Took some time to come up with a new card, here's what I've got. Ties into Brightwing's Legendary effects while serving as a potential combo piece.
More feedback:
Show Spoiler
Anchorm4n: Go with the second version, it's more clear and still fits in the box. I like the new angle for the card.
Alfi: Ridiculously overpowered currently. Switch to Rush, lower the base stats, and / or change the mana requirement.
Lundy: Maybe make it say "replace your hero power with [insert name here]", and include a token with a new hero power with the original text plus the spell damage. I still prefer the first version you showed, but this one does have more connections to the original Thalnos.
Adding on to your last point, I'm starting to feel that at some point Blizzard should pull the trigger and turn Battlegrounds and/or Mercenary mode or whatever future game mode nto their own apps. Keep the interconnectivity with levels and gold and what not, but honestly why aren't these separate games?
This is not exactly news. Azir/Irelia always had bad match ups against aggro who themselves have bad match ups against Tresh/Nasus and Trundle/Lissandra control, hence why so many pro player describe the current meta as "coin flip".
Exactly. There's a VERY good reason that aggro has such a low playrate in Diamond and Masters - aggro has always been very easy to counter. Specifically, both Nasus/Thresh and Demacia/Targon (aka Dragons), and even Matron Cithria, have no problems kicking its teeth in, whatever flavor the aggro happens to be.
And seriously, there must be a lot of bad Azir/Irelia players out there to make it look like aggro is so favored against it. My Azir/Irelia opponents are either much more skilled or much more lucky than average, because my aggro decks do not get that kind of winrate against them.
Mercenaries was suppose to come out sometime this expansion, according to the road map. Unless they have came out and said that they're pushing it back for the third expansion, don't believe what Zeddy has said.
This is not exactly news. Azir/Irelia always had bad match ups against aggro who themselves have bad match ups against Tresh/Nasus and Trundle/Lissandra control, hence why so many pro player describe the current meta as "coin flip".
Changed Thalnos to be more in line with his Classic counterpart. Like the OG, Thalnos gives Card Draw and Spell Damage. Not sure if I worded the card correctly to get what I wanted to convey across. Actually hope I can word this differently, as I had to space out the words so that they could fit the card frame. Honestly, I think this is trash and wouldn't vote for it. Going to go for something new and hope for the best lol
Feedback:
anchorm4n
As others have said, I like the new effect of your card, as well as the wording of the 2nd example you posted. I feel the card isn't as good as the original due to having the restriction and not being able to somewhat target what you want, though I suppose the randomness is in line with OG Sylvanas. Nice work!
Alfi
Having a no 8-Cost restriction doesn't work well in this comp, as there isn't much competing for that spot anyways. However, due to having to have a steep restriction of no X-Cost cards, it allows you to go cheaper and keep the big effects that you want.
in 3 weeks, 8 July (Riot patchs all their games every 2 weeks on Tuesday nights ) we will be getting a big patch hopefully shifting the meta alongside new cards too..
Sadly they don't have that big of a team on the game yet (like in league) so they can't do as much as they did before while keeping up the content.
Also on the bright side according to this post:
it loses BADLY to aggro.
I dunno I don't play ladder much I am enjoying the new labs content :D
Thalnos the Soulrender has a nice effect, even if it's a bit too unrelated to the original card for my taste. Besides that, nice card.
Me0203
I feel like all your cards are a bit too crazy, but I'd say I prefer Millhouse, Surge Protector. Most people liked Greenskin, but giving your weapon +6/+6 feels like way too much, even if it is susceptible to weapon removal.
anchorm4n
Banshee Queen, feel the beat of the living's scream!
Ahem, in all seriousness, I really like your neutral version of The Banshee Queen. I prefer the second wording, since it's more clear.
Also, I think the name is great, even if it doesn't contain the word "Sylvanas". She is a pretty recognisable character, so I doubt people would downvote you for that.
Alfi
As many people pointed out, it's way better than the original King Krush. How about giving it Rush instead of Charge? This way, it would be a two minion removal + a big body, which isn't bad for 8. But even then, the no 8-cost being too easy to fulfill would still be there.
Will there be any reward for this game mode or it's perhaps another battleground-thing? Are they going to somehow incentivise us to play this game mode? Or on the contrary, are they going to push us to play it?
