I haven't played as much the last few months and just wanted to hear what off-meta Hunter builds folks have been having (moderate) success with this expansion.
Things I've been exploring so far:
Various types of Quest Hunter which still seems viable
Have had moderate success with a taunt heavy Control deck centered around N'zoth + Jewel of N'Zoth
Failed miserably at getting Spell Hunter off the ground featuring Jepetto Joybuzz + Malygos, Yogg, and C'thun...both a highlander version and a more robust duplicate deck
Oh, and I've tried out the decks from Mark McKz on this site and they were fun combos to try to pull off :)
Has anyone had success with these archetypes or anything else off-meta like Highlander Beast Hunter, Corrupt (Y'shaaraj) Hunter, Dragon Hunter, etc.? Thanks in advance!
Yeah, for the most part the answers were just “we’re working on it” or “we’re thinking about it.” It’s nice to hear what their priorities are though, I’m excited for what they decide to do with PvE modes!
Hunter is perfectly fine in Wild if you ever played secret highlander Hunter. Hunter doesn't need a strong presence is wild like priest, paladin, mage, & warlock It has enough representation each season in standard. Hunter lacks board clear and thus will always be weak to Aggro Druid/Pally I can assure you that highlander is viable in Wild as a midrange. Reverting Brann won't be the same as a Raza revert.
There's already a deck like this in the past when Elusives were still really prominent. My suggestion would be to cut Parade Electrorig entirely as you're not as dependent on it. Run Suit Up! because it's a pretty good combat trick when you pair it up with Teemo or any other unit.
Shadowshift and Recall is a bit too unplayable imo, at least Shadowshift is. If you want cards to protect your Teemos I suggest just running Deny and NopeifyBADCARDNAME.
If you're having issues surviving, I can suggest running Concussive Palm because it's one of Ionia's best cards but I don't really think you should worry too much about life total when you're already running Tasty Faefolk.
You could also maybe run Lulu if you want your Teemos to get more value from attacking, don't mind trying to level up the Lulu.
Also cut down a bit on Stand United and Dawn and Dusk because getting them early just bricks your hand entirely so I suggest running 1 copy of Stand United only if you still want to run it and 2 Dawn and Dusk instead of 3.
That's about all I can really give my advice for. I suggest that you try out these changes and decide whether or not the card is worth keeping. Also make sure that just because you want to include it, don't make it an instant 3 of. For example, I think if you plan on running Navori Bladescout you can run 2 instead of 3 just so you can hit Teemo more often.
I guess I haven’t been playing much the last few days. But was the Reader nerf really THAT damaging to Token Druid? Yes it is the major draw engine, but that deck can sometimes win off other crazy starts and without the draw, right?
I think having it both be a Hearthstone-original character but excluding the Adventure characters really limited the options for characters. I'd probably prefer having it be updating either any Legendary from wild or any Hearthstone-original character.
Its unfortunate that while I do feel like hearthstone is more or less tugging players towards specific cards that are just too good not to include (like the Aviana-Kun combo, or [Hearthstone Card (bloodreaver guldan) Not Found] who seem to be in every warlock built bar none), good cards are included for good reasons, and that's because they're proven good cards. Who'd craft Ysiel Windsinger when the Aviana-Kun combo is already more efficient, and a readily available substitute in Kael-Thas is free.
This is often a problem inherent with turn-based games. There's always a set of things you can do that's just more efficient than other things. The excitement of the game, at least to me, is not its unpredictability, but precisely the opposite. Its more skill testing to create something to beat something that everyone else is playing.
The only thing that can change the use of 'always include' cards is to nerf/change them, powercreep on the existing cards in future expansions, or just straight up retire cards. But wild, as we know, is about as balanced as a fish flopping up a tightrope and pretty much left on its own, so if you're waiting for the day Aviana-Kun, or any of those 'always include' cards burn in hell you'd better be packing a few extra tons of popcorn.
