Getting two specific cards in the mulligan (or in the next two draws) is not that unreasonable. As for why it's better to play a minion on turn 1 with a tempo oriented deck, surely you can see that the point of playing the First Mate is that it's a body on the board. Turn 1 quest does nothing for the board state. Turn 1 First Mate does. AND you have the advantage of a possible huge upside with the move I mentioned in my comment. I apologize for the patronizing tone, but you also seem to think I don't have a valid point. When you responded as though I hadn't considered that the quest has to be played, it irritated me that you assumed I had no idea what I was talking about, when in fact, I do.
I played a lot of pirate warrior back in the day - having a First mate down turn 1 has ALWAYS been the best possible turn 1 play with the deck. That should still be true, even if you're trying to focus on swinging weapons. And even back then, I did not always swing on turn 1 with the rusty hook.
Sure no problem. I see your point, I just don't see how it can be *consistently* better.
I think your point is absolutely indisputable in ol' PW: without the Quest, mate is one of the best turn-1 plays, if not the best entirely.
But you can test yourself, having the quest, the mate and upgrade together in your mulligan is a VERY unlikely occurrence. The quest is actually forced in your hand, but you can still replace it with a random jolly card, and have a series of mulligans: see how often the 3/3 happens.
So, since that occurrence is unreliable (although surely better when it happens), in general, your turn-1 would be: 1/1 1/3 and (1) left (because you played the Quest). At that point your ping is pretty bad (and/or you'd have to sacrifice the mate itself), so having a Woodcutter's Axe instead would be just as good to clear something (say a totem or a murloc), and recuperate the Tempo loss caused by the Quest.
The axe is also much better later in the game, in case you simply have to burst some face damage, and it has synergy with Forge of Souls. This is not true for the mate.
So I don't think your point is invalid, but I don't see the mate being so superior as to warrant a 2x in the average scenario of this deck.
For related reasons, I feel much safer with a Rabid Worgen for recuperating the Tempo loss caused by the Quest, or simply to place a body that cannot be easily pinged away. The rush synergy with Axe is just a bonus.
I'm sure you can come up with a variation with 2x Mates and maybe Southsea Captain or Nightmare Amalgam, and I'm sure it'll be good enough. I just don't think it'll be so clearly superior to this one.
Hey thanks for your comment, my first one ever lol. We don't really need Dorian here because we have specific tasks for our plot twists one is to expand our deck and one is for removal. 1-1s are not gonna help with that. The point of the deck is to whittle your opponents resources down then play Rafaam. i'm also not sure Fel lord is needed so might swap maybe for another big minion
I tried king phaoris in this deck but have a guess what the expired merchants kept giving me, thanks for looking anyway
Getting two specific cards in the mulligan, or in the first two draws, is not that unreasonable. As for why it's better to play a minion on turn 1 with a tempo oriented deck, surely you can see that the point of playing the First Mate is that it's a body on the board. Turn 1 quest does nothing for the board state. Turn 1 First Mate does. AND you have the advantage of a possible huge upside with the move I mentioned in my comment. I apologize for the patronizing tone, but you seem to think I don't have a valid point. When you responded as though I hadn't considered that the quest has to be played, it irritated me that you assumed I had no idea what I was talking about, when in fact, I do.
I played a lot of pirate warrior back in the day - having a First mate down turn 1 has ALWAYS been the best possible turn 1 play with the deck. That should still be true, even if you're trying to focus on swinging weapons. And even back then, I did not always swing on turn 1 with the rusty hook.
Summary: If you play N'Zoth's First Mate on turn 1, and wait to play the quest turn 2 and then swing, here's what you get:
-A 1/1 pirate on the board (if it sticks it can help to activate your Bloodsail Cultist - unlikely, but possible)
-A 1/3 weapon that could possibly be upgraded, and which can trigger a 3/3 2-drop with the Bloodsail Raider if you have the coin.
-3 guaranteed swings toward the quest, and possibly a 4th (unless your opponent oozes it, which is fine, since that means they didn't ooze your higher attack weapons)
If you play the quest on turn 1 you get ... none of that. You equip a weapon turn 2, and still have no minion on the board until turn 3, unless you coin a 1-drop on turn 2.
Well for me the free legendary came when I logged in which hasn't happened for them - they checked their collection also and no new cards - they only have 1 legendary (Alexstraza, at least its a good one!) So it isn't due to a miss click, they just haven't been given them.