I mean, for me, Hearthstone is exclusively a collectible card game: all these new game modes not related with playing cards have no sense for me...
These new modes should be independent games, alien to Hearthstone completely, because you know: who grabs too much loses all. Blizzard should not bite off more than they can chew.
Thanks for answering, Flux! Makes me curious as well, aye. What would they need to ask, at this stage in development? Distribution methods, interest, graphics decisions... I've no experience with this sort of thing.
I can't disagree with a thing you've said. I hope someone on the team sees your comment (and I hope they stop taking on huge responsibilities like Mercenaries for a period of time, so that they have the manpower to focus on these essential QoL upgrades).
I like this design. It's likely not as good as OG Sylvanas, but it occupies a fun niche - it's definitely a card that I'd slap in a deck whenever I could, like Bandersmosh. Regarding the wording, I think that the second is more clear and fits nicely within the box. Like Demon notes for Alfi's card, though, is it possible to work 'Sylvanas' into the card title?
Zeddy claims to have inside info that it's not coming out until November at the earliest. He could be wrong, but consider the survey about the "battlepass" (Rewards Track and Tavern Pass) was leaked in August 2020. I think we're at least a full quarter from initial release, and November, in advance of the third expansion (beta access with purchase of a pre-order???), seems very realistic.
Why? They've never embraced micro-transactions before, and we have zero reason to think they will here, either. Expect something more like the Battlegrounds Perks, which will also be included with set preorders to incentivize their purchase.
considering that the mode has been delayed once, is in the works for over a year now, has it's own team that focused on shipping it and that the survey includes an potential store description? I'd say that the odds are looking good. They are also releasing 3 book updates this month which indicates an big update for july.
What are the chances of this mode coming out in approximately a month? Because on the roadmap it says that it will be released before set 2 of this year hits. I'm excited about it and it seems that it'll be the game mode that I'll play the most.
It’s not another auto-battler, but just like Battlegrounds it IS a big departure from traditional Hearthstone gameplay. We’re still waiting for an explanation of what this gameplay will be.
Please do not spread false information, I know you do not do this intentionally but please be sure that you fully understand the situation before trying to inform others. https://youtu.be/WdrUvB46b-w?t=1985 Listen to what Ben says, he says you won't use the traditional card collection , not that you won't use any collection.
Even in the survey you can see that it says:
"there are over 50 mercenaries to collect" and "grow your roster".
This looks great, really great. However, it brings me back to ideas (not complaints) I had during the outrage around the launch of the Rewards Track. 1) How do different game modes get supported and incentivized. 2) Is the business model of a pack-opening simulator, modeled after IRL MtG, even relevant anymore? If not, what replaces it? 3) What self-imposed limitations is Blizzard putting on the game?
1) I used to be an avid Arena player, but I find it frustrating because it feels like the player-base has progressively shrunk since Battlegrounds came out. Duels is even worse, with the player-base split between Casual and Heroic. I'm a near-daily player, and I find myself mostly tinkering in Standard (hitting Legend about every other month) because a) it has the best XP rewards; b) I'm saving 2000 gold after each release for the mini-set - the gold spent on the mini-set is enormously more valuable than gold spent on packs which distorts the Arena/Duels rewards into being even less valuable. This isn't a straight complaint. To Blizzard's credit the Rewards Track is giving me more gold each cycle and the mini-set is a great deal. The issue is that the other game modes don't have the same incentives (why is identical gameplay worth less XP in Arena and Duels???). It's definitely a concern going forward with Mercenaries as well. I'm not complaining about more free content, but I'm already a casual whale (near-daily player). I want these modes to be rewarding, and the modes I already play to be properly supported.
