Yeah, I think it's very unrefined for the time being. Maybe doesn't even currently have what it takes post-rotation to be the Face deck we used to know.
Any prediction on how good this deck's winrate should be, considering how stupidly fast and unfun wild is? :) Considering to play it but don't have the dust to craft some legendaries yet.
I completely agree that the Switcheroo Priest is a tilting, highrolly deck, but the data on HSReplay (which is certainly only preliminary since the expansion just launched) suggests that it's generally pretty bad in Standard. In theory that should be enough to fix the problem on its own, but here are some of my thoughts on the cards in question:
If the mana cost of Switcheroo were to increase, it would only serve to make the card exclusively relevant to high-roll decks (because it would be too expensive as draw elsewhere). That seems bad.
I actually think it's good to have a limited number of cards like Twin-fin Fin Twin that summon a "copy" rather than "another" version of the card. This incentivizes handbuffing strategies, which I think is valuable. Without that copying, it's on par with Spring Rocket in terms of its power level, which seems a little wrong since it's a rare compared to a common.
Stonetusk Boar seems to see play in Wild exclusively as part of a degenerate combo deck, but I wouldn't love seeing it removed because a lot of those degenerate combos require assembling lots of cards
With all that in mind, I think the best fix is to ban Switcheroo in Wild and remove Rush from Twin-fin Fin Twin. The former solves the Wild problem completely, and the latter should make Switcheroo Priest even more vulnerable to aggressive strategies, driving down the win rate for Standard Switcheroo Priest so low that no one will want to play it. (You could consider upping the base stats of the Twin-fin a bit to account for the change.)
With these changes, Switcheroo can still be a relevant card in Silence Priest or Miracle Priest strategies, and Twin-fin Fin Twin can still be relevant to handbuff decks where it was clearly intended to be relevant. Switcheroo Priest will still be intact enough for people to play it if they really love that high-rolling nonsense, but it will be slow enough that it won't become a major part of the meta ecosystem.
Banning Switcheroo from wild would solve most things, for now. When it eventually rotates, I doubt the world have moved on to the extent that the combo would cease to be relevant. Turn 4 OTK is about as fast as it gets, barring druid bs.
I can't say I can agree with the twinfin solution though. Removing rush from this indirectly reduces the viability of murloc and handbuff decks, and looking at their power levels I wouldn't call that fair at all, particularly when they can just nerf switcheroo to 4 or limit its draw to cards that costs less than 6.
But knowing team5, they'd probably just increase switcheroo's and twinfin's costs. An effective though less elegant fix.
Probably the best compromise. I like the proposal of removal of Rush on Twin-fin, as I am not even sure if they are played in Shudderwock decks despite their current effect.
I completely agree that the Switcheroo Priest is a tilting, highrolly deck, but the data on HSReplay (which is certainly only preliminary since the expansion just launched) suggests that it's generally pretty bad in Standard. In theory that should be enough to fix the problem on its own, but here are some of my thoughts on the cards in question:
If the mana cost of Switcheroo were to increase, it would only serve to make the card exclusively relevant to high-roll decks (because it would be too expensive as draw elsewhere). That seems bad.
I actually think it's good to have a limited number of cards like Twin-fin Fin Twin that summon a "copy" rather than "another" version of the card. This incentivizes handbuffing strategies, which I think is valuable. Without that copying, it's on par with Spring Rocket in terms of its power level, which seems a little wrong since it's a rare compared to a common.
Stonetusk Boar seems to see play in Wild exclusively as part of a degenerate combo deck, but I wouldn't love seeing it removed because a lot of those degenerate combos require assembling lots of cards
With all that in mind, I think the best fix is to ban Switcheroo in Wild and remove Rush from Twin-fin Fin Twin. The former solves the Wild problem completely, and the latter should make Switcheroo Priest even more vulnerable to aggressive strategies, driving down the win rate for Standard Switcheroo Priest so low that no one will want to play it. (You could consider upping the base stats of the Twin-fin a bit to account for the change.)
