It's a refresh, so it's not straight-up mana cheat, but that doesn't stop this from enabling just a LOT of shenanigans. Imagine Forest Warden Omu but you don't have to pay any mana to get him into play. This is pretty close to that. I'd imagine there's at least a handful of decks created that lean on her unique ability to great effect.
Seems very good, and just about right for its mana cost. Condemn and Xyrella are still in Standard to pick up the slack in the early game, so Priest should have a decent chance of getting to the point of playing this. It's quite the answer against slower, chunkier decks like Ramp Druid. Not one-sided like Soul Mirror, but I think that Control Priest won't mind that considering it gives them the ability to answer minions that have yet to hit the board. A very good board clear. Priest shouldn't have to worry about big boards for another two years.
That art is adorable. The card is...kind of a poor man's Libram of Wisdom? I guess if you're just chock o' block full of Nagas you can generate an infinite number of wigs or close enough to it. I don't think that's a great idea, but there's nothing wrong with generating this spell from a Discover if you need the buff.
Yeah, this is good. This is really good. Priest is losing a lot of its cheap utility spells that would make this insane, but there's still plenty of spells that Priest will already want to run that this minion is mostly going to be just gas. And they can run TWO of these? Yeah, Priest is going to be drawing a lot of cards when the Voyage launches.
Ok. Seems really cool for any Priest deck that specifically wants to draw minions, and great for weird combo decks (Silence Priest?!?!) that want to swap stats between one big thing and one small thing. There's gonna be some weird deck on the fringes of the meta (or perhaps it WILL BE THE META?) that runs this card as a key part of its win condition.
I REALLY like this card. The first half isn't really that bad: it's a 1 Mana Discover spell. Those find a way to see play most of the time. It's that second half that's true value: 1 Mana for THREE spells? Sure, they're (sorta) random, but I have a feeling there will be a handful of Shaman decks that will mess around with this card and the absurd amounts of value it can generate (Naga Shaman, anyone?)
Is Murlock really gonna be a thing? I don't know, but that Sunken Scavenger is really gonna try hard. One thing going in its favour? Sir Finley, Sea Guide is a Murloc and would love to find that little boy on the bottom of the deck.
The first half is basically Fiery War Axe, but the second half--if you can tutor it--is really good, essentially a cheaper Quel'Delar. So...it's pretty strong in a deck that knows how to get the Sunken Trident out of their deck and into the game. Probably too slow for an aggro deck, but a solid midrange deck or control could mess around with it.
I guess this is okay. It might prevent your opponent from playing something they'd like to see live on their next turn, since it can kill most turn 6 minions and not get hurt while doing so. 4 health is pretty easy to deal with at that point, so it might not be doing that more than once.
Is this too good for 3 mana? Is that why it needs the dormant penalty? Might be better to play this late to remove a single late game threat. As long as it doesn't have divine shield, or you have something else to pop the shield.
Seems like a decent 1-drop. Pretty much anything your opponent can play will die immediately once this awakens, so they might wait until they can ping it, which might slow them down slightly.
I'm gonna be honest, it feels like you have never played this game before from your analysis.
If topdecking a naga is bad, so is topdecking a 1 drop. So by your logic all 1 drops are bad.
Saying "naga are useless until 2 or 3 spells later" shows you literally haven't looked at Naga at all. There are only 5 naga that require 3 spells to activate. Three of those are different class cards, and 2/3 class cards and 1/2 neutrals are legendary. So if you have "a bunch of naga in your hand" but draw multiple that require 3 spells, then you're hitting what would be a 1% chance if you have 10 cards left in deck, or a .3% chance if you have 15. It won't happen. The most Naga you can have in your deck TOTAL is 14 at current. Naga Giant can be played vanilla anytime turn 6 or 7-ish if you've been casting spells. Enforcer and Baba both only require a single spell. And most classes either have a naga that can be played without a spellcast, or that gives you something else.
Dredge cards are great, they're literally just a Sphere of Sapience effect. It also allows you to know two cards that you won't have access to, so that you can play around that. Why would it be bad to select which card you're going to draw next and be able to plan your plays ahead?
You're also ignoring the fact that search and Shuffle effects exist. That allows you to simply add good cards to your deck and draw them later.
I have to choose between the Elden Ring and the new Borderlands game. My mind says Elden Ring, my PC says no, and my heart says Borderlands. It is hard.
