This works brilliantly. I think the deathrattle proc'ed about 60 times times in a single game - seemed like it would go on forever, but it did eventually resolve rather than break the game with an infinite battlecry.
EDIT: I should mention that I tried this twos ways - killing the Kobold Illusionist before dropping Spammy Arcanist (to spawn 1/1s that Spammy would kill for sure), and setting up the board to have the battlecry kill the original Kobold Illusionist (by ensuring there was a 1-Health and 2-Health minion on board to chain into the Illusionist). The former didn't work (which surprised me, since the chaining works fine otherwise), but the latter did twice. So, there's some amount of setup required to get Spammy to kill a played version of the Illusionist, but it worked like a charm otherwise.
Killing Kenin is easy. Drag the Kenin with a challenger wait for the necessary bounce counter with board interaction, aka single, vile or mystic.
So the key is that you are responding when Kenin comes down on turn 4 every kenin deck functions this way and knowing when a play is guaranteed to happen is very powerful.
Why is it guaranteed? Because you developed threats and youre pressuring life total.
Now you're running meta decks, they don't have challengers, or vulnerable, or board interaction besides pokey stick and thats it. So yeah you're gonna get pooped on by a combo deck that just stuns and plays solitaire with itself when really the best best way to stop that from happening is throwing the table.
But yeah waiting till turn 5 for a sweeper is pretty much guaranteed to loose if that's what we are talking about lol, you have to answer things on curve with kenin and then if that fails try the sweeper thing after taxing their answers.
------- Bonus-------
You want a real mind **** the best Kenin card is the Lee Sin challenger granter because it's let's Kenin beat other Kenin decks. That's all the proof I need that board interaction is the best counter to everyone's favorite combo deck.
-----Extra Bonus----
The best pantheon deck has gone up 2% on mobalytics just by hard teching challenger dragon. Honestly I probably wouldn't stop there there's an argument for laurent protégé as well.
okay so you are trying to take your chance to kill the lvl 1 Kennens with a Yasuo on curve on turn 5?
Good luck at succeeding with that buddy and not get denied/recalled
I am really not buying this card since it will rarely hits more than 2 units. You rather invoke a 3 mana stun 2 units than using this card that is niche at best
like name a 1 tier deck right now that cares about the 2 power or less clause
This is Boltzmann's take on Freeze Shudderwock Shaman. This deck performs very well against Pirate Warrior. In this video, we go into some depth, on the structure of the deck and justifications for different card inclusions. If you have questions, please post them below, and I am sure Boltzmann will respond.
Game clip:
0:16 Stress relief against Pirate Warrior :-)
Deck introduction and breakdown:
3:15 Introduction to Boltzmann's Freeze Shudderwock Shaman, compared to EnDjinn's Freeze Shudderwock Shaman (from yesterday's video) 5:10 The origins of the Boltzmann Freeze Shudderwock Shaman deck 6:30 Card justifications - Healing Rain vs Snowblind Harpy 7:10 Card justifications - Armor Vendor 8:02 Shudderwock / Freeze logic 8:33 Card justifications - Loatheb / Snowfall Guardian / Macaw 9:21 Card justifications - Windchill / Bolner / Sleetbreaker / Zentimo 10:00 Final thoughts on the deck
Games:
10:38 vs Odd Hunter 20:28 vs Pirate Warrior
Closing thoughts:
24:39 Final impressions on the deck 26:20 - 28:32 For Doomhammer Discord Server
In fairness, that's a reasonable way to assess fun for a lot of individuals. Frankly, I think it's a pretty concise description of the Johnny/Jenny player archetype (and dips a bit into the Timmy/Tammy archetype as well). It's also understandably frustrating to feel like a lone Johnny/Jenny in a sea of Spikes.
The Chillwind Yeti bug makes it pretty clear that little to no manual testing goes into these achievements. I can imagine some poorly written unit tests that might exist and make it look like the code works as intended, but clearly no one ever bothered to try and do this achievement in Standard because you literally can't get the right version of Yeti in Standard.
