Aggro rogue and warrior are probably the best decks for climbing right now. Both only really lose to slow warrior decks, and while those are apparently still somewhat popular, I've only faced a single one this whole weekend.
The current most popular decks, according to hsreplay, seem to be murloc paladin, quest shaman, highlander hunter and quest druid. Aggro warrior is favored against all of those.
Highlander mage has fallen off drastically. Both because two of its cards got nerfed and because the meta changed quite a bit.
Edit: I might be wrong on aggro rogue. It's not favored against quest druid or paladin so it's probably tier 2.
We now have an aggro meta. I'm not sure if this is better or worse than what we had before. But losing to murlocs, zoolock or an aggro warrior on turn 5 does not feel good.
Completely anecdotal, but I had a ridiculous winrate with miracle/burn shaman the other day. Kept running into highlander hunters and battlecry shamans with the odd mage or priest thrown in, and none of those decks/classes seem to be able to handle that sort of aggression very well. I assume aggro rogue would do very well against those decks as well. It certainly helped that I didn't run into a single warrior.
So... a few minutes ago I said "fuck it, let's play something dumb for the lulz". The first thing that came to my mind was Magic Carpet: "ok" I said, "Carpet Shaman it is then".
I took the list on ladder (rank 7 EU) with zero experimentation and I literally clowned a complete Highlander Secret Hunter.
It's true, I got a godlike curve (1 drop into EVIL Totem into Magic Carpet into Cult Master into draw half of your deck) but man it felt sooo good.
OK bad misplay. But who knows what real world factors were at play - on phone, rushed play as someone at the door, letting little kid have a go on your account.
If this forum only had HS players who had never made a bad misplay, there wouldn't be many people on it :)
what I was saying about high priestess azil is that she is too bad, not too good. Myra Rotspring is a very bad card, and Azil is very simlar, she dicovers a deathrattle, then triggers it in two turns, that is not worth a legendary effect. I am saying you should change the effect to make it worthy of legendary.
Desychronize cannot really be compared to sap, sap returns it to hand, basically freezing it and making your opponent spend mana, desynchronize is just like that, but for one more mana you are causing them not to draw. if you have 0 cards in hand and are riding on the topdeck to win, having your opponent play desychronize would be devistating and you would just lose the game. compare this to Psychic Scream, it feels super bad to have to spend your turn drawing the Searing Totem your opponent shuffled into their deck, and now your opponent can very consistently make you have that draw for just 3 mana. I would imagine that if this card were printed, mages would play this on searing totem just so that you wouldn't get your card next turn.
reverberator could say "immune while attacking" which would save you some words.
I feel like the downside of having to use stonemother's fury on a minion is not enough to justify the high durrability. especially when you will hardly ever need to unlock your mana, if taking a bit of damage is to high a price to pay, then you simply wont pay it. my problem is, with 8 durrability on a weapon you wont want to be attacking with every turn, the option to just ignore overload would be available for too long.
fair points on the other cards. the set looks great!
Perhaps "Funniest Turn 2 Ever" would've been more appropriate? I also went into this thread expecting a good play. I get that the current title is meant to be sarcastic, but conveying sarcasm on the internet is very different than doing so in real life where you can hear the speaker's tone of voice.
It's a bit of a shame too. The guy/girl looked like they had a legitimately good idea. They just made a miscalculation in the process.
I can't help but feel that highlander decks are so dull to play and play against. Once you know your opponent has only 1 of each spell (beyond discoverable shenanigans), playing around things becomes trivial. Most of the time, it's correct to gamble they don't have that perfect answer. If not, yay! You won! If they did, scramble for Plan B.
I get that it's fun to make each card selected that much more meaningful, but the play and counter-play seem stale.
So... a few minutes ago I said "fuck it, let's play something dumb for the lulz". The first thing that came to my mind was Magic Carpet: "ok" I said, "Carpet Shaman it is then".
I took the list on ladder (rank 7 EU) with zero experimentation and I literally clowned a complete Highlander Secret Hunter.
It's true, I got a godlike curve (1 drop into EVIL Totem into Magic Carpet into Cult Master into draw half of your deck) but man it felt sooo good.