There is always a chance that the limited wild system gets introduced at some point so maybe we'd have a meta where Aviana and Kun aren't together forever, or you'd have Aviana and Kun but without Ultimate Infestation or Juicy Psychmelon. But ever since duels got introduced I've only the slimmest hope this will be a thing any time soon.
Is "toast cuz its classy" refers to SI:7 Agent (or to rogue class)? And other components also lead to other cards and you need to understand everything to find the answer?
"Cheese since it rare" - refers to its legendary card?
I'm pretty sure, that already other player came up with that idea. It's quite likely, there is already another thread with the exact same thing. Sorry, but I didn't find it.
Here is the idea: We will start our own league of hearthstone. We want to spice things up, because we are tired of grinding.
It's a wild league but with banned cards. Probably around 20 cards, for each class are banned. We are aiming towards the standard decks of those classes. We basically just take the top % of played card of each class in each category.
That's why I have 2 questions: - Do you guys have any experience with something like this? - Does anybody want to join us on our first try. Starting in January next year.
I am looking for advice to make this deck better (more consistent or more resilient would be great)
Also what is a good game plan when *any* combo deck fails to draw the combo pieces...(electrorig + wayfinder in this case)?
The problems I see in this deck is that there is just way too many counters that will kill the win condition on top of actually trying to draw into them.
EDIT: Updated the deck, I realized I can just run elusives as an 'alternate' win con then shrooms just become scaling decimates.
How did everyone like this weeks prompt? Do you like flavor-focused themes? Was this one in particular difficult to design for, maybe because it was harder to determine, whether the character was HS original or not? Or did you actually feel like it was too narrow, since you had to use a HS original character? Just some feedback for us, thanks :)
First off, let me just say good job one more time, great expansion overall! :)
Now to the interview, I kinda overlooked this before when i first saw the set, but how exactly does Resonance work? It says replace, does it mean it removes the top card of your deck an puts a copy of a card you just draw there instead? Because if it was just adding the copy, i would assume the wording would be something along the lines of "Draw a card. Add a copy of it at the top of your deck." If it indeed removes the top card of your deck, doesnt that kinda make the card on itself almost unplayable in most deck? Except for aggro decks who dont care if you "discard" an important combo piece. Not to mention you dont actually know which card you removed, unless the history tab would tell you, which could be another problem.
I find it interesting how few ppl compare Observe to Discover, similar to Rush vs Charge, even going as far as saying it could be a replacement. I can understand where they r coming from, but the only similarity is you look at 3 cards, that is literally it. Those mechanics are diametrically different in what they provide, unless you use Discover in a way to search your deck, in that case they are a lot similar, yes. But i would say that they are not even remotely close in what they actually provide, they do different things, Discover generates extra resources in most cases while Observe lets you search your deck for specific cards you put in there. Huge difference imho.
If i were to pick one card mentioned here, it would have to be King Grond. It makes a really clever use of an underutilized mechanic and im very surprised we havent seen more effects like these in HS custom card community, or maybe I havent.
You can't revert them back? luckily i've read this article before trying it, i don't like cosmetic stuffs on cards
As of this writing it's permanent; however Riot is extremely receptive to community feedback and has said they will probably make the option to disable it in the future.
The issue at the heart of this is that Aviana + Kun isn't the combo so much as a way to circumvent the usual mana cap. Throw Ysiel Windsinger into the mix and you essentially have unlimited mana and your only limitation is what cards are available to druid.
The only ways Aviana + Kun wouldn't be used are:
it is difficult to set them up, and/or
the combo can be done in 10 mana or less naturally (maybe 11 or 12 since Innervate has always been a thing).
Obviously 1 isn't the case, and the game is always balanced around limiting the power of 10 mana combos, so option 2 is never the case either. So Wild combo druid will always gravitate to Aviana + Kun, and you cannot really change that without changing one of those cards or just adding another, easier way to get (effectively) infinite mana.