I do not mind the idea of four expacs per year, but maybe instead of adding new expacs, it might be a better idea to do more Doom in the Tomb style events. I imagine it would be easier to balance the meta out if you could just put in historically good cards instead of trying to print a single good one for an archetype.
I definitely agree with him on the Theorycrafting streams. I don't think they've ever had a meta close to what we get even a week after release. The biggest example I can remember is Ashes, where every streamer was playing Highlander Midrange DH. Then, literally day one and no one was playing that anymore.
Im actually pleasantly surprised that elden ring took off so well. Seems like everyone is playing it, as opposed to just within the sphere of fromsoft's usual audience. Who'd ever guess that games that's not insultingly casual, handholding, and feature a story where people are supposed to work a little more for, be so acclaimed. Oh, and fromsoftware actually balance their games so their players have more fun, not on 'time savers'.
I look forward to the eventual ubisoft overreaction - especially if elden ring becomes a financial success beyond their expectations.
Back to hearthstone:
Im open to another doom in the tomb event, and in my opinion that's much better than implementing midsets to freshen the meta up. For one thing, at least it'll reduce the cost of the game, both long and short term. And players like me get to play old cards without having to go through the cess pit that is wild.
As for a forth expansion. Im very much opposed to it. Three per year is fine. The midset complicated things a little, but I think we can do away with it, and bring in events that'll shake up the meta for a short period of time. Having 4 expansions spaced between three months may lead to fatigue, and team5 have to contrive more descriptions per year to keep the expansions from looking too samey.
4 expansions a year? I may give up on hearthstone if that happens, I am sure a lot of people will leave. Right now the mini sets can be bought as a set, thats tolerable. 4 expansions will make the game cost more, with less time to gather gold to buy packs.
I think we can all agree that stormwind was an anomaly, a botch to put it mildly. Team5 wanted the questlines to shine so they designed each and every quest in stormwind to feature a win condition that ultimately took it too far. From my understanding, it went way past what they originally intended, and none of us predicted how powerful and impactful the questlines ultimately became. It took 3 nerfs within a month, that's unprecedented.
Far as Sunken City's own cards are concerned, I think there's enough stuff so far to keep me interested in the expansion: Lady S'theno, nellie, Emergency Maneuvers, murlock deck, Queen Azshara. If the questlines starts running rampant (which Im not certain that they will, having lost a chuck of their good cards) I'd imagine team5 nerfing them down again.
Also, I'd point out again that team5 have this habit of leaving the best cards for last. We didn't even see galakrond shaman until the end of the reveal, and again none of us have predicted that it'll take over the entire meta for the 1 week before it got nerfed.
On the subject of card redundancy, I think its pretty much clear that that has been happening throughout hearthstone's history. Only under very specific circumstances does previous expansion cards matter more than the current one, like the ungoro-kobolds vs witchwood-rastakhans. Otherwise, the result has been fairly consistent - As the years move forward, previous expansions loses relevance. How many barrens cards are still being played today?
Its not specifically in hearthstone too. I still have old Pokemon tcg cards that are completely redundant today (My old machamp used to do 60 damage and at that time it was insane. Now even an unevolved pokemon can do it). But in its lifetime I got some worth out of my money. I dont think its fair to say money has been wasted if you have had a good deal of time playing it.
I think you're more referring to the mechanics of the expansion being weak rather than the entirety of it because after looking at the cards again, there are a lot of damn good ones. The problem with Rastakhan's Rumble is that not only overkill is weak, but the cards are just weak in general. If you would compare the cards in RR and in Voyage, I think you would absolutely agree that Voyage is far stronger than RR.
If you want to judge the overall impact of an expansion, you need to look at all of the individual cards and their interaction with other cards not just the specific mechanics of it. And I think so far Voyage is looking pretty fine.
