Feedback on the gameplay/balance

After playing different card games for years, i am here to give you my take on LOR.

The snowball in this game is HUGE, you need to let players draw 2 cards each round, there are too many cards in your deck and if you don't happen to have a specific card/answer(usually a spell) in your hand the game can end in just 1 turn due to the sire amount of power each card holds.

Things only get worse with how overpowered spells are, it's actually the only way to force a kill on an opponet's unit("challenger" ain't reliable) making them frustrating and underwhelming to play against.
You can lose the entire game due to a single spell, a complete 100% turn around.


Ideas to fix this:

1) Up the nexus HP to 25 or even 30, making the game a bit slower and letting us take 1-2 more attacks reducing the need of answers to be so asap.

2) To compensate for the HP buff, let us draw 2 cards per turn resetting the game's paste and giving back aggro the power it lost from the higher HP. +what i have told above.

3) Let every region use "deny", indirectly nerfing all spells a little bit.

I am extremely open to discussion, especially from a competitive view, cause i am only talking about casual playing.

My English ain't that sharp, sorry for any mistakes i made.

- There's some validity to your point on deck size - decks are substantially larger (proportionally) than similar card games for the relative health totals. Magic is a poor comparator given its continued reliance on the Lands mechanic. However, simply drawing 2 cards per turn is a short-sighted and unsustainable way of resolving it. I suspect the issue will slowly resolve itself as more cards are released - the problem is really around reliability, and that becomes less of an issue when there are more cards around which can fit into a given situation more comfortably.

- Spells really aren't particularly overpowered, particularly as they tend towards being 'all in' plays to have any significant impact - using up all your mana for the turn to have a short-term impact. Removal, meanwhile, is removal - the point you make here could be made for pretty much every other card game in existence. That's kind of their point - minions are for longer-term benefit-over-time, while spells are for a short-term swing.

- Nexus health - that's something that's been batted around a few times in different places. I felt the same way when I first started playing, but I'm less sold on it now. That said, I can't honestly say whether that's a change in my viewpoint over time or simply me getting used to it.

- Card draw - already covered above.

- Deny - Giving access to a single card to all regions would be creating a massive exception to the entire game design for the sake of a single effect. There is potential to give similar effects to other regions, but I'm sceptical that they'd do that as a blanket move. What's more likely is they'll nerf Deny, which is something they've already said is under consideration. While I heavily disagree with the idea of spreading Deny around more widely, I also do feel that it's a game-warping effect; Deny existing heavily disincentivizes any deck from running high-cost spells, while also contributing to the ridiculous presence Ionia has in the upper tiers right now (though I will note that Elusive is far more a culprit in that regard).

I don't agree with your assessment of the game, I think there are enough answers and there is a lot of skill in mulliganing for, deckbuilding and outplaying your opponent in a manner you will get a favorable board state.

1. HP in the game- I thought it was too little but actually it it's fine since you can almost always block it compared to games like hearthstone you need a special keyword to block face damage, that makes nexus damage much more valuable I am ok with the game being balanced around 20 hp, as long as you generally don't die by turn 4, in the state of the game by how powerful the late game options are making the hp pool larger would skew the game toward a heavy control meta.

2. hell no, drawing more cards is not good for the game, you can't spend them and you will constantly overdraw with any none aggro deck, besides you would fatigue faster (in this game fatigue= instant lose) and Teemodecks will be so much oppressive (they are not that much but they would be).

3. No, just nerf deny.. even to 5 mana is not an exaggeration the card is too good at 3 mana.

What they do need to fix balance wise:

Back to Back from burst to fast

Elusive needs either to be separated into 1 turn elusive and permanent elusive(like camouflage vs stealth in league) , or all elusive followers (not champions, Teemo and Ezreal are fine) need a nerf across the board.

Braum instantly wins any early game, he needs to be bumped to 4 mana OR reduce his health to 4 (and requirement to 8). a single buff on him and he is a monster.

Dawnspeakers to 3 health from 4.

that 1/1 last breath for 4/4 gives a 3/3 instead.

Fiora is too good standalone just slapped into decks as a 3/3 challenger which might win you the game alone, sometimes also is a removal bait, I would suggest making her level up at 3 kills, and the win at 1 kill that way she is easier to deal with, that wouldn't make her feel bad but make her less able to win without support.

Buff Poro Snax to 3 cause poros are cool but under powered :( (specially after the fluff nerf)

That being said I think only the elusive problem need to be addressed ASAP, too many elusive followers are toxic for the game specially when they are permanently elusive.

Quote From DoubleSummon

I don't agree with your assessment of the game, I think there are enough answers and there is a lot of skill in mulliganing for, deckbuilding and outplaying your opponent in a manner you will get a favorable board state.