The decks are made even more similar because all the cards involved in reaching the combo (draw, removal, stall, ramp) are just reused because they have long been optimised. This is true in every class, all of which have their own ways of doing it. And it's not just combo either; I'm so fed up of Warlock in Wild because every non-zoo deck has relied on Voidcallers and Bloodreaver Gul'dan for years.
The only real solution is to play in Standard, where possible.
Yeah i say this for every archetype not just aviana kun, but i lead with that since it's the most well known. The thread is more about how braindead the game has become, even when the game was playing pit fighter on turn 5 you still had to think about that play and what your opponent would do against it.
And it just feels like you didn't read the whole thing, and i should have used your void caller example for control with warlock missed that.
My question after reading this is: Why do you not just play Standard? Basically all the cards mentioned here are wild cards. No Aviana-Kun in Standard. In Wild there a couple of strong cards which will continue to show up. You can't do anything about it.
My question after reading this is: Why do you not just play Standard? Basically all the cards mentioned here are wild cards. No Aviana-Kun in Standard. In Wild there a couple of strong cards which will continue to show up. You can't do anything about it.
It's not HS there will probably be changes to the card next patch.
Also not all midrange decks lose to it,there are some that are good against it.
I do not mean to take away your right of free speech, but I you don't need to voice your hatred towards blizzard at every opportunity. We get it, you don't like blizzard, hearthstone is terrible, you left the game and don't support them anymore. Fine, that's your choice. But you don't have to talk about it all of the time. At this point you just come across as salty.
May we not trashtalk trash in other forums? I think we may and we will :) Just deal with it, its not like you have to read forums about a game you don't play/prefer. Its like complaining about league players who trashtalk dota: let them do their thing its not your bizness, it doesn't need to bother you since haters gonna hate and its not personal against any HS player now is it?
We have our reasons to hate blizzard: for me its still a miracle that a company that made such great titles like WC3 and SCII became such a shithole of a company but hey activision things i guess....
Dunno it feels like an abusive relationship, anyway KANSAS is right, I should move on and not talk about it anymore I uninstalled and I really had a little regret but in the end it's for the better I didn't had fun in HS for a while anyway and trash talking it at any opportunity whatever it won't change blizz and I should not care anymore..
I just want to say, thank you for making a mature response. I genuinely thought that you were going to make some angry post and we would engage in some pointless internet argument. You are a true gentleman.
Ye, it's pointless if you have seen my latest posts there was a lot of salt in them, should I argue that they aren't salty? no, you are right and there's no reason to defend that behavior.
The issue at the heart of this is that Aviana + Kun isn't the combo so much as a way to circumvent the usual mana cap. Throw Ysiel Windsinger into the mix and you essentially have unlimited mana and your only limitation is what cards are available to druid.
The only ways Aviana + Kun wouldn't be used are:
it is difficult to set them up, and/or
the combo can be done in 10 mana or less naturally (maybe 11 or 12 since Innervate has always been a thing).
Obviously 1 isn't the case, and the game is always balanced around limiting the power of 10 mana combos, so option 2 is never the case either. So Wild combo druid will always gravitate to Aviana + Kun, and you cannot really change that without changing one of those cards or just adding another, easier way to get (effectively) infinite mana.
The decks are made even more similar because all the cards involved in reaching the combo (draw, removal, stall, ramp) are just reused because they have long been optimised. This is true in every class, all of which have their own ways of doing it. And it's not just combo either; I'm so fed up of Warlock in Wild because every non-zoo deck has relied on Voidcallers and Bloodreaver Gul'dan for years.
The only real solution is to play in Standard, where possible.
I'm not saying there aren't still creative combos and decks being made. They're just few and farbetween because it's basically why bother.
Why spend the 5 minutes making your own deck when HSreplay says this demon hunter has .1% more winrate than a different deck.