Well argued. However, I would respond that the conditions aren't as different as you say. Sunken City, while part of a new year, also comes on the back of a string of powerful expansions just like RR did. The entire Alliance vs Horde cycle has yielded some fairly unhealthy designs, particularly on the Questline end. While my perspective is admittedly skewed on the topic as I'm a Wild player, I'd imagine these Questlines will continue to have a presence in Standard as well, and the designers will have to tiptoe pretty exensively not to give any of these Questlines any tools. We already know Hunter is getting some fuel for their Questline, and who knows what the Core set will bring to the others. In that environment, a new set has to be doing something fairly spectacular to present an appealing alternative to doing the same old from United in Stormwind and I just don't feel VtSS is doing that so far. It's self-contained mechanics mean that if the set cards underperform as they stands, they're pretty much dead in the water (lol puns) for the future as well cause they don't interact particularly well with upcoming sets. Perhaps when the 2021 sets rotate and the meta gets truly powered down, Sunken City may float back up in relevance (I crack myself up sometimes) but currently it feels dead on arrival barring a few exceptions.
If I get to play dredge throughout the next meta because the power level is weaker, and then subsequently in the next expansion dredge gets completely forgotten, is that really so much of a big issue?
It's not necessarily a problem for the expansion itself but it is a problem for the future. If design is this self-contained too often, the end result is a bigger part of your collection becomes redundant as new expansions release (moreso than usual), which in turn means higher costs for remaining competitive and a general feeling from the playerbase that they've wasted their money. That's the type of dissatisfaction you can't keep on accumulating for long.
As for Colossal, what I mean is...it feels somewhat like Jungle Giants. In practice the Quest is pretty meh in terms of power level even with the variety of tools Wild offers. It's bombastic in concept (stuff my deck full of giant monsters and draw and play 38 mana of stuff on turn 6-7) but in practice not that interesting, as your deck is often choking on big, clunky cards that rot in your hand if drawn before Quest completion, and you mostly rely on a handful of crucial, low-cost, high-attack minions to get your Quest moving. If those end up buried midway through your deck, your deck does very little. It's exciting, just impractical. A lot of these Colossal minions feel the same way. Xhilag of the Abyss is exciting in theory but the tentacles are never gonna last a turn and the EoT effect isn't impactful enough past the raw on-board stats. Colaque is just a giant idiot. Can be fun if you find ways to copy the shell etc. In fact all of the Colossal minions get pretty fun when you try some copying, mana cheating or bouncing shenanigans on them. It's really a Timmy mechanic through and through. And maybe they will make a splash as a top-end option, even with the Alterac Valley heroes being around. But they're more exciting by their size and by the Dane/Mark McKz/Roffle bombastic shenanigans they invite rather than sheer practicality in ending the game.
Sunken Scroll does not specify that the spells have to be Shaman, but rather "from your class". So if the base spell is randomly generated somehow, you could be potentially gipped out of some cards (like Mage being without Nature, or Priest not having...well, much of anything beyond Whirlpool).
Not saying the card is bad; just could lead to a feelsbad moment for someone out there.
I'm not clear how this secret works with Colossal minions, which spawn their appendages no matter how they're summoned.
i.e. Other player kills my Colossal. A new one is summoned, and is dormant. Are its appendages: (a) Summoned right away, and usable right away? (b) Summoned right away, but made dormant, like the main card? (c) Not summoned until the main card wakes up, next turn?
I'm guessing it's (a), based on the behavior of dormant cards with a battlecry (like The Darkness), which trigger their battlecries when they're played, not when they awaken. But of course, Colossal's effect isn't exactly a battlecry, so I'm not sure.
New Priest Minion - Priestess Valishj
It's a refresh, so it's not straight-up mana cheat, but that doesn't stop this from enabling just a LOT of shenanigans. Imagine Forest Warden Omu but you don't have to pay any mana to get him into play. This is pretty close to that. I'd imagine there's at least a handful of decks created that lean on her unique ability to great effect.
New Priest Spell - Whirlpool
Seems very good, and just about right for its mana cost. Condemn and Xyrella are still in Standard to pick up the slack in the early game, so Priest should have a decent chance of getting to the point of playing this. It's quite the answer against slower, chunkier decks like Ramp Druid. Not one-sided like Soul Mirror, but I think that Control Priest won't mind that considering it gives them the ability to answer minions that have yet to hit the board. A very good board clear. Priest shouldn't have to worry about big boards for another two years.
New Priest Spell - Serpent Wig
That art is adorable. The card is...kind of a poor man's Libram of Wisdom? I guess if you're just chock o' block full of Nagas you can generate an infinite number of wigs or close enough to it. I don't think that's a great idea, but there's nothing wrong with generating this spell from a Discover if you need the buff.
New Priest Spell - Azsharan Ritual
Knock knock? Who's there?