With these changes, Switcheroo can still be a relevant card in Silence Priest or Miracle Priest strategies, and Twin-fin Fin Twin can still be relevant to handbuff decks where it was clearly intended to be relevant. Switcheroo Priest will still be intact enough for people to play it if they really love that high-rolling nonsense, but it will be slow enough that it won't become a major part of the meta ecosystem.
I wouldn't mind if they blanket applied this to everything, period. Nothing should summon an identical copy, just copy of the base minion. They could bundle that with the Vivid Nightmare change I suggested. Getting kinda sick of infinite Shudderwocks all the time.
So... ban Board and nerf Twin-fin to summon another Twin-fin and NOT another copy of itself? I swear Blizzard isn't learning the lessons of minions such as Twin-fin or Irondeep Trogg.
Sure, there are answers to it. But that doesn't make it okay or healthy. You need to be running some very specific cards that not every deck can afford to use. Do you really want to run trash like Plague Scientist or Noble Sacrifice in a non-Secret deck just to counter one deck with a 50% winrate? That's just gonna tank your winrate against everything else. You also need to have drawn that specific card by turn 2 -- they're playing a deck designed to tutor, you presumably are not, so that's much less consistent on your end.
The problem with Switcheroo isn't that it's overpowered. It's sitting at a less than positive winrate. The problem is that doing a coinflip isn't very engaging gameplay, and needs to be changed for that reason.
Warrior needs to somehow stall before Brawl. Alternatively they can use Provoke on a Poisonous minion.
Demon Hunter only has Sigil of Silence, and since it's not a Secret, Priest can simply let it go through and still summon two 12/12 units. Otherwise they need to cheese it out with Poisonous minions.
Same for Druid, except they literally only have Neutral minions to even stand a chance.
For the Wild variant of the deck I'd honestly leave Switcheroo untouched and I'd change Vivid Nightmare instead. Generally, the fact that the card copies the attack has not been particularly relevant in decks that used it in the past, the reason they used it was to copy deathrattles or persistent effects such as Nazmani Bloodweaver or Malygos and such. If you can't copy the boar for the 20 dmg punch, you're left with a 20/20 charge that then requires further shenanigans with Divine Spirit + Inner Fire, which will usually give the opposing deck enough time to either Rat the pig, aggro or combo out the opponent, or otherwise interfere with the gameplan. Then it might be manageable.
Personal bias but I'd actually hate for Switcheroo to get nerfed in cost. I don't care for the swapping effect at all, but the ability to tutor out two minions out of your deck for the cost of an Arcane Intellect is pretty neat, previously only offered by Insight. I've been using it in Nazmani Bloodweaver + Gadgetzan Auctioneer Priest to discount Prophet Velen, copy it and Mind Blast the opponent to death. Sloppy combo but fun.
Sadly that wouldn't really help Standard, not sure what the Standard-legal options are there to counter the rush dragons. If it is counterable the meta can adjust and counter the deck into oblivion. Can't speak on that though.
A fun deck to play. When the Amalgam of the Deep discovers Grand Totem Eys'or, it gets really gnarly for the opponent. Thanks for posting.
Top 10 Wild Hearthstone Decks to Play From Week 1 in Voyage to the Sunken City
How do you think Darkness Boar will be nerfed? Ranked ladder is unplayable for me as is, because this stupid deck is offensive.
i think they should nerf to the ground the boar and all cheap charger
Nozdormu Goes Speed Diving - Special Quest and Decks for April 2022
I certainly do the 3) a lot on my DH! Somehow it fits well for that quest. Although usually in Wild.
Nozdormu Goes Speed Diving - Special Quest and Decks for April 2022
Yeah, I think it's very unrefined for the time being. Maybe doesn't even currently have what it takes post-rotation to be the Face deck we used to know.
Group Therapy! Need to blow off some steam? Mega salty? Here's the place!