It might just be me being burned out of this game. And second thought it's definitely that. But this game isn't changing in my opinion. You won't see day9's rant about jade druid nowadays. It doesn't happen. I remember when aviana kun was nerfed for bein too consistent with psychmelon, and that did literally nothing to stop it from being the be all end all combo deck for druid. You'll notice if you've seen my combo decks for druid i don't use aviana kun and that's intentional. I shoot myself in the foot by doing it but it's better than winning but feeling like i didn't accomplish anything.
Seeking Off-Meta Hunters! (for standard)
I haven't played as much the last few months and just wanted to hear what off-meta Hunter builds folks have been having (moderate) success with this expansion.
Things I've been exploring so far:
Has anyone had success with these archetypes or anything else off-meta like Highlander Beast Hunter, Corrupt (Y'shaaraj) Hunter, Dragon Hunter, etc.? Thanks in advance!
Runeterra Developers Answer Questions on Discord - 2v2, More PVE Labs, Balance Talk
Yeah, for the most part the answers were just “we’re working on it” or “we’re thinking about it.” It’s nice to hear what their priorities are though, I’m excited for what they decide to do with PvE modes!
Nerf Reverts Next Year? Our Top 5 Card Picks That Blizzard Should Buff Back
Hunter is perfectly fine in Wild if you ever played secret highlander Hunter.
Hunter doesn't need a strong presence is wild like priest, paladin, mage, & warlock
It has enough representation each season in standard.
Hunter lacks board clear and thus will always be weak to Aggro Druid/Pally
I can assure you that highlander is viable in Wild as a midrange.
Reverting Brann won't be the same as a Raza revert.
Teemo deck advice please
There's already a deck like this in the past when Elusives were still really prominent. My suggestion would be to cut Parade Electrorig entirely as you're not as dependent on it. Run Suit Up! because it's a pretty good combat trick when you pair it up with Teemo or any other unit.
Maybe run a bit more 1 drop like Navori Bladescout so your Kinkou Wayfinder is better.
Shadowshift and Recall is a bit too unplayable imo, at least Shadowshift is. If you want cards to protect your Teemos I suggest just running Deny and NopeifyBADCARDNAME.
If you're having issues surviving, I can suggest running Concussive Palm because it's one of Ionia's best cards but I don't really think you should worry too much about life total when you're already running Tasty Faefolk.
You could also maybe run Lulu if you want your Teemos to get more value from attacking, don't mind trying to level up the Lulu.
Also cut down a bit on Stand United and Dawn and Dusk because getting them early just bricks your hand entirely so I suggest running 1 copy of Stand United only if you still want to run it and 2 Dawn and Dusk instead of 3.
That's about all I can really give my advice for. I suggest that you try out these changes and decide whether or not the card is worth keeping. Also make sure that just because you want to include it, don't make it an instant 3 of. For example, I think if you plan on running Navori Bladescout you can run 2 instead of 3 just so you can hit Teemo more often.
Good luck.
Nature Will Rise Against You! Darkmoon Faire Druid Wild Deck Spotlight
I guess I haven’t been playing much the last few days. But was the Reader nerf really THAT damaging to Token Druid? Yes it is the major draw engine, but that deck can sometimes win off other crazy starts and without the draw, right?
Runeterra Developers Answer Questions on Discord - 2v2, More PVE Labs, Balance Talk
Mostly enthusiastic non-answers, but happy to see the devs acknowledging the communities' questions.
Original Character, Do Not Steal - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread
I think having it both be a Hearthstone-original character but excluding the Adventure characters really limited the options for characters. I'd probably prefer having it be updating either any Legendary from wild or any Hearthstone-original character.
Anyone else feel this way?
Its unfortunate that while I do feel like hearthstone is more or less tugging players towards specific cards that are just too good not to include (like the Aviana-Kun combo, or [Hearthstone Card (bloodreaver guldan) Not Found] who seem to be in every warlock built bar none), good cards are included for good reasons, and that's because they're proven good cards. Who'd craft Ysiel Windsinger when the Aviana-Kun combo is already more efficient, and a readily available substitute in Kael-Thas is free.