Regarding Bless, I've got a new wrinkle to add here. After reading all of this I thought I might test a hypothesis, so I played my first Bless Priest game (which happened to be in Wild). I thought maybe there was some bug resulting in bad integer division (e.g. if it were dividing by 5, let's say, then any buff lower than 5 Attack would count as 0, anything between 5 and 9 would count as 1, etc.). That sort of thing might account for why a huge buff was only counted as 6 points.
However, my achievement worked exactly as it should have with the following plays: Kabal Talonpriest buff applied to a Northshire Cleric (both played in the same turn), then 2x Divine Spirit into Bless on the subsequent turn for a 26/26 Cleric. My achievement is now at 25/200.
EDIT: My second attempt with the same deck resulted in a gain of 0 despite buffing a Kabal Talonpriest to 11/11. I don't recall exactly what buffs I put on him when, but he got at least one Talonpriest buff and the Bless buff (and maybe a Focused Will buff?), and was not at full health when I cast Bless on him. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
I still don't understand how the concept of "undisenchantable" exists. I personally consider it a shame, an insult to our freedom to manage our resources however we want.
My suggestions:
- There are no longer undisenchantable cards, nor normal nor golden, so we can disenchant and create any card as we want and whenever we want, whatever its origin (except for diamond or uncraftable cards).
- From now on, any golden card (as those given away "for free") will be considered as a “wildcard card”, since we can disenchant it and obtain the exact amount of arcane dust to make a normal card of the same rarity of our choice, or if you are a collector of golden cards, you can keep them for cosmetic reasons, saving the arcane dust it would cost you to make them (twice that for a normal one).
- All the cards that we get from any source other than obtaining them when opening a pack (rewards track, arena, duels, end-of-month rewards, events, etc.) will be golden cards, that is, mere wildcards for any card in the game of the same rarity that we want/need to craft (or raw arcane dust to invest in crafting cards of other rarities that we do not yet have).
All the uncraftable rewards really bother me. I know it's just freebies and I shouldn't complain about stuff they give out for free. For me, though, I've never cared about cosmetics: I've always just disenchanted every golden card I get (unless I don't have a normal copy). I have come to view golden cards (as well as any copies in excess of 2) as free dust I can use to craft cards I want. Now they keep giving me cards (both normal and golden) that I cannot disenchant, so it FEELS bad to me to have these cards I don't use and can't turn into real value. It means that my progress on the Rewards Track gives me less than other players who like golden cards. I wish we had more freedom to choose what rewards we get.
Afterwards I checked my achievement and found....6 points of progress. So what happened? Obviously it counted something but clearly not anything involving Divine Spirit. It also can't be any of the regular health buffs since Will gives +3 health which would have left me with an odd number of progress. It similarly can't just be the buff applied by Bless itself because that would just be 4 points of progress.
Does anybody have ideas what is happening here and how to properly exploit it?
Beats me. Tried it multiple times without any ticks and I just gave up and call it a bug, one of numerous bugs currently existing.
Casted bless on Northshire Cleric and got nothing. Casted it after a health buff, also nothing. Then casted it on opponent's minion for 1 additional attack, still nothing. At this point it might be that the achievement is either bugged, or it requires very specific cards/conditions for it to register at all. The fact that you got 6 ticks is amazing, but I cant replicate it (though I didn't use it on Dirty Rat, but that's taking loads of piss if that's the trigger)
Played on wild. I shudder to think if this will only works in standard.
Afterwards I checked my achievement and found....6 points of progress. So what happened? Obviously it counted something but clearly not anything involving Divine Spirit. It also can't be any of the regular health buffs since Will gives +3 health which would have left me with an odd number of progress. It similarly can't just be the buff applied by Bless itself because that would just be 4 points of progress.
Does anybody have ideas what is happening here and how to properly exploit it?
I got the Hollow Abomination one yesterday when I used the Battlecry to kill an enemy's Bloodmage Thalnos. No issues on my end for that one.