I said, "Who's there?"
Oh, I see. It's Silence Priest.
Could be a fun time, especially if you can dredge that Sunken half when you've got a primo-Big Boi to Silence and copy twice. We'll see.
New Priest Minion - Handmaiden
Yeah, this is good. This is really good. Priest is losing a lot of its cheap utility spells that would make this insane, but there's still plenty of spells that Priest will already want to run that this minion is mostly going to be just gas. And they can run TWO of these? Yeah, Priest is going to be drawing a lot of cards when the Voyage launches.
New Priest Spell - Switcheroo
Ok. Seems really cool for any Priest deck that specifically wants to draw minions, and great for weird combo decks (Silence Priest?!?!) that want to swap stats between one big thing and one small thing. There's gonna be some weird deck on the fringes of the meta (or perhaps it WILL BE THE META?) that runs this card as a key part of its win condition.
New Shaman Spell - Azsharan Scroll
I REALLY like this card. The first half isn't really that bad: it's a 1 Mana Discover spell. Those find a way to see play most of the time. It's that second half that's true value: 1 Mana for THREE spells? Sure, they're (sorta) random, but I have a feeling there will be a handful of Shaman decks that will mess around with this card and the absurd amounts of value it can generate (Naga Shaman, anyone?)
New Warlock Minion - Azsharan Scavenger
Is Murlock really gonna be a thing? I don't know, but that Sunken Scavenger is really gonna try hard. One thing going in its favour? Sir Finley, Sea Guide is a Murloc and would love to find that little boy on the bottom of the deck.
New Warrior Weapon - Azsharan Trident
The first half is basically Fiery War Axe, but the second half--if you can tutor it--is really good, essentially a cheaper Quel'Delar. So...it's pretty strong in a deck that knows how to get the Sunken Trident out of their deck and into the game. Probably too slow for an aggro deck, but a solid midrange deck or control could mess around with it.
New Neutral Minion - Gangplank Diver
I guess this is okay. It might prevent your opponent from playing something they'd like to see live on their next turn, since it can kill most turn 6 minions and not get hurt while doing so. 4 health is pretty easy to deal with at that point, so it might not be doing that more than once.
New Neutral Minion - Slimescale Diver
Is this too good for 3 mana? Is that why it needs the dormant penalty? Might be better to play this late to remove a single late game threat. As long as it doesn't have divine shield, or you have something else to pop the shield.
New Neutral Minion - Pelican Diver
Seems like a decent 1-drop. Pretty much anything your opponent can play will die immediately once this awakens, so they might wait until they can ping it, which might slow them down slightly.
Hearthstone Reveals 6 New Sunken Treasures from Voyage to the Sunken City
I'm gonna be honest, it feels like you have never played this game before from your analysis.
If topdecking a naga is bad, so is topdecking a 1 drop. So by your logic all 1 drops are bad.
Saying "naga are useless until 2 or 3 spells later" shows you literally haven't looked at Naga at all. There are only 5 naga that require 3 spells to activate. Three of those are different class cards, and 2/3 class cards and 1/2 neutrals are legendary. So if you have "a bunch of naga in your hand" but draw multiple that require 3 spells, then you're hitting what would be a 1% chance if you have 10 cards left in deck, or a .3% chance if you have 15. It won't happen. The most Naga you can have in your deck TOTAL is 14 at current. Naga Giant can be played vanilla anytime turn 6 or 7-ish if you've been casting spells. Enforcer and Baba both only require a single spell. And most classes either have a naga that can be played without a spellcast, or that gives you something else.
Dredge cards are great, they're literally just a Sphere of Sapience effect. It also allows you to know two cards that you won't have access to, so that you can play around that. Why would it be bad to select which card you're going to draw next and be able to plan your plays ahead?
You're also ignoring the fact that search and Shuffle effects exist. That allows you to simply add good cards to your deck and draw them later.
Dean Ayala’s Hearthstone Q&A Recap #40 - Theorycrafting Streams, 4 Expansions Per Year, New Hero Skins
I have to choose between the Elden Ring and the new Borderlands game. My mind says Elden Ring, my PC says no, and my heart says Borderlands. It is hard.
I do not mind the idea of four expacs per year, but maybe instead of adding new expacs, it might be a better idea to do more Doom in the Tomb style events. I imagine it would be easier to balance the meta out if you could just put in historically good cards instead of trying to print a single good one for an archetype.