2) Which maybe gets at the business model as a whole. I'm so tired of opening packs. It's not a particularly fun or exciting experience. More and more I don't understand the need for collecting to be part of the game, and Battlegrounds and Mercenaries (and Arena) all demonstrate that Blizzard understands this as well. More importantly, why is gatekeeping cards healthy for player engagement and the game? I'm already at Level 130 on the Rewards track without the Tavern Pass, I hit Level 180 last cycle, and I'm missing 7 Forged in the Barrens legendaries and 6 Darkmoon Faire legendaries. They're not the particularly great Legendaries so I'll probably never get them. The XP rewards on their achievements certainly don't justify crafting them or buying additional packs, but I WOULD experiment and play with them if I had them. I don't have a great solution to propose here, but again, Blizzard is putting enormous resources into Mercenaries, a game mode that doesn't depend on your collection. It begs the question of whether constructed modes should depend on your collection or not either. I haven't played Runeterra since Beta, but my understanding is that it's relatively straightforward to earn an entire expansion through free-to-play before the next one comes out. That seems like the minimum, and I'd like to see more creative ways to monetize games without gatekeeping core gameplay for millions of players.
3) How many limits are self-imposed on Hearthstone by Blizzard because it's a mobile game? The UX, historically one of Blizzard's strengths, is a mess. Every design decision has to work for PC and mobile. It's already a multi-gigabyte app, and adding game modes and features, let alone even simple patches and updates, is an excruciating process. But most importantly, WHERE ARE THE MODS? Here you have a community that has been making custom cards for nearly a decade. You have single-player content, Dungeon Runs, Battlegrounds, Duels, and now Mercenaries that show that this CCG engine is actually versatile enough to simulate other genres of games that it wasn't originally built for, just like WCII, SC, WCIII, and SC2. I'm showing my age, but creating a baseball diamond/game mod in WCII(2!) with my older brother was a formative video game experience that probably made me a lifelong Blizzard fan. Don't want to put the dedicated resources into a tournament mode? Let the community create their own! Now, I have a huge bias here as I'm a PC player and not a mobile player. But the PC client should simply have more features. PC and mobile can have very different UX without hurting continuity. Want to create a match where players are limited to 5 very specific expansions? Create a custom game in a lobby like StarCraft, and wait for a player to join. That's not feasible on mobile, but could be on PC. With the release of Forged in the Barrens and announcement of Mercenaries they've talked about Hearthstone as a platform. That platform will continually be hobbled if it's limited by what's only possibly on a mobile touchscreen.
So I'm probably gonna do what every content creator has done and stop playing this game till it gets "fun" I have no interest in lab. So no more new decks, no more ladders for at least 3 weeks till I start seeing some possitive changes in the turbo meta.
The Price Of Progress - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread
Took some time to come up with a new card, here's what I've got. Ties into Brightwing's Legendary effects while serving as a potential combo piece.
More feedback:
Anchorm4n: Go with the second version, it's more clear and still fits in the box. I like the new angle for the card.
Alfi: Ridiculously overpowered currently. Switch to Rush, lower the base stats, and / or change the mana requirement.
Lundy: Maybe make it say "replace your hero power with [insert name here]", and include a token with a new hero power with the original text plus the spell damage. I still prefer the first version you showed, but this one does have more connections to the original Thalnos.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
Adding on to your last point, I'm starting to feel that at some point Blizzard should pull the trigger and turn Battlegrounds and/or Mercenary mode or whatever future game mode nto their own apps. Keep the interconnectivity with levels and gold and what not, but honestly why aren't these separate games?
Still No News From Riot?
Exactly. There's a VERY good reason that aggro has such a low playrate in Diamond and Masters - aggro has always been very easy to counter. Specifically, both Nasus/Thresh and Demacia/Targon (aka Dragons), and even Matron Cithria, have no problems kicking its teeth in, whatever flavor the aggro happens to be.
And seriously, there must be a lot of bad Azir/Irelia players out there to make it look like aggro is so favored against it. My Azir/Irelia opponents are either much more skilled or much more lucky than average, because my aggro decks do not get that kind of winrate against them.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
Mercenaries was suppose to come out sometime this expansion, according to the road map. Unless they have came out and said that they're pushing it back for the third expansion, don't believe what Zeddy has said.
Still No News From Riot?
This is not exactly news. Azir/Irelia always had bad match ups against aggro who themselves have bad match ups against Tresh/Nasus and Trundle/Lissandra control, hence why so many pro player describe the current meta as "coin flip".