This is often a problem inherent with turn-based games. There's always a set of things you can do that's just more efficient than other things. The excitement of the game, at least to me, is not its unpredictability, but precisely the opposite. Its more skill testing to create something to beat something that everyone else is playing.
The only thing that can change the use of 'always include' cards is to nerf/change them, powercreep on the existing cards in future expansions, or just straight up retire cards. But wild, as we know, is about as balanced as a fish flopping up a tightrope and pretty much left on its own, so if you're waiting for the day Aviana-Kun, or any of those 'always include' cards burn in hell you'd better be packing a few extra tons of popcorn.
There is always a chance that the limited wild system gets introduced at some point so maybe we'd have a meta where Aviana and Kun aren't together forever, or you'd have Aviana and Kun but without Ultimate Infestation or Juicy Psychmelon. But ever since duels got introduced I've only the slimmest hope this will be a thing any time soon.
Carnival Clown OTK!
No Zephrys the Great?
Original Character, Do Not Steal - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread
I actualy like flavour-themed competitions, but sometimes it may be hard to find appropriate art.
Fan Community Spotlight - Community Built Set, "Liftoff!"
Loving the set, the art is great, the cards are interesting and look fun!
Would love to see this in the game!
[Game] Card Treasure Hunt (The Resurrection Attempt)
Is "toast cuz its classy" refers to SI:7 Agent (or to rogue class)? And other components also lead to other cards and you need to understand everything to find the answer?
"Cheese since it rare" - refers to its legendary card?
Creating our own off meta ladder.
Hey everyone,
I'm pretty sure, that already other player came up with that idea.
It's quite likely, there is already another thread with the exact same thing. Sorry, but I didn't find it.
Here is the idea:
We will start our own league of hearthstone. We want to spice things up, because we are tired of grinding.
It's a wild league but with banned cards. Probably around 20 cards, for each class are banned. We are aiming towards the standard decks of those classes. We basically just take the top % of played card of each class in each category.
That's why I have 2 questions:
- Do you guys have any experience with something like this?
- Does anybody want to join us on our first try. Starting in January next year.
Cheers,
Drcool
You can also contact me in discord:
Johannes#0913
Teemo deck advice please
Hi,
I am looking for advice to make this deck better (more consistent or more resilient would be great)
Also what is a good game plan when *any* combo deck fails to draw the combo pieces...(electrorig + wayfinder in this case)?
The problems I see in this deck is that there is just way too many counters that will kill the win condition on top of actually trying to draw into them.
EDIT: Updated the deck, I realized I can just run elusives as an 'alternate' win con then shrooms just become scaling decimates.
Regardless, some other ideas would be nice.
Original Character, Do Not Steal - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread
How did everyone like this weeks prompt? Do you like flavor-focused themes? Was this one in particular difficult to design for, maybe because it was harder to determine, whether the character was HS original or not? Or did you actually feel like it was too narrow, since you had to use a HS original character? Just some feedback for us, thanks :)
Fan Community Spotlight - Community Built Set, "Liftoff!"
First off, let me just say good job one more time, great expansion overall! :)
Now to the interview, I kinda overlooked this before when i first saw the set, but how exactly does Resonance work? It says replace, does it mean it removes the top card of your deck an puts a copy of a card you just draw there instead? Because if it was just adding the copy, i would assume the wording would be something along the lines of "Draw a card. Add a copy of it at the top of your deck." If it indeed removes the top card of your deck, doesnt that kinda make the card on itself almost unplayable in most deck? Except for aggro decks who dont care if you "discard" an important combo piece. Not to mention you dont actually know which card you removed, unless the history tab would tell you, which could be another problem.