If I have to play against one more mindless, linear Questline Warrior, I am going to start eating my shoe
Pharaoh Hunter in Voyage to the Sunken City - Celebrate Wild Week With Our Full Deck & Guide
I wouldn't craft it until you've seen all 10 decks in the Wild Week series - some of them are really fun and you may like them better.
Pharaoh Hunter in Voyage to the Sunken City - Celebrate Wild Week With Our Full Deck & Guide
Depends on the rank - if you play in Legend anything that can't beat turn 3 otks from Druid and Priest will have close to 0% winrate.
Wait for those decks to be nerfed or play in Casual or lower mmr (Bronze-Platinum but below Diamond).
Pharaoh Hunter in Voyage to the Sunken City - Celebrate Wild Week With Our Full Deck & Guide
Any prediction on how good this deck's winrate should be, considering how stupidly fast and unfun wild is? :) Considering to play it but don't have the dust to craft some legendaries yet.
Switcheroo Priest is the most miserable deck I've ever played against.
Banning Switcheroo from wild would solve most things, for now. When it eventually rotates, I doubt the world have moved on to the extent that the combo would cease to be relevant. Turn 4 OTK is about as fast as it gets, barring druid bs.
I can't say I can agree with the twinfin solution though. Removing rush from this indirectly reduces the viability of murloc and handbuff decks, and looking at their power levels I wouldn't call that fair at all, particularly when they can just nerf switcheroo to 4 or limit its draw to cards that costs less than 6.
But knowing team5, they'd probably just increase switcheroo's and twinfin's costs. An effective though less elegant fix.
Blizzard Sent Me a Voyage to the Sunken City Care Package - Thanks Hearthstone Team for the Gift
Great stuff. I want that compass! Looks really nice.
Pharaoh Hunter
Portrait: Dragonstalker Rexxar
Cardback: Varian
Nozdormu Goes Speed Diving - Special Quest and Decks for April 2022
I have yet to find a single other person who's playing Noz even once. Sigh.
Switcheroo Priest is the most miserable deck I've ever played against.
Probably the best compromise. I like the proposal of removal of Rush on Twin-fin, as I am not even sure if they are played in Shudderwock decks despite their current effect.
Switcheroo Priest is the most miserable deck I've ever played against.
I completely agree that the Switcheroo Priest is a tilting, highrolly deck, but the data on HSReplay (which is certainly only preliminary since the expansion just launched) suggests that it's generally pretty bad in Standard. In theory that should be enough to fix the problem on its own, but here are some of my thoughts on the cards in question:
With all that in mind, I think the best fix is to ban Switcheroo in Wild and remove Rush from Twin-fin Fin Twin. The former solves the Wild problem completely, and the latter should make Switcheroo Priest even more vulnerable to aggressive strategies, driving down the win rate for Standard Switcheroo Priest so low that no one will want to play it. (You could consider upping the base stats of the Twin-fin a bit to account for the change.)
With these changes, Switcheroo can still be a relevant card in Silence Priest or Miracle Priest strategies, and Twin-fin Fin Twin can still be relevant to handbuff decks where it was clearly intended to be relevant. Switcheroo Priest will still be intact enough for people to play it if they really love that high-rolling nonsense, but it will be slow enough that it won't become a major part of the meta ecosystem.
Switcheroo Priest is the most miserable deck I've ever played against.
I wouldn't mind if they blanket applied this to everything, period. Nothing should summon an identical copy, just copy of the base minion. They could bundle that with the Vivid Nightmare change I suggested. Getting kinda sick of infinite Shudderwocks all the time.
Switcheroo Priest is the most miserable deck I've ever played against.
So... ban Board and nerf Twin-fin to summon another Twin-fin and NOT another copy of itself? I swear Blizzard isn't learning the lessons of minions such as Twin-fin or Irondeep Trogg.
Switcheroo Priest is the most miserable deck I've ever played against.