They've completed the tutorial - I cant think of any reason they haven't got the SOU free leg unless there's a rank you need to achieve and anything before that rank is unofficially classified as tutorial or summat.
In terms of decks that turned out to be surprisingly bad "in this expansion", I would say:
- Bomb Warrior; everyone decried how this would ruin every highlander deck. And that just didnt happen, like at all
- Quest Mage; some people thought this would be strong, some didn't. It turned out not to be. Maybe not a huge surprise, but there we are.
- Mech Hunter; This meta is full of control and Ctrl Warrior in particular is even stronger. Mech Hunter (thankfully) has mostly died a death now.
- Quest Paladin; There were some impressive Theorycrafted decks that simply didn't work out. The deck is surprisingly not as good as hoped, mainly because it runs out of steam too fast and is slow to get going properly
- Any Highkeeper Ra deck; As yet I've still to see this work for any deck consistently. There's a couple of really meme-y versions out there, but they struggle
Well, they don't mention swarm or mechs in Hunter table, so one might think they are not out of place in Hunter.
Real issue is, that Class Identity table they posted is utter trash. Just keywords thrown at random. The only ones with real meaning are the weaknesses. The rest is bound to be blown up in one expansion or another...
PS: people might like Mechs, and i think Magnetic was great design, but they simply pushed the whole tribe beyond what was reasonable. It's currently all over and out of place flavor-wise. Few strategical Mechs would have been much better.
A mate of mine is currently at level 25 and has had an account for a few months now. They havn't received the free SOU legendary quest or the SOU quest - this is meant to be given on login within the first 90 days of the expansion release.
Does anybody know if he needs to hit a level e.g. 20 before receiving this?
The odd ones are Wild Bloodstinger (which is still a beast) and the quest ,Unseal the Vault which, unlike the previous one that went with hunter's affinity with one drops, doesn't seem to fit at all...
Hunters are not known to swarm, don't usually wait for 20 minions to be summoned before killing the opponent and rarely has a board of tokens that sticks (it's usually 1/1s)
Now if it looked like Dinomancy and said "give your beasts +x/+x " (I leave the figures, costs and details to pros of balance) I would love it
Right now it seems Mech hunter will still rule supreme even though the class has nothing to do with mechs.
I'm not surprised regarding quests because I knew bad quests were going to be bad. I got a lot of hate for pointing them all out on their respective discussion threads but now I get to say "I told you so". You won't believe how personally offended and rude people get when you criticize their favorite cards. It's not my fault Blizzard made your card low power level; I'm just explaining the fact
As for actual decks, bomb warrior is doing surprisingly badly for being a counter to highlander decks. On the other hand, aggro and control warrior are surprisingly powerful and employing some pretty neat cards that I didn't think would go in the respective decks. Everything else is within my expectations (even the murloc invasion and inner fire no-quest priest being mid tier due to how broken Amet and psychopomp are)
Although not 100% sure, my guess is: If you draw Reno first, followed by Dinomancer, Reno might be discarded. Reason is: Game registers the "firsts", similar to this scenario: You have Piloted Shredder and Piloted Sky Golem on-board. Shredder is played first, then Sky Golem, and wherever you put your minions is irrelevant in any matter. Mage played Flamestrike and your Mechs will start to pop-up: First Shredder, then Sky Golem. Unless an exclusive rule that I have never heard of states otherwise, discarding your lowest-highest card should work the way I have illustrated.
Deathrattles do occurr in the order they were played if killed at the same time, but discard mechanics associated with lowest or highest cost dont consider when you draw the card, it choses at random.
This question has already been awsered many times by famous streamers, pro players and websites like reddit.
In case of tye in numerical values (higher cost minion), the chosen option will always be random. As long as you have both in hand, you have a 50/50 chance to discar either reno or dinomancer.
Although not 100% sure, my guess is: If you draw Reno first, followed by Dinomancer, Reno might be discarded. Reason is: Game registers the "firsts", similar to this scenario: You have Piloted Shredder and Piloted Sky Golem on-board. Shredder is played first, then Sky Golem, and wherever you put your minions is irrelevant in any matter. Mage played Flamestrike and your Mechs will start to pop-up: First Shredder, then Sky Golem. Unless an exclusive rule that I have never heard of states otherwise, discarding your lowest-highest card should work the way I have illustrated.
Fan Creations Tutorial - How to Use HearthCards #1: The Basics
hehe this is my creation FeelsGoodMan
Sure no problem. I see your point, I just don't see how it can be *consistently* better.