The idea behind Charming Quartermaster is generally, with shuffle, you generally don't get any value out of it unless the game drags on. Thus, it's just a nice body.
Crumbling War Golem is the correct wording. Look at Witchwood Grizzly.
Fair on Runestone Hoarder. It's mostly just a win-more card.
Also fair on Crystal Bowrunner. I wasn't too sure on the card myself but I thought it was an interesting idea to try. Looking back, I'm not too fond of the card either.
If Mo'grosh Hellcaller just gave a minion Spell Damage +1, it wouldn't work the same way. Remember there are minions that get improved by Spell Damage.
I definitely didn't want Prismatic Servant to be Legendary because it really wasn't that much of a build-around card. It'll almost always serve as a tool to help an archetype, and never be the card that defines the archetype. All the effects are pretty basic.
Far Sight and Stonecore Oracle are totally different cards. You are playing 3-Cost 3/3 for an effect that you may never actually benefit from, making it only good in Control and slower Midrange matchups. Compare that to Far Sight, you are guaranteed to see that mana discount from the moment you play that card, while also actively gaining card advantage as a result.
High Priestess Azil is a fair criticism, but there aren't that many crazy strong Deathrattle effects out there. There are definitely a few that currently stand out in the Standard format, like Tirion Fordring or Mechano-Egg if you're playing Paladin, and tamer but still decent effects like Convincing Infiltrator. While those effects are definitely nice when discounted, they are still really slow, which gives your opponent time to prepare for the Deathrattle effect. That said, I'll consider upping its cost to (7) in a balance patch.
Aim for the Heart giving your next spell Spell Damage +2 wouldn't cover the effect. Remember, there are minions that also get improved by Spell Damage in this expansion.
I think you're overvaluing Desynchronize. Compare to Sap and Freezing Trap.
Your comment on Devoted Cleric and Harbinger of the End are fair criticisms. I just thought it looked better. If more people disagree I'm open to changing it.
I worded Reverberator that way because I didn't want it to be Immune to Secrets like Snipe and Explosive Runes, or as you said, AoE cards.
"Combo: Costs (0)" doesn't make sense. Imagine if Arcane Tyrant read "Battlecry: Costs (0) if you played a spell that costs (5) or more." It just doesn't work that way. Combo is a trigger, not an aura.
Stonemother's Fury has the downside of requiring you to attack minions to get value out of the effect. If you're facing a deck that puts large threats on the board, that sometimes means sacrificing 6 or 7 life just to unlock the Overload. Is that worth it? That's something the player to find out.
Thanks for pointing out Hollow Earth! I'll fix that in the balance patch! ^^
Thank you for the feedback. I'm glad you like the set as a whole, we've put a lot of work into it!
with thaurisson, you could play a minion that costs (5) then play brann, an two wretched reclaimers and have 3 of that minion. there is probably a combo to be found here, I will let someone more creative than me figure it out.
Maybe, but unless it's a deathrattle, wouldn't Vivid Nightmare be better in wild? You can use Radiant Elementals and discount those spells even more.
I think this lineup is solid. However, personally, I wouldn't bring Renolock. Sure, it's a good deck, but it's not T1 or consistent enough right now, imo. Just while climbing today, I'm 3-0 against Renolock. Now of course that's an abysmally small sample size, but the deck doesn't seem super powerful currently. I'd rather bring pure Mecha'Thun (with duplicates) or a different deck overall. Pirate warrior or mech hunter are both super strong, but overlooked decks.
I play a ton of wild, and those are just my thoughts. If you'd like to play test anything against whatever to test matchups, I'd be happy to be your practice partner! Add me jaybaseball1#1802 (on NA). Hope this helps. Good luck!
with thaurisson, you could play a minion that costs (5) then play brann, an two wretched reclaimers and have 3 of that minion. there is probably a combo to be found here, I will let someone more creative than me figure it out.
the whole set looks super cool! I really like the elemental theme and the spell damage sub-theme because spell damage does not get any attention whatsoever. there are a couple of cards I don't really like or think could be better/simpler.