The Price Of Progress - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread
Changed Thalnos to be more in line with his Classic counterpart. Like the OG, Thalnos gives Card Draw and Spell Damage. Not sure if I worded the card correctly to get what I wanted to convey across. Actually hope I can word this differently, as I had to space out the words so that they could fit the card frame. Honestly, I think this is trash and wouldn't vote for it. Going to go for something new and hope for the best lol
Feedback:
Still No News From Riot?
https://www.reddit.com/r/LegendsOfRuneterra/comments/nr2ckp/we_hear_you_updates_to_live_cards_and_the_future/
in 3 weeks, 8 July (Riot patchs all their games every 2 weeks on Tuesday nights ) we will be getting a big patch hopefully shifting the meta alongside new cards too..
Sadly they don't have that big of a team on the game yet (like in league) so they can't do as much as they did before while keeping up the content.
Also on the bright side according to this post:
I dunno I don't play ladder much I am enjoying the new labs content :D
The Price Of Progress - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread
More feedback.
Ahem, in all seriousness, I really like your neutral version of The Banshee Queen. I prefer the second wording, since it's more clear.
Also, I think the name is great, even if it doesn't contain the word "Sylvanas". She is a pretty recognisable character, so I doubt people would downvote you for that.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
Probably like duels some achievements will grant XP in the beginning
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
Will there be any reward for this game mode or it's perhaps another battleground-thing? Are they going to somehow incentivise us to play this game mode? Or on the contrary, are they going to push us to play it?
I mean, for me, Hearthstone is exclusively a collectible card game: all these new game modes not related with playing cards have no sense for me...
These new modes should be independent games, alien to Hearthstone completely, because you know: who grabs too much loses all. Blizzard should not bite off more than they can chew.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
Thanks for answering, Flux! Makes me curious as well, aye. What would they need to ask, at this stage in development? Distribution methods, interest, graphics decisions... I've no experience with this sort of thing.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
I can't disagree with a thing you've said. I hope someone on the team sees your comment (and I hope they stop taking on huge responsibilities like Mercenaries for a period of time, so that they have the manpower to focus on these essential QoL upgrades).
The Price Of Progress - Card Design Competition Discussion Thread
@Anchorman
Thank you! Bless ya, that spoiler trick worked.
I like this design. It's likely not as good as OG Sylvanas, but it occupies a fun niche - it's definitely a card that I'd slap in a deck whenever I could, like Bandersmosh. Regarding the wording, I think that the second is more clear and fits nicely within the box. Like Demon notes for Alfi's card, though, is it possible to work 'Sylvanas' into the card title?
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
Zeddy claims to have inside info that it's not coming out until November at the earliest. He could be wrong, but consider the survey about the "battlepass" (Rewards Track and Tavern Pass) was leaked in August 2020. I think we're at least a full quarter from initial release, and November, in advance of the third expansion (beta access with purchase of a pre-order???), seems very realistic.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
Huh? What "polish" does Battlegrounds have? It's just a bare background that your board fights against.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
Why? They've never embraced micro-transactions before, and we have zero reason to think they will here, either. Expect something more like the Battlegrounds Perks, which will also be included with set preorders to incentivize their purchase.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
considering that the mode has been delayed once, is in the works for over a year now, has it's own team that focused on shipping it and that the survey includes an potential store description? I'd say that the odds are looking good. They are also releasing 3 book updates this month which indicates an big update for july.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
What are the chances of this mode coming out in approximately a month? Because on the roadmap it says that it will be released before set 2 of this year hits. I'm excited about it and it seems that it'll be the game mode that I'll play the most.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
They are constantly repeating this vague gameplay description since they announced the mode.
"Deal damage with a twist as you and your opponent queue abilities and select targets, then sit back and watch the right unfold"
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
It’s not another auto-battler, but just like Battlegrounds it IS a big departure from traditional Hearthstone gameplay. We’re still waiting for an explanation of what this gameplay will be.
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
Sneak Peek at Hearthstone Mercenaries - Screenshots and Descriptions of the New Mode via a Blizzard Survey
This looks great, really great. However, it brings me back to ideas (not complaints) I had during the outrage around the launch of the Rewards Track. 1) How do different game modes get supported and incentivized. 2) Is the business model of a pack-opening simulator, modeled after IRL MtG, even relevant anymore? If not, what replaces it? 3) What self-imposed limitations is Blizzard putting on the game?