I think your point is absolutely indisputable in ol' PW: without the Quest, mate is one of the best turn-1 plays, if not the best entirely.
But you can test yourself, having the quest, the mate and upgrade together in your mulligan is a VERY unlikely occurrence. The quest is actually forced in your hand, but you can still replace it with a random jolly card, and have a series of mulligans: see how often the 3/3 happens.
So, since that occurrence is unreliable (although surely better when it happens), in general, your turn-1 would be: 1/1 1/3 and (1) left (because you played the Quest). At that point your ping is pretty bad (and/or you'd have to sacrifice the mate itself), so having a Woodcutter's Axe instead would be just as good to clear something (say a totem or a murloc), and recuperate the Tempo loss caused by the Quest.
The axe is also much better later in the game, in case you simply have to burst some face damage, and it has synergy with Forge of Souls. This is not true for the mate.
So I don't think your point is invalid, but I don't see the mate being so superior as to warrant a 2x in the average scenario of this deck.
For related reasons, I feel much safer with a Rabid Worgen for recuperating the Tempo loss caused by the Quest, or simply to place a body that cannot be easily pinged away. The rush synergy with Axe is just a bonus.
I'm sure you can come up with a variation with 2x Mates and maybe Southsea Captain or Nightmare Amalgam, and I'm sure it'll be good enough. I just don't think it'll be so clearly superior to this one.
Highlander Face Hunter
Thanks
Hey thanks for your comment, my first one ever lol. We don't really need Dorian here because we have specific tasks for our plot twists one is to expand our deck and one is for removal. 1-1s are not gonna help with that. The point of the deck is to whittle your opponents resources down then play Rafaam. i'm also not sure Fel lord is needed so might swap maybe for another big minion
I tried king phaoris in this deck but have a guess what the expired merchants kept giving me, thanks for looking anyway
A Symphony of Frost (Jaina) and Flame (Reno)
Sorry :)
Getting two specific cards in the mulligan, or in the first two draws, is not that unreasonable. As for why it's better to play a minion on turn 1 with a tempo oriented deck, surely you can see that the point of playing the First Mate is that it's a body on the board. Turn 1 quest does nothing for the board state. Turn 1 First Mate does. AND you have the advantage of a possible huge upside with the move I mentioned in my comment. I apologize for the patronizing tone, but you seem to think I don't have a valid point. When you responded as though I hadn't considered that the quest has to be played, it irritated me that you assumed I had no idea what I was talking about, when in fact, I do.
I played a lot of pirate warrior back in the day - having a First mate down turn 1 has ALWAYS been the best possible turn 1 play with the deck. That should still be true, even if you're trying to focus on swinging weapons. And even back then, I did not always swing on turn 1 with the rusty hook.
Summary: If you play N'Zoth's First Mate on turn 1, and wait to play the quest turn 2 and then swing, here's what you get:
-A 1/1 pirate on the board (if it sticks it can help to activate your Bloodsail Cultist - unlikely, but possible)
-A 1/3 weapon that could possibly be upgraded, and which can trigger a 3/3 2-drop with the Bloodsail Raider if you have the coin.
-3 guaranteed swings toward the quest, and possibly a 4th (unless your opponent oozes it, which is fine, since that means they didn't ooze your higher attack weapons)
If you play the quest on turn 1 you get ... none of that. You equip a weapon turn 2, and still have no minion on the board until turn 3, unless you coin a 1-drop on turn 2.
A Symphony of Frost (Jaina) and Flame (Reno)
Wow, you are too fast 😄 Let me finish the guide first. Then, I will answer your question.
EDIT: Not at all, really. However, it doesn't hurt to have extra value, don't you think?
New(ish) player not receiving SOU free legendary
Well for me the free legendary came when I logged in which hasn't happened for them - they checked their collection also and no new cards - they only have 1 legendary (Alexstraza, at least its a good one!) So it isn't due to a miss click, they just haven't been given them.
They've completed the tutorial - I cant think of any reason they haven't got the SOU free leg unless there's a rank you need to achieve and anything before that rank is unofficially classified as tutorial or summat.
Surprisingly bad decks?
In terms of decks that turned out to be surprisingly bad "in this expansion", I would say:
- Bomb Warrior; everyone decried how this would ruin every highlander deck. And that just didnt happen, like at all
- Quest Mage; some people thought this would be strong, some didn't. It turned out not to be. Maybe not a huge surprise, but there we are.