I can now confirm that killing an opposing Thalnos does indeed give the achievement which strenghtens the theory that it does indeed need to kill a legendary minion from full health to count for the achievement. While this is certainly a bug it can at least be worked around for now.
Fun is relative obviously. If you mean why meme decks can't succeed as well as the competitive decks, then its fairly obvious by our own labeling. Meme decks are supposed to be niche. If its competitive then it'll be part of the meta and ceases to be a niche.
If you like a certain horse, that's nice. But if it can't run then there's no point of racing it, lose, and then start complaining about how other horses race better.
From my own experience, burgle rogue plays fine. Its just very inconsistent because there's plenty of holes in that deck, not to mention that its basically at the mercy of what you discover or get off generation. Best list in my opinion is full on disruption, with 2x Savory Deviate Delight, 2x Parrrley and Vanessa VanCleef with plenty of hope of getting your opponent's win con along the way. Plenty of laughs, just dont expect to climb up high in the rankings.
Oh, and Cera'thine Fleetrunner is bait. If you're playing a list with this card, well, then there's not much else to say really.
If "fun" stuff would be buffed to the point of being competitive with current meta decks, then those "fun" decks will be similarly complained about, thus removing their "fun" aspect.
Why do they even bother to release these fun cards if they aren't going to be competitive??? I started playing back in Meanstreets and it's always been the same problem: they release some very clever and enjoyable cards but rarely and never very successfully give them a buff or support when they fall short
My eyes lit up when I found out neo burgle Rogue was actually decent... Well that was until the experimenting phase ended. Now I'm running into the same libram pals, quest mages and locks and etc ( YOu SOULESs ROBOTs Do Us A FAVOr ANd UNINSTALl YOURSELVEs).
But I really can't blame them. Nobody likes losing multiple times in a row with a horse that can't quite race. But what if it's the horse you love?
Why the crap haven't they learned over these years to just buff what ppl want to play. They A. Have the data. And B. They should have a responsibility to back up these cards they release and ppl look forward to.
If you are a developer and have all cards on your account for free it is understandable, that you do not feel the real value of legendary (1 in every 20 packs means like big value) and the really bad feel gettng one you *know* you will get duplicate later and instead missing out others.
Alterac Valley Achievements
This works brilliantly. I think the deathrattle proc'ed about 60 times times in a single game - seemed like it would go on forever, but it did eventually resolve rather than break the game with an infinite battlecry.
EDIT: I should mention that I tried this twos ways - killing the Kobold Illusionist before dropping Spammy Arcanist (to spawn 1/1s that Spammy would kill for sure), and setting up the board to have the battlecry kill the original Kobold Illusionist (by ensuring there was a 1-Health and 2-Health minion on board to chain into the Illusionist). The former didn't work (which surprised me, since the chaining works fine otherwise), but the latter did twice. So, there's some amount of setup required to get Spammy to kill a played version of the Illusionist, but it worked like a charm otherwise.
Every meta. Why?
It is very often you make a thread, people disagree with you, and you start to insult people. Why do you do this?
New Meta Overview Bandlewood Part 2
Killing Kenin is easy. Drag the Kenin with a challenger wait for the necessary bounce counter with board interaction, aka single, vile or mystic.
So the key is that you are responding when Kenin comes down on turn 4 every kenin deck functions this way and knowing when a play is guaranteed to happen is very powerful.
Why is it guaranteed? Because you developed threats and youre pressuring life total.
Now you're running meta decks, they don't have challengers, or vulnerable, or board interaction besides pokey stick and thats it. So yeah you're gonna get pooped on by a combo deck that just stuns and plays solitaire with itself when really the best best way to stop that from happening is throwing the table.
But yeah waiting till turn 5 for a sweeper is pretty much guaranteed to loose if that's what we are talking about lol, you have to answer things on curve with kenin and then if that fails try the sweeper thing after taxing their answers.