I find it interesting how few ppl compare Observe to Discover, similar to Rush vs Charge, even going as far as saying it could be a replacement. I can understand where they r coming from, but the only similarity is you look at 3 cards, that is literally it. Those mechanics are diametrically different in what they provide, unless you use Discover in a way to search your deck, in that case they are a lot similar, yes. But i would say that they are not even remotely close in what they actually provide, they do different things, Discover generates extra resources in most cases while Observe lets you search your deck for specific cards you put in there. Huge difference imho.
If i were to pick one card mentioned here, it would have to be King Grond. It makes a really clever use of an underutilized mechanic and im very surprised we havent seen more effects like these in HS custom card community, or maybe I havent.
Anyway, looking forward to your next set :)
Everything You Need to Know About Runeterra's Prismatic Cards
As of this writing it's permanent; however Riot is extremely receptive to community feedback and has said they will probably make the option to disable it in the future.
Anyone else feel this way?
Yeah i say this for every archetype not just aviana kun, but i lead with that since it's the most well known. The thread is more about how braindead the game has become, even when the game was playing pit fighter on turn 5 you still had to think about that play and what your opponent would do against it.
And it just feels like you didn't read the whole thing, and i should have used your void caller example for control with warlock missed that.
Anyone else feel this way?
Original Character, Do Not Steal - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread
Good luck to our finalists!
Anyone else feel this way?
My question after reading this is: Why do you not just play Standard? Basically all the cards mentioned here are wild cards. No Aviana-Kun in Standard. In Wild there a couple of strong cards which will continue to show up. You can't do anything about it.
You're Not Alone! Animation Skips in Hearthstone's Battlegrounds is an Issue and Will be Resolved in the Coming Weeks
Still waiting for the option to just skip all animations, these stupid distractions caused me too many losses already
Remove or hard nerf Go Hard
Dunno it feels like an abusive relationship, anyway KANSAS is right, I should move on and not talk about it anymore I uninstalled and I really had a little regret but in the end it's for the better I didn't had fun in HS for a while anyway and trash talking it at any opportunity whatever it won't change blizz and I should not care anymore..
Ye, it's pointless if you have seen my latest posts there was a lot of salt in them, should I argue that they aren't salty? no, you are right and there's no reason to defend that behavior.
Anyway this is quite off topic.
Anyone else feel this way?
The issue at the heart of this is that Aviana + Kun isn't the combo so much as a way to circumvent the usual mana cap. Throw Ysiel Windsinger into the mix and you essentially have unlimited mana and your only limitation is what cards are available to druid.
The only ways Aviana + Kun wouldn't be used are:
Obviously 1 isn't the case, and the game is always balanced around limiting the power of 10 mana combos, so option 2 is never the case either. So Wild combo druid will always gravitate to Aviana + Kun, and you cannot really change that without changing one of those cards or just adding another, easier way to get (effectively) infinite mana.
The decks are made even more similar because all the cards involved in reaching the combo (draw, removal, stall, ramp) are just reused because they have long been optimised. This is true in every class, all of which have their own ways of doing it. And it's not just combo either; I'm so fed up of Warlock in Wild because every non-zoo deck has relied on Voidcallers and Bloodreaver Gul'dan for years.
The only real solution is to play in Standard, where possible.
Anyone else feel this way?
I'm not saying there aren't still creative combos and decks being made. They're just few and farbetween because it's basically why bother.
Why spend the 5 minutes making your own deck when HSreplay says this demon hunter has .1% more winrate than a different deck.
It might just be me being burned out of this game. And second thought it's definitely that. But this game isn't changing in my opinion. You won't see day9's rant about jade druid nowadays. It doesn't happen. I remember when aviana kun was nerfed for bein too consistent with psychmelon, and that did literally nothing to stop it from being the be all end all combo deck for druid. You'll notice if you've seen my combo decks for druid i don't use aviana kun and that's intentional. I shoot myself in the foot by doing it but it's better than winning but feeling like i didn't accomplish anything.