1) I used to be an avid Arena player, but I find it frustrating because it feels like the player-base has progressively shrunk since Battlegrounds came out. Duels is even worse, with the player-base split between Casual and Heroic. I'm a near-daily player, and I find myself mostly tinkering in Standard (hitting Legend about every other month) because a) it has the best XP rewards; b) I'm saving 2000 gold after each release for the mini-set - the gold spent on the mini-set is enormously more valuable than gold spent on packs which distorts the Arena/Duels rewards into being even less valuable. This isn't a straight complaint. To Blizzard's credit the Rewards Track is giving me more gold each cycle and the mini-set is a great deal. The issue is that the other game modes don't have the same incentives (why is identical gameplay worth less XP in Arena and Duels???). It's definitely a concern going forward with Mercenaries as well. I'm not complaining about more free content, but I'm already a casual whale (near-daily player). I want these modes to be rewarding, and the modes I already play to be properly supported.
2) Which maybe gets at the business model as a whole. I'm so tired of opening packs. It's not a particularly fun or exciting experience. More and more I don't understand the need for collecting to be part of the game, and Battlegrounds and Mercenaries (and Arena) all demonstrate that Blizzard understands this as well. More importantly, why is gatekeeping cards healthy for player engagement and the game? I'm already at Level 130 on the Rewards track without the Tavern Pass, I hit Level 180 last cycle, and I'm missing 7 Forged in the Barrens legendaries and 6 Darkmoon Faire legendaries. They're not the particularly great Legendaries so I'll probably never get them. The XP rewards on their achievements certainly don't justify crafting them or buying additional packs, but I WOULD experiment and play with them if I had them. I don't have a great solution to propose here, but again, Blizzard is putting enormous resources into Mercenaries, a game mode that doesn't depend on your collection. It begs the question of whether constructed modes should depend on your collection or not either. I haven't played Runeterra since Beta, but my understanding is that it's relatively straightforward to earn an entire expansion through free-to-play before the next one comes out. That seems like the minimum, and I'd like to see more creative ways to monetize games without gatekeeping core gameplay for millions of players.
3) How many limits are self-imposed on Hearthstone by Blizzard because it's a mobile game? The UX, historically one of Blizzard's strengths, is a mess. Every design decision has to work for PC and mobile. It's already a multi-gigabyte app, and adding game modes and features, let alone even simple patches and updates, is an excruciating process. But most importantly, WHERE ARE THE MODS? Here you have a community that has been making custom cards for nearly a decade. You have single-player content, Dungeon Runs, Battlegrounds, Duels, and now Mercenaries that show that this CCG engine is actually versatile enough to simulate other genres of games that it wasn't originally built for, just like WCII, SC, WCIII, and SC2. I'm showing my age, but creating a baseball diamond/game mod in WCII(2!) with my older brother was a formative video game experience that probably made me a lifelong Blizzard fan. Don't want to put the dedicated resources into a tournament mode? Let the community create their own! Now, I have a huge bias here as I'm a PC player and not a mobile player. But the PC client should simply have more features. PC and mobile can have very different UX without hurting continuity. Want to create a match where players are limited to 5 very specific expansions? Create a custom game in a lobby like StarCraft, and wait for a player to join. That's not feasible on mobile, but could be on PC. With the release of Forged in the Barrens and announcement of Mercenaries they've talked about Hearthstone as a platform. That platform will continually be hobbled if it's limited by what's only possibly on a mobile touchscreen.
Group Therapy! Need to blow off some steam? Mega salty? Here's the place!
I died to a 1.1% lethal in Battlegrounds
The game after that I died to a 6.4% lethal.
ThAnKs BaTtLeGrOuNdS!
Still No News From Riot?
So I'm probably gonna do what every content creator has done and stop playing this game till it gets "fun" I have no interest in lab. So no more new decks, no more ladders for at least 3 weeks till I start seeing some possitive changes in the turbo meta.
Hearthstone's New Tavern Special and Bob's Bargain Standard & Wild Bundles are Now Live
FWIW, here’s what they offered me:
Tavern:
2 FB legendary + 35 FB packs for $30
Bob:
2 Wild legendary + 40 Wild packs for $30