------- Bonus-------
You want a real mind **** the best Kenin card is the Lee Sin challenger granter because it's let's Kenin beat other Kenin decks. That's all the proof I need that board interaction is the best counter to everyone's favorite combo deck.
-----Extra Bonus----
The best pantheon deck has gone up 2% on mobalytics just by hard teching challenger dragon. Honestly I probably wouldn't stop there there's an argument for laurent protégé as well.
New Meta Overview Bandlewood Part 2
okay so you are trying to take your chance to kill the lvl 1 Kennens with a Yasuo on curve on turn 5?
Good luck at succeeding with that buddy and not get denied/recalled
I am really not buying this card since it will rarely hits more than 2 units. You rather invoke a 3 mana stun 2 units than using this card that is niche at best
like name a 1 tier deck right now that cares about the 2 power or less clause
Darkseeker's channel - 13th November update: KOtsosKOtsos' Reno Evolve Shudderwock Shaman - ft. Archivist Elysiana
12th December update: Boltzmann's Freeze Shudderwock Shaman: Board locking Pirate Warriors!
This is Boltzmann's take on Freeze Shudderwock Shaman. This deck performs very well against Pirate Warrior. In this video, we go into some depth, on the structure of the deck and justifications for different card inclusions.
If you have questions, please post them below, and I am sure Boltzmann will respond.
Game clip:
0:16 Stress relief against Pirate Warrior :-)
Deck introduction and breakdown:
3:15 Introduction to Boltzmann's Freeze Shudderwock Shaman, compared to EnDjinn's Freeze Shudderwock Shaman (from yesterday's video)
5:10 The origins of the Boltzmann Freeze Shudderwock Shaman deck
6:30 Card justifications - Healing Rain vs Snowblind Harpy
7:10 Card justifications - Armor Vendor
8:02 Shudderwock / Freeze logic
8:33 Card justifications - Loatheb / Snowfall Guardian / Macaw
9:21 Card justifications - Windchill / Bolner / Sleetbreaker / Zentimo
10:00 Final thoughts on the deck
Games:
10:38 vs Odd Hunter
20:28 vs Pirate Warrior
Closing thoughts:
24:39 Final impressions on the deck
26:20 - 28:32 For Doomhammer Discord Server
Deck code: AAEBAaoICvoOl8cCi84Cw+oC7/cCy4UDtZgDqO4DhvoDi58ECt/EApvLAvPnAovVA5LkA+PuA9OABLmRBJWSBNySBAA=
For Doomhammer Discord Server:
https://discord.gg/nU2bkEV
https://youtu.be/ba7PAPi-uy0
Every meta. Why?
In fairness, that's a reasonable way to assess fun for a lot of individuals. Frankly, I think it's a pretty concise description of the Johnny/Jenny player archetype (and dips a bit into the Timmy/Tammy archetype as well). It's also understandably frustrating to feel like a lone Johnny/Jenny in a sea of Spikes.
Every meta. Why?
I'm saying that if new archetypes are introduced they shouldn't just be abandoned with a shrug.
Sadly this concept is a little too advanced for you guys. Have fun playing your brainless robot decks I guess
New Meta Overview Bandlewood Part 2
Event Horizon?
Alterac Valley Achievements
with this deck you will do it the rogue one in 2 games also counts for the Spammy Arcanist one
AAEBAd75AwLZ4wKljQQOzQO9BPW7At/jAvDmAsfOA+LdA+fdA6vrA/7uA6H0A5GfBPefBPylBAA=
Alterac Valley Achievements
The Chillwind Yeti bug makes it pretty clear that little to no manual testing goes into these achievements. I can imagine some poorly written unit tests that might exist and make it look like the code works as intended, but clearly no one ever bothered to try and do this achievement in Standard because you literally can't get the right version of Yeti in Standard.