I don't really understand the point of charming quartermaster, he does not have good enough stats to justify shuffle cards into your opponents deck, the card just seems pointless and confusing.
crumbling wargolem should just say "gets -2/-2" saying "this loses 2 attack and health" is unnecessarily wordy.
I really don't like runestone hoarder, it is a 5 mana card which makes it hard to combo with, and having a 5 mana 5/6 spelldamage +1/2 does not seem very good especially when you have to already be playing spell damage minions. frankly, the card is just bad and really hard to use.
Crystal bowrunner would be a lot simpler if it just sayed "the next time you damage a minion with a spell, freeze it" or "whenever you damage a minion with a spell, freeze it" adding additional text to spells in your hand is kind of a weird mechanic, the changes I suggested would make the card ruffly the same, but it would make it more in line with other cards with similar effects.
the problem I have with Mo'Grosh Hellcaller is basically the same thing as Crystal Bowrunner. you could make it just say "give a friendly minion spell damage +1" instead of giving it a passive ability until end of turn. this would just make the card all around simpler and it stays the same card.
I feel that prismatic servants ability is unique enough that it should be on a legendary. this is the kind of mechanic you would want to build a deck around, and it is a brand new, very interesting and unique ability. I would up the power level and make it legendary, simply for the unique ability.
Stonecore oracle it just too good. it is way to easy for a control deck to get lucky and roll at least one big card off of this. I think it would be better if you toned it down and made it say "discover a card in your deck, reduce its cost by 3/2" or maybe just "reduce the cost of a card in your deck by 3". remember, shaman has Far Sight, generally it is bad for a neutral card to power-creep a class card.
high priestess azil makes the deathralle minion practically cost 0, and it will just die at the end of your next turn, so it is basically just "discover a deathrattle minion and trigger its deathrattle" but slower because you have to wait a turn. she definitely has room for some improvement.
aim for the heart should just say "your next spell has spell damage +2"
Desychronize should cost 4, or maybe even 5. Assassinate costs 5, and that just straight up kills it, this spell does not kill it, but you are basically making your opponent not draw on their next turn, while also freezing the minion, that is a very powerful things and can sometimes just win the game outright if your opponent does not have very many cards in hand already. here are some MTG cards that can maybe help illustrate my point: Murder and totally lost. murder costs 3, while totally lost costs 5.
harbinger of the end and devoted cleric both say "their neighbors" when every other card says "adjacent minions".
killing spree and adrenaline rush should say "combo: costs (0)"
reverberator would be a lot less wordy if it just had immune on your turn, it would make it more vulnerable to area of effect spells, but right now it is a little weird to read.
stonemother's fury is a 8 durrability weapon, this weapon will probably last you the entire game if you are careful with it, I would give it less durability to make it feel more fair
Hollow earth has the neutral boarder but it is under the warlock section. probably just a technical glitch.
Sorry if I came across as nit-picky. your set looks really good and there are some cards that are very well designed and interesting! just trying to help make it as great as it can be!
I don't think the nerfs shook the meta nearly as much as people want to believe. Mage overall power drop quite a bit, but the decks and archetypes are still pretty viable, just not top of the tier list anymore. Singleton Hunter performs well, and same goes for control & bomb warriors. Quest Shaman & Paladin are all over the place. I personally had a blast with Lackey-Zoolock.
Best decks after nerfs!
Aggro rogue and warrior are probably the best decks for climbing right now. Both only really lose to slow warrior decks, and while those are apparently still somewhat popular, I've only faced a single one this whole weekend.
The current most popular decks, according to hsreplay, seem to be murloc paladin, quest shaman, highlander hunter and quest druid. Aggro warrior is favored against all of those.
Highlander mage has fallen off drastically. Both because two of its cards got nerfed and because the meta changed quite a bit.
Edit: I might be wrong on aggro rogue. It's not favored against quest druid or paladin so it's probably tier 2.
Group Therapy! Need to blow off some steam? Mega salty? Here's the place!
We now have an aggro meta. I'm not sure if this is better or worse than what we had before. But losing to murlocs, zoolock or an aggro warrior on turn 5 does not feel good.
Best decks after nerfs!