Hearthstone Reveals 6 New Sunken Treasures from Voyage to the Sunken City
Azsharan Mooncatcher is actually really good with Seafloor Savior and Radar Detector, maybe handbuff mech will be a thing in standard?
Dean Ayala’s Hearthstone Q&A Recap #40 - Theorycrafting Streams, 4 Expansions Per Year, New Hero Skins
I definitely agree with him on the Theorycrafting streams. I don't think they've ever had a meta close to what we get even a week after release. The biggest example I can remember is Ashes, where every streamer was playing Highlander Midrange DH. Then, literally day one and no one was playing that anymore.
Dean Ayala’s Hearthstone Q&A Recap #40 - Theorycrafting Streams, 4 Expansions Per Year, New Hero Skins
Im actually pleasantly surprised that elden ring took off so well. Seems like everyone is playing it, as opposed to just within the sphere of fromsoft's usual audience. Who'd ever guess that games that's not insultingly casual, handholding, and feature a story where people are supposed to work a little more for, be so acclaimed. Oh, and fromsoftware actually balance their games so their players have more fun, not on 'time savers'.
I look forward to the eventual ubisoft overreaction - especially if elden ring becomes a financial success beyond their expectations.
Back to hearthstone:
Im open to another doom in the tomb event, and in my opinion that's much better than implementing midsets to freshen the meta up. For one thing, at least it'll reduce the cost of the game, both long and short term. And players like me get to play old cards without having to go through the cess pit that is wild.
As for a forth expansion. Im very much opposed to it. Three per year is fine. The midset complicated things a little, but I think we can do away with it, and bring in events that'll shake up the meta for a short period of time. Having 4 expansions spaced between three months may lead to fatigue, and team5 have to contrive more descriptions per year to keep the expansions from looking too samey.
Dean Ayala’s Hearthstone Q&A Recap #40 - Theorycrafting Streams, 4 Expansions Per Year, New Hero Skins
4 expansions a year? I may give up on hearthstone if that happens, I am sure a lot of people will leave. Right now the mini sets can be bought as a set, thats tolerable. 4 expansions will make the game cost more, with less time to gather gold to buy packs.
Dean Ayala’s Hearthstone Q&A Recap #40 - Theorycrafting Streams, 4 Expansions Per Year, New Hero Skins
Man, everyone be playing Elden Ring while I'm just sitting here with my dogshit laptop that can't even run too many fandom tabs. I feel so maidenless.
Hearthstone Reveals 6 New Sunken Treasures from Voyage to the Sunken City
I think we can all agree that stormwind was an anomaly, a botch to put it mildly. Team5 wanted the questlines to shine so they designed each and every quest in stormwind to feature a win condition that ultimately took it too far. From my understanding, it went way past what they originally intended, and none of us predicted how powerful and impactful the questlines ultimately became. It took 3 nerfs within a month, that's unprecedented.
Far as Sunken City's own cards are concerned, I think there's enough stuff so far to keep me interested in the expansion: Lady S'theno, nellie, Emergency Maneuvers, murlock deck, Queen Azshara. If the questlines starts running rampant (which Im not certain that they will, having lost a chuck of their good cards) I'd imagine team5 nerfing them down again.
Also, I'd point out again that team5 have this habit of leaving the best cards for last. We didn't even see galakrond shaman until the end of the reveal, and again none of us have predicted that it'll take over the entire meta for the 1 week before it got nerfed.
On the subject of card redundancy, I think its pretty much clear that that has been happening throughout hearthstone's history. Only under very specific circumstances does previous expansion cards matter more than the current one, like the ungoro-kobolds vs witchwood-rastakhans. Otherwise, the result has been fairly consistent - As the years move forward, previous expansions loses relevance. How many barrens cards are still being played today?
Its not specifically in hearthstone too. I still have old Pokemon tcg cards that are completely redundant today (My old machamp used to do 60 damage and at that time it was insane. Now even an unevolved pokemon can do it). But in its lifetime I got some worth out of my money. I dont think its fair to say money has been wasted if you have had a good deal of time playing it.