Regarding Bless, I've got a new wrinkle to add here. After reading all of this I thought I might test a hypothesis, so I played my first Bless Priest game (which happened to be in Wild). I thought maybe there was some bug resulting in bad integer division (e.g. if it were dividing by 5, let's say, then any buff lower than 5 Attack would count as 0, anything between 5 and 9 would count as 1, etc.). That sort of thing might account for why a huge buff was only counted as 6 points.
However, my achievement worked exactly as it should have with the following plays: Kabal Talonpriest buff applied to a Northshire Cleric (both played in the same turn), then 2x Divine Spirit into Bless on the subsequent turn for a 26/26 Cleric. My achievement is now at 25/200.
EDIT: My second attempt with the same deck resulted in a gain of 0 despite buffing a Kabal Talonpriest to 11/11. I don't recall exactly what buffs I put on him when, but he got at least one Talonpriest buff and the Bless buff (and maybe a Focused Will buff?), and was not at full health when I cast Bless on him. ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
EDIT: Third attempt, buffed Reliquary of Souls (at full HP) with Divine Spirit and Bless, made no progress...
Every meta. Why?
I don't understand how you can be this delusional.
"I should be able to win with any deck I choose. If a deck that I didn't choose wins that must mean the meta is wrong."
Are you actually a real person or are you just an algorithm trying to come up with the most outlandish takes on every matter?
BUt hey, let#s just take your advice and buff the cards people want to play, surely nothing can go wrong there, right?
Right?
RIGHT?
Group Therapy! Need to blow off some steam? Mega salty? Here's the place!
Spoiler: the game is not "fun and interactive" anymore if your opponent playing Irondeep Trogg on turn 1 makes you concede instantly.
Celestalon Shares the Hearthstone Team's Thoughts on Drek'Thar and Vanndar Stormpike as Free Golden Card Rewards
I still don't understand how the concept of "undisenchantable" exists. I personally consider it a shame, an insult to our freedom to manage our resources however we want.
My suggestions:
- There are no longer undisenchantable cards, nor normal nor golden, so we can disenchant and create any card as we want and whenever we want, whatever its origin (except for diamond or uncraftable cards).
- From now on, any golden card (as those given away "for free") will be considered as a “wildcard card”, since we can disenchant it and obtain the exact amount of arcane dust to make a normal card of the same rarity of our choice, or if you are a collector of golden cards, you can keep them for cosmetic reasons, saving the arcane dust it would cost you to make them (twice that for a normal one).
- All the cards that we get from any source other than obtaining them when opening a pack (rewards track, arena, duels, end-of-month rewards, events, etc.) will be golden cards, that is, mere wildcards for any card in the game of the same rarity that we want/need to craft (or raw arcane dust to invest in crafting cards of other rarities that we do not yet have).
Celestalon Shares the Hearthstone Team's Thoughts on Drek'Thar and Vanndar Stormpike as Free Golden Card Rewards
All the uncraftable rewards really bother me. I know it's just freebies and I shouldn't complain about stuff they give out for free. For me, though, I've never cared about cosmetics: I've always just disenchanted every golden card I get (unless I don't have a normal copy). I have come to view golden cards (as well as any copies in excess of 2) as free dust I can use to craft cards I want. Now they keep giving me cards (both normal and golden) that I cannot disenchant, so it FEELS bad to me to have these cards I don't use and can't turn into real value. It means that my progress on the Rewards Track gives me less than other players who like golden cards. I wish we had more freedom to choose what rewards we get.
Alterac Valley Achievements
Beats me. Tried it multiple times without any ticks and I just gave up and call it a bug, one of numerous bugs currently existing.
Casted bless on Northshire Cleric and got nothing. Casted it after a health buff, also nothing. Then casted it on opponent's minion for 1 additional attack, still nothing. At this point it might be that the achievement is either bugged, or it requires very specific cards/conditions for it to register at all. The fact that you got 6 ticks is amazing, but I cant replicate it (though I didn't use it on Dirty Rat, but that's taking loads of piss if that's the trigger)
Played on wild. I shudder to think if this will only works in standard.