Completely anecdotal, but I had a ridiculous winrate with miracle/burn shaman the other day. Kept running into highlander hunters and battlecry shamans with the odd mage or priest thrown in, and none of those decks/classes seem to be able to handle that sort of aggression very well. I assume aggro rogue would do very well against those decks as well. It certainly helped that I didn't run into a single warrior.
Group Therapy! Need to blow off some steam? Mega salty? Here's the place!
And now lost to a warrior who got 3x Armagedillo. How do I keep getting matches against people high rolling everything?
Mecha'thun Lorewalker Cho Combo!
Mindgames
The Pepper Thread - Share Some Good Vibes!
Was that against me?
Orange's Quest Druid
Might as well call this one wallet druid. It's sad that most of these std decks rely on so many legendaries.
Best Turn 2 Ever
OK bad misplay. But who knows what real world factors were at play - on phone, rushed play as someone at the door, letting little kid have a go on your account.
If this forum only had HS players who had never made a bad misplay, there wouldn't be many people on it :)
[Finished Fan Expansion] The Crystalarium - A Deepholm Expansion | 9/1/19 - The Final Update
what I was saying about high priestess azil is that she is too bad, not too good. Myra Rotspring is a very bad card, and Azil is very simlar, she dicovers a deathrattle, then triggers it in two turns, that is not worth a legendary effect. I am saying you should change the effect to make it worthy of legendary.
Desychronize cannot really be compared to sap, sap returns it to hand, basically freezing it and making your opponent spend mana, desynchronize is just like that, but for one more mana you are causing them not to draw. if you have 0 cards in hand and are riding on the topdeck to win, having your opponent play desychronize would be devistating and you would just lose the game. compare this to Psychic Scream, it feels super bad to have to spend your turn drawing the Searing Totem your opponent shuffled into their deck, and now your opponent can very consistently make you have that draw for just 3 mana. I would imagine that if this card were printed, mages would play this on searing totem just so that you wouldn't get your card next turn.
reverberator could say "immune while attacking" which would save you some words.
I feel like the downside of having to use stonemother's fury on a minion is not enough to justify the high durrability. especially when you will hardly ever need to unlock your mana, if taking a bit of damage is to high a price to pay, then you simply wont pay it. my problem is, with 8 durrability on a weapon you wont want to be attacking with every turn, the option to just ignore overload would be available for too long.
fair points on the other cards. the set looks great!
Best Turn 2 Ever
Perhaps "Funniest Turn 2 Ever" would've been more appropriate? I also went into this thread expecting a good play. I get that the current title is meant to be sarcastic, but conveying sarcasm on the internet is very different than doing so in real life where you can hear the speaker's tone of voice.
It's a bit of a shame too. The guy/girl looked like they had a legitimately good idea. They just made a miscalculation in the process.
Hot Take - Highlander decks are boring!
I can't help but feel that highlander decks are so dull to play and play against. Once you know your opponent has only 1 of each spell (beyond discoverable shenanigans), playing around things becomes trivial. Most of the time, it's correct to gamble they don't have that perfect answer. If not, yay! You won! If they did, scramble for Plan B.
I get that it's fun to make each card selected that much more meaningful, but the play and counter-play seem stale.
Anyone else agree?
Best Turn 2 Ever
..the whole point was to have a good laugh..no jab..we have all been there.
smile..it's more fun than getting triggered
Group Therapy! Need to blow off some steam? Mega salty? Here's the place!
Losing to a Mage that gets 4x Ice Block is some of the biggest steaming horse shit this game hashes out.
The Pepper Thread - Share Some Good Vibes!
So... a few minutes ago I said "fuck it, let's play something dumb for the lulz". The first thing that came to my mind was Magic Carpet: "ok" I said, "Carpet Shaman it is then".
I took the list on ladder (rank 7 EU) with zero experimentation and I literally clowned a complete Highlander Secret Hunter.
It's true, I got a godlike curve (1 drop into EVIL Totem into Magic Carpet into Cult Master into draw half of your deck) but man it felt sooo good.
The finishing blow? 1 drop into Snipe into Leeeeeeeeroooooooooy Nnjenkiiiins. So fucking good.