Hearthstone Reveals 6 New Sunken Treasures from Voyage to the Sunken City
I think you're more referring to the mechanics of the expansion being weak rather than the entirety of it because after looking at the cards again, there are a lot of damn good ones. The problem with Rastakhan's Rumble is that not only overkill is weak, but the cards are just weak in general. If you would compare the cards in RR and in Voyage, I think you would absolutely agree that Voyage is far stronger than RR.
If you want to judge the overall impact of an expansion, you need to look at all of the individual cards and their interaction with other cards not just the specific mechanics of it. And I think so far Voyage is looking pretty fine.
Volcanomancy is a New Mage Card Revealed by DaoGe for Voyage to the Sunken City
I'd love to see this effect also as "secretly choose one minion".
Hearthstone Reveals 6 New Sunken Treasures from Voyage to the Sunken City
Well argued. However, I would respond that the conditions aren't as different as you say. Sunken City, while part of a new year, also comes on the back of a string of powerful expansions just like RR did. The entire Alliance vs Horde cycle has yielded some fairly unhealthy designs, particularly on the Questline end. While my perspective is admittedly skewed on the topic as I'm a Wild player, I'd imagine these Questlines will continue to have a presence in Standard as well, and the designers will have to tiptoe pretty exensively not to give any of these Questlines any tools. We already know Hunter is getting some fuel for their Questline, and who knows what the Core set will bring to the others. In that environment, a new set has to be doing something fairly spectacular to present an appealing alternative to doing the same old from United in Stormwind and I just don't feel VtSS is doing that so far. It's self-contained mechanics mean that if the set cards underperform as they stands, they're pretty much dead in the water (lol puns) for the future as well cause they don't interact particularly well with upcoming sets. Perhaps when the 2021 sets rotate and the meta gets truly powered down, Sunken City may float back up in relevance (I crack myself up sometimes) but currently it feels dead on arrival barring a few exceptions.
It's not necessarily a problem for the expansion itself but it is a problem for the future. If design is this self-contained too often, the end result is a bigger part of your collection becomes redundant as new expansions release (moreso than usual), which in turn means higher costs for remaining competitive and a general feeling from the playerbase that they've wasted their money. That's the type of dissatisfaction you can't keep on accumulating for long.
As for Colossal, what I mean is...it feels somewhat like Jungle Giants. In practice the Quest is pretty meh in terms of power level even with the variety of tools Wild offers. It's bombastic in concept (stuff my deck full of giant monsters and draw and play 38 mana of stuff on turn 6-7) but in practice not that interesting, as your deck is often choking on big, clunky cards that rot in your hand if drawn before Quest completion, and you mostly rely on a handful of crucial, low-cost, high-attack minions to get your Quest moving. If those end up buried midway through your deck, your deck does very little. It's exciting, just impractical. A lot of these Colossal minions feel the same way. Xhilag of the Abyss is exciting in theory but the tentacles are never gonna last a turn and the EoT effect isn't impactful enough past the raw on-board stats. Colaque is just a giant idiot. Can be fun if you find ways to copy the shell etc. In fact all of the Colossal minions get pretty fun when you try some copying, mana cheating or bouncing shenanigans on them. It's really a Timmy mechanic through and through. And maybe they will make a splash as a top-end option, even with the Alterac Valley heroes being around. But they're more exciting by their size and by the Dane/Mark McKz/Roffle bombastic shenanigans they invite rather than sheer practicality in ending the game.
Hearthstone Reveals 6 New Sunken Treasures from Voyage to the Sunken City
Sunken Scroll does not specify that the spells have to be Shaman, but rather "from your class". So if the base spell is randomly generated somehow, you could be potentially gipped out of some cards (like Mage being without Nature, or Priest not having...well, much of anything beyond Whirlpool).
Not saying the card is bad; just could lead to a feelsbad moment for someone out there.
Emergency Maneuvers is a New Hunter Card Revealed by Tars for Voyage to the Sunken City
I'm not clear how this secret works with Colossal minions, which spawn their appendages no matter how they're summoned.
i.e. Other player kills my Colossal. A new one is summoned, and is dormant. Are its appendages: (a) Summoned right away, and usable right away? (b) Summoned right away, but made dormant, like the main card? (c) Not summoned until the main card wakes up, next turn?
I'm guessing it's (a), based on the behavior of dormant cards with a battlecry (like The Darkness), which trigger their battlecries when they're played, not when they awaken. But of course, Colossal's effect isn't exactly a battlecry, so I'm not sure.