SI), Fizz Lulu, Scouts, Shyvana Pantheon, Elise Trundle

        Not exactly dripping with Bilgewater. Also, no spiders at all. No pirates either.

        Those meta report do match the data from Runeterra.Ar : https://runeterra.ar/stats

        Based on my personal experience on the ladder, the only Bilgewater deck that I see is Lurk. I guess you can count Scouts too, but that's mostly a Demacia deck with like 6-9 Bilgewater cards. Gankplank/Sejuani and Nami/TF are both gone from the ladder and haven't encountered a single pirate aggro in months now.

        I do face spider Aggro every now and then tho.

        • Quote From minuano28

          I guess you can count Scouts too, but that's mostly a Demacia deck with like 6-9 Bilgewater cards.

          It depends on the version. I've been playing a version that doesn't include Bannerman, and goes instead for more Bilgewater cards, like Marai Warden, Island Navigator, and Jagged Butcher.

          Edit - Here's yet another Meta Report. I like the way this one gives a bunch of little snapshots of different aspects of the meta, with pretty good visualizations.

  • Hey sorry, I usually have like 17 notifications on this account at any given time and I don't really have time to answer them all.

    For my stats I start with a tier list and then cross check winrates. Occasionally looking at play rates as well.

    I agree that pirate aggro is S tier along with Mobalytics its essentially maintained a 56% -> 58% winrate for as long as the deck has existed.

    Its meta resistant, easy to play, consistent and has stood the test of time even longer than midrange plunder which has fallen off the map.

    As for the resurgence of Scouts that might be a temporary thing but enjoy it while it lasts I say.

    Kenin Ahiri is obviously great, but the truth is play rates are low across the board. To the point that debating which is the best deck gets exceedingly difficult.

    So at the end of the day the equation should look like this.

    Win rate + time dominating = top tier 

    • The only way that Pirates can claim winrates like that is if you are doing data for the entire ladder. 

      But that's no longer a "meta" anymore, because people can climb with literally any deck through Iron, Bronze, and even Silver as well. You can technically still climb with a winrate below 50% through those tiers, meaning that people's deck choices (and therefore match results) are not relevant to "the meta" for any tier less than Gold. And most meta reports ignore Gold as well, focusing only on what people are playing in Platinum, Diamond, and Masters.

      The decks in Plat, Diamond, and Masters are the decks that have proven themselves to be strong and viable in "the meta" as it stands right now.

      And I can tell you with complete certainty that Pirates is NOT in the meta for Plat, Diamond and Masters. It's not a good deck right now, unless you're fighting mostly bad decks or bad players. Sure, it will post great winrates through Iron, Bronze, and Silver, but not past there.

      I browsed through three different meta reports (who all filter their data for only Plat+) and Pirates is not even on the list for any of them, in any form - neither playrate nor winrate. Even in this cheeky article, featuring 26 "high-performing blends ... for the discerning part-time ladderista," none of the decks is the traditional pirates list (though it does have a pirates list that uses Ionia instead of Noxus).

      EDIT - I found meta data where Pirates shows up at about a 54.5% winrate (and a 0.9% playrate in that data set). I only recently resumed playing LoR, and today was my first time breaking back into Gold IV (I had to start at the very bottom of Iron). So, I decided to test the waters with Pirates at the bottom of Gold. I do have experience playing it in the past, and my opponents didn't strike me as particularly good - but even so, I did win 3 in a row. So, maybe I'm being too hard on the deck. It's better than I thought it was.