EDIT: just hit the winstreak lmao I'm having so much fun
[Finished Fan Expansion] The Crystalarium - A Deepholm Expansion | 9/1/19 - The Final Update
The idea behind Charming Quartermaster is generally, with shuffle, you generally don't get any value out of it unless the game drags on. Thus, it's just a nice body.
Crumbling War Golem is the correct wording. Look at Witchwood Grizzly.
Fair on Runestone Hoarder. It's mostly just a win-more card.
Also fair on Crystal Bowrunner. I wasn't too sure on the card myself but I thought it was an interesting idea to try. Looking back, I'm not too fond of the card either.
If Mo'grosh Hellcaller just gave a minion Spell Damage +1, it wouldn't work the same way. Remember there are minions that get improved by Spell Damage.
I definitely didn't want Prismatic Servant to be Legendary because it really wasn't that much of a build-around card. It'll almost always serve as a tool to help an archetype, and never be the card that defines the archetype. All the effects are pretty basic.
Far Sight and Stonecore Oracle are totally different cards. You are playing 3-Cost 3/3 for an effect that you may never actually benefit from, making it only good in Control and slower Midrange matchups. Compare that to Far Sight, you are guaranteed to see that mana discount from the moment you play that card, while also actively gaining card advantage as a result.
High Priestess Azil is a fair criticism, but there aren't that many crazy strong Deathrattle effects out there. There are definitely a few that currently stand out in the Standard format, like Tirion Fordring or Mechano-Egg if you're playing Paladin, and tamer but still decent effects like Convincing Infiltrator. While those effects are definitely nice when discounted, they are still really slow, which gives your opponent time to prepare for the Deathrattle effect. That said, I'll consider upping its cost to (7) in a balance patch.
Aim for the Heart giving your next spell Spell Damage +2 wouldn't cover the effect. Remember, there are minions that also get improved by Spell Damage in this expansion.
I think you're overvaluing Desynchronize. Compare to Sap and Freezing Trap.
Your comment on Devoted Cleric and Harbinger of the End are fair criticisms. I just thought it looked better. If more people disagree I'm open to changing it.
I worded Reverberator that way because I didn't want it to be Immune to Secrets like Snipe and Explosive Runes, or as you said, AoE cards.
"Combo: Costs (0)" doesn't make sense. Imagine if Arcane Tyrant read "Battlecry: Costs (0) if you played a spell that costs (5) or more." It just doesn't work that way. Combo is a trigger, not an aura.
Stonemother's Fury has the downside of requiring you to attack minions to get value out of the effect. If you're facing a deck that puts large threats on the board, that sometimes means sacrificing 6 or 7 life just to unlock the Overload. Is that worth it? That's something the player to find out.
Thanks for pointing out Hollow Earth! I'll fix that in the balance patch! ^^
Thank you for the feedback. I'm glad you like the set as a whole, we've put a lot of work into it!
Brann Bronzebeard + Wretched Reclaimer interaction
Maybe, but unless it's a deathrattle, wouldn't Vivid Nightmare be better in wild? You can use Radiant Elementals and discount those spells even more.
[edit] Mirage Caller could also work with Brann Bronzebeard, but then the priest player has to pain one of the 2-attack minions.
Preparing for a local Wild Tournament
I think this lineup is solid. However, personally, I wouldn't bring Renolock. Sure, it's a good deck, but it's not T1 or consistent enough right now, imo. Just while climbing today, I'm 3-0 against Renolock. Now of course that's an abysmally small sample size, but the deck doesn't seem super powerful currently. I'd rather bring pure Mecha'Thun (with duplicates) or a different deck overall. Pirate warrior or mech hunter are both super strong, but overlooked decks.
I play a ton of wild, and those are just my thoughts. If you'd like to play test anything against whatever to test matchups, I'd be happy to be your practice partner! Add me jaybaseball1#1802 (on NA). Hope this helps. Good luck!
Mecha'thun Lorewalker Cho Combo!
Wow. Just wow.
It Was EYE All Along!!!