Alterac Valley Achievements
By the way guys I have found quite the...interesting development for the Bless achievement.
So after multiple games of it not working for no particular reason I just finished a game where I buffed a Dirty Rat with (in that order) Focused Will, Power Word: Shield, Divine Spirit, Divine Spirit, Bless, Bless.
Afterwards I checked my achievement and found....6 points of progress. So what happened? Obviously it counted something but clearly not anything involving Divine Spirit. It also can't be any of the regular health buffs since Will gives +3 health which would have left me with an odd number of progress. It similarly can't just be the buff applied by Bless itself because that would just be 4 points of progress.
Does anybody have ideas what is happening here and how to properly exploit it?
Alterac Valley Achievements
I can now confirm that killing an opposing Thalnos does indeed give the achievement which strenghtens the theory that it does indeed need to kill a legendary minion from full health to count for the achievement. While this is certainly a bug it can at least be worked around for now.
Every meta. Why?
Hey, look. It's two people that responded that totally don't get it.
Games are supposed to be fun and when you invest time/$/resources into finding a deck you enjoy playing you should be able to win with it.
Oh, wait I forgot. I'm the only one in the world that thinks constructed is a joke right now. My ideas must not matter because it's obviously perfect.
Guys, when someone makes a post you don't have to just automatically disagree with it before thinking.
Every meta. Why?
"Fun is when I win with the cards I choose."
-this guy
Every meta. Why?
Fun is relative obviously. If you mean why meme decks can't succeed as well as the competitive decks, then its fairly obvious by our own labeling. Meme decks are supposed to be niche. If its competitive then it'll be part of the meta and ceases to be a niche.
If you like a certain horse, that's nice. But if it can't run then there's no point of racing it, lose, and then start complaining about how other horses race better.
From my own experience, burgle rogue plays fine. Its just very inconsistent because there's plenty of holes in that deck, not to mention that its basically at the mercy of what you discover or get off generation. Best list in my opinion is full on disruption, with 2x Savory Deviate Delight, 2x Parrrley and Vanessa VanCleef with plenty of hope of getting your opponent's win con along the way. Plenty of laughs, just dont expect to climb up high in the rankings.
Oh, and Cera'thine Fleetrunner is bait. If you're playing a list with this card, well, then there's not much else to say really.
Every meta. Why?
If "fun" stuff would be buffed to the point of being competitive with current meta decks, then those "fun" decks will be similarly complained about, thus removing their "fun" aspect.
Every meta. Why?
Why do they even bother to release these fun cards if they aren't going to be competitive??? I started playing back in Meanstreets and it's always been the same problem: they release some very clever and enjoyable cards but rarely and never very successfully give them a buff or support when they fall short
My eyes lit up when I found out neo burgle Rogue was actually decent... Well that was until the experimenting phase ended. Now I'm running into the same libram pals, quest mages and locks and etc ( YOu SOULESs ROBOTs Do Us A FAVOr ANd UNINSTALl YOURSELVEs).
But I really can't blame them. Nobody likes losing multiple times in a row with a horse that can't quite race. But what if it's the horse you love?
Why the crap haven't they learned over these years to just buff what ppl want to play. They A. Have the data. And B. They should have a responsibility to back up these cards they release and ppl look forward to.
Celestalon Shares the Hearthstone Team's Thoughts on Drek'Thar and Vanndar Stormpike as Free Golden Card Rewards
If you are a developer and have all cards on your account for free it is understandable, that you do not feel the real value of legendary (1 in every 20 packs means like big value) and the really bad feel gettng one you *know* you will get duplicate later and instead missing out others.
Celestalon Shares the Hearthstone Team's Thoughts on Drek'Thar and Vanndar Stormpike as Free Golden Card Rewards
Just… don’t put them in the card pack pool? Like what? Just pull a C’thun/Galakrond for future players and give them to you when you open the pac
Jade Shaman
Portrait: Jade Serpent Thrall
Cardback: Jade Lotus