I so hope they don't change switcheroo in standard. I finally made silence priest (sort of) work with it. If it's nerged it will be dumbster again...
But honestly why not change the boar to eg rush? It just feels it limits design space too much...
Blizzard Sent Me a Voyage to the Sunken City Care Package - Thanks Hearthstone Team for the Gift
Awesome stuff! :)
Switcheroo Priest is the most miserable deck I've ever played against.
Sure, there are answers to it. But that doesn't make it okay or healthy. You need to be running some very specific cards that not every deck can afford to use. Do you really want to run trash like Plague Scientist or Noble Sacrifice in a non-Secret deck just to counter one deck with a 50% winrate? That's just gonna tank your winrate against everything else. You also need to have drawn that specific card by turn 2 -- they're playing a deck designed to tutor, you presumably are not, so that's much less consistent on your end.
The problem with Switcheroo isn't that it's overpowered. It's sitting at a less than positive winrate. The problem is that doing a coinflip isn't very engaging gameplay, and needs to be changed for that reason.
Blizzard Sent Me a Voyage to the Sunken City Care Package - Thanks Hearthstone Team for the Gift
That video of the bubblegun in action put a smile on my face 🙃it's definitely as whimsical as HS. Really great gifts you got there overall!
Switcheroo Priest is the most miserable deck I've ever played against.
Other
### Jade Druid
# Class: Druid
# Format: Wild
#
# 2x (0) Aquatic Form
# 1x (1) Jade Idol
# 2x (1) Lesser Jasper Spellstone
# 2x (2) Moonlit Guidance
# 2x (2) Solar Eclipse
# 2x (3) Ferocious Howl
# 2x (3) Fungal Fortunes
# 2x (3) Jade Blossom
# 1x (4) Archmage Vargoth
# 2x (4) Injured Marauder
# 2x (4) Oaken Summons
# 2x (4) Overgrowth
# 2x (4) Poison Seeds
# 1x (5) Wildheart Guff
# 2x (6) Spreading Plague
# 2x (7) Miracle Growth
# 1x (10) Ultimate Infestation
#
AAEBAZICBLS7AofOAtaZA4mLBA2KDsu8AqDNApjSAoTmAr/yAuW6A+i6A4rgA9ToA6+ABP+9BK7ABAA=
#
# To use this deck, copy it to your clipboard and create a new deck in Hearthstone
Nozdormu Goes Speed Diving - Special Quest and Decks for April 2022
I always appreciate these posts. Happy Noz Day everyone :)
Switcheroo Priest is the most miserable deck I've ever played against.
Just make it 5 mana. Switcheroo has a degenerate effect and degenerate effects should come with a heavy tax so they don't get too broken.
Switcheroo Priest is the most miserable deck I've ever played against.
For the Wild variant of the deck I'd honestly leave Switcheroo untouched and I'd change Vivid Nightmare instead. Generally, the fact that the card copies the attack has not been particularly relevant in decks that used it in the past, the reason they used it was to copy deathrattles or persistent effects such as Nazmani Bloodweaver or Malygos and such. If you can't copy the boar for the 20 dmg punch, you're left with a 20/20 charge that then requires further shenanigans with Divine Spirit + Inner Fire, which will usually give the opposing deck enough time to either Rat the pig, aggro or combo out the opponent, or otherwise interfere with the gameplan. Then it might be manageable.
Personal bias but I'd actually hate for Switcheroo to get nerfed in cost. I don't care for the swapping effect at all, but the ability to tutor out two minions out of your deck for the cost of an Arcane Intellect is pretty neat, previously only offered by Insight. I've been using it in Nazmani Bloodweaver + Gadgetzan Auctioneer Priest to discount Prophet Velen, copy it and Mind Blast the opponent to death. Sloppy combo but fun.
Sadly that wouldn't really help Standard, not sure what the Standard-legal options are there to counter the rush dragons. If it is counterable the meta can adjust and counter the deck into oblivion. Can't speak on that though.