Great guide my friend :)
Brann Bronzebeard + Wretched Reclaimer interaction
with thaurisson, you could play a minion that costs (5) then play brann, an two wretched reclaimers and have 3 of that minion. there is probably a combo to be found here, I will let someone more creative than me figure it out.
[Finished Fan Expansion] The Crystalarium - A Deepholm Expansion | 9/1/19 - The Final Update
the whole set looks super cool! I really like the elemental theme and the spell damage sub-theme because spell damage does not get any attention whatsoever. there are a couple of cards I don't really like or think could be better/simpler.
I don't really understand the point of charming quartermaster, he does not have good enough stats to justify shuffle cards into your opponents deck, the card just seems pointless and confusing.
crumbling wargolem should just say "gets -2/-2" saying "this loses 2 attack and health" is unnecessarily wordy.
I really don't like runestone hoarder, it is a 5 mana card which makes it hard to combo with, and having a 5 mana 5/6 spelldamage +1/2 does not seem very good especially when you have to already be playing spell damage minions. frankly, the card is just bad and really hard to use.
Crystal bowrunner would be a lot simpler if it just sayed "the next time you damage a minion with a spell, freeze it" or "whenever you damage a minion with a spell, freeze it" adding additional text to spells in your hand is kind of a weird mechanic, the changes I suggested would make the card ruffly the same, but it would make it more in line with other cards with similar effects.
the problem I have with Mo'Grosh Hellcaller is basically the same thing as Crystal Bowrunner. you could make it just say "give a friendly minion spell damage +1" instead of giving it a passive ability until end of turn. this would just make the card all around simpler and it stays the same card.
I feel that prismatic servants ability is unique enough that it should be on a legendary. this is the kind of mechanic you would want to build a deck around, and it is a brand new, very interesting and unique ability. I would up the power level and make it legendary, simply for the unique ability.
Stonecore oracle it just too good. it is way to easy for a control deck to get lucky and roll at least one big card off of this. I think it would be better if you toned it down and made it say "discover a card in your deck, reduce its cost by 3/2" or maybe just "reduce the cost of a card in your deck by 3". remember, shaman has Far Sight, generally it is bad for a neutral card to power-creep a class card.
high priestess azil makes the deathralle minion practically cost 0, and it will just die at the end of your next turn, so it is basically just "discover a deathrattle minion and trigger its deathrattle" but slower because you have to wait a turn. she definitely has room for some improvement.
aim for the heart should just say "your next spell has spell damage +2"
Desychronize should cost 4, or maybe even 5. Assassinate costs 5, and that just straight up kills it, this spell does not kill it, but you are basically making your opponent not draw on their next turn, while also freezing the minion, that is a very powerful things and can sometimes just win the game outright if your opponent does not have very many cards in hand already. here are some MTG cards that can maybe help illustrate my point: Murder and totally lost. murder costs 3, while totally lost costs 5.
harbinger of the end and devoted cleric both say "their neighbors" when every other card says "adjacent minions".
killing spree and adrenaline rush should say "combo: costs (0)"
reverberator would be a lot less wordy if it just had immune on your turn, it would make it more vulnerable to area of effect spells, but right now it is a little weird to read.
stonemother's fury is a 8 durrability weapon, this weapon will probably last you the entire game if you are careful with it, I would give it less durability to make it feel more fair
Hollow earth has the neutral boarder but it is under the warlock section. probably just a technical glitch.
Sorry if I came across as nit-picky. your set looks really good and there are some cards that are very well designed and interesting! just trying to help make it as great as it can be!
What is a Highlander deck?
I vote the rename OP ''Lander'' ... for obvious reason
Best decks after nerfs!
I don't think the nerfs shook the meta nearly as much as people want to believe.
Mage overall power drop quite a bit, but the decks and archetypes are still pretty viable, just not top of the tier list anymore.
Singleton Hunter performs well, and same goes for control & bomb warriors.
Quest Shaman & Paladin are all over the place.
I personally had a blast with Lackey-Zoolock.
Plenty to chose from :)
September has Arrived! New Season, New Sea of Dunes Card Back
You made the Tusken Raiders mad ... and not just the men ...^^
September has Arrived! New Season, New Sea of Dunes Card Back
All that sand ...