1. HP in the game- I thought it was too little but actually it it's fine since you can almost always block it compared to games like hearthstone you need a special keyword to block face damage, that makes nexus damage much more valuable I am ok with the game being balanced around 20 hp, as long as you generally don't die by turn 4, in the state of the game by how powerful the late game options are making the hp pool larger would skew the game toward a heavy control meta.

2. hell no, drawing more cards is not good for the game, you can't spend them and you will constantly overdraw with any none aggro deck, besides you would fatigue faster (in this game fatigue= instant lose) and Teemodecks will be so much oppressive (they are not that much but they would be).

3. No, just nerf deny.. even to 5 mana is not an exaggeration the card is too good at 3 mana.

What they do need to fix balance wise:

Back to Back from burst to fast

Elusive needs either to be separated into 1 turn elusive and permanent elusive(like camouflage vs stealth in league) , or all elusive followers (not champions, Teemo and Ezreal are fine) need a nerf across the board.

Braum instantly wins any early game, he needs to be bumped to 4 mana OR reduce his health to 4 (and requirement to 8). a single buff on him and he is a monster.

Dawnspeakers to 3 health from 4.

that 1/1 last breath for 4/4 gives a 3/3 instead.

Fiora is too good standalone just slapped into decks as a 3/3 challenger which might win you the game alone, sometimes also is a removal bait, I would suggest making her level up at 3 kills, and the win at 1 kill that way she is easier to deal with, that wouldn't make her feel bad but make her less able to win without support.

Buff Poro Snax to 3 cause poros are cool but under powered :( (specially after the fluff nerf)

That being said I think only the elusive problem need to be addressed ASAP, too many elusive followers are toxic for the game specially when they are permanently elusive.

 

 

Agree with elusives. I mean its simply a face deck. Also 5 out of my 10 games are braum/zed elusive deck which is so frustrating. I mean, ok I can play around and win against them but why the fuck i have to play same deck over and over again. If i like that, i could continue to play hearthstone.

I have to be honest, this is one of the only card games I have played where I feel like my deck - even on so-so draws - has a fighting chance each game, and that I am able to execute my strategy. Once I had the right spell ratios to units to take advantage of spell mana in reserve properly, I honestly felt like the game was less curvy and less draw dependent. I actually feel like I can recover if I don't play on curve in this game.

I'll take this over getting land-flooded or land-screwed and getting punished if I can't play on curve any day.

If you honestly believe spells are too powerful, that only means you are not using enough of them. Everyone has access to them, after all. If you choose not to use them for some reason, it's time to re-examine your deckbuilding priorities.

Nexus health is perfect at 20. Games do not need to be longer than they are.

All regions do not need Deny. Every region has ways to achieve a similar result, even though it may not be as bluntly stated as "stop an effect."

If you feel like you are not drawing enough cards, you need to account for that in your own deckbuilding, not by changing the rules of the game. There are plenty of ways to draw more cards; it's not the game's fault if you can't be bothered to use them.

I think you're raising some interesting points, but I'm mostly in disagreement.

First and foremost, I strongly disagree about spells being too strong in Legends of Runeterra. I'm not an expert, but I have played a number of TCGs in the past to a decent extent, and I honestly find most spells in this game comparatively weak relative to their mana cost. For instance, for 2 mana, I could quick-snipe an enemy for 2 damage - or I could play a 3/1 minion with Quick Attack. I'd argue the latter is a stronger option overall. For 7 mana, I could play Trueshot Barrage for a total of 6 damage - or I could play a freaking 7/5 follower that insta-kills two enemies upon entering play (with a minor requirement that's easy to fulfill for Shadow Isles decks). Those are just 2 examples, but I find that this trend holds true for most spell cards in the game.

Like most other posters in this thread, I was initially put off by the seemingly low 20 nexus health. But having played the game for a good 15 hours or so at this point, I don't think that's quite right. Yes, aggro decks can score some easy wins after just a couple of rounds, but many higher-cost cards provide insane (often permanent) benefits which aggro players simply can't keep up with. So yeah, the game is rather snowbally, but it goes both ways: You can quickly win with an aggressive deck, or you can quickly win after playing just 1 or 2 high-impact cards in the mid-late game, provided you manage to survive until then. I'm not sure 20 health is the perfect amount, but I don't see a pressing need to increase it drastically.

I think opening up the Deny effect to all regions would be a bad move. I'd rather preserve the thematic identities of the individual regions for as long as possible (I'm sure there will be more and more overlap as new cards are released). I can't argue that it's an extremely powerful card in its current state, although it's not nearly as ridiculous as Counterspells in Magic which are even cheaper and able to deny creatures, too. I think upping the cost to 4 and seeing how it goes from there would be a sensible move.