- Mech Hunter; This meta is full of control and Ctrl Warrior in particular is even stronger. Mech Hunter (thankfully) has mostly died a death now.
- Quest Paladin; There were some impressive Theorycrafted decks that simply didn't work out. The deck is surprisingly not as good as hoped, mainly because it runs out of steam too fast and is slow to get going properly
- Any Highkeeper Ra deck; As yet I've still to see this work for any deck consistently. There's a couple of really meme-y versions out there, but they struggle
A Symphony of Frost (Jaina) and Flame (Reno)
Is Echo of Medivh essential?
[SoU] Mill Warlock
Thank you! When I saw Octosari, I immediatly thought that he could be a powerful mill tool :)
New(ish) player not receiving SOU free legendary
I don't think rank is a requirement for freebies. It would make no sense.
Are you sure your friend didn't misclick the notification, and still have an unnoticed Quest in the collection?
[SoU] Mill Warlock
Nice way to get around the use of Emperor Thaurissan, well done!
Saviours of Uldum and class identity.
Well, they don't mention swarm or mechs in Hunter table, so one might think they are not out of place in Hunter.
Real issue is, that Class Identity table they posted is utter trash. Just keywords thrown at random. The only ones with real meaning are the weaknesses. The rest is bound to be blown up in one expansion or another...
PS: people might like Mechs, and i think Magnetic was great design, but they simply pushed the whole tribe beyond what was reasonable. It's currently all over and out of place flavor-wise. Few strategical Mechs would have been much better.
New(ish) player not receiving SOU free legendary
Hi there,
A mate of mine is currently at level 25 and has had an account for a few months now. They havn't received the free SOU legendary quest or the SOU quest - this is meant to be given on login within the first 90 days of the expansion release.
Does anybody know if he needs to hit a level e.g. 20 before receiving this?
Saviours of Uldum and class identity.
I love the shaman quest. Now you can generate two cards from each battlecry instead of one. What great class design! /s
Saviours of Uldum and class identity.
A bit before the release of SoU we got a very nice article discussing each classes strengths and weaknesses.
https://outof.cards/hearthstone/148-keeping-hearthstone-unique-class-identity-breakdown
I'd like your opinion on what was said and what we got.
I personally mostly play hunter and from what I saw most of the hunter cards supports what the article said
Hyena Alpha fits both beast and secret synergies,
Swarm of Locusts just as Unleash the Hounds fits the beast synergies
The odd ones are Wild Bloodstinger (which is still a beast) and the quest ,Unseal the Vault which, unlike the previous one that went with hunter's affinity with one drops, doesn't seem to fit at all...
Hunters are not known to swarm, don't usually wait for 20 minions to be summoned before killing the opponent and rarely has a board of tokens that sticks (it's usually 1/1s)
Now if it looked like Dinomancy and said "give your beasts +x/+x " (I leave the figures, costs and details to pros of balance) I would love it
Right now it seems Mech hunter will still rule supreme even though the class has nothing to do with mechs.
Surprisingly bad decks?
I'm not surprised regarding quests because I knew bad quests were going to be bad. I got a lot of hate for pointing them all out on their respective discussion threads but now I get to say "I told you so". You won't believe how personally offended and rude people get when you criticize their favorite cards. It's not my fault Blizzard made your card low power level; I'm just explaining the fact
As for actual decks, bomb warrior is doing surprisingly badly for being a counter to highlander decks. On the other hand, aggro and control warrior are surprisingly powerful and employing some pretty neat cards that I didn't think would go in the respective decks. Everything else is within my expectations (even the murloc invasion and inner fire no-quest priest being mid tier due to how broken Amet and psychopomp are)
How does 'discarding your lowest/highest' work?
Deathrattles do occurr in the order they were played if killed at the same time, but discard mechanics associated with lowest or highest cost dont consider when you draw the card, it choses at random.
How does 'discarding your lowest/highest' work?
This question has already been awsered many times by famous streamers, pro players and websites like reddit.
In case of tye in numerical values (higher cost minion), the chosen option will always be random. As long as you have both in hand, you have a 50/50 chance to discar either reno or dinomancer.
hope this helps.
The Pepper Thread - Share Some Good Vibes!
Try adding ".png" at the end of your link.
[SoU] Mill Warlock
Very nice deck idea! I love such mad and unexpected decks ;-)
I feel lack of Dorian here
How does 'discarding your lowest/highest' work?
Although not 100% sure, my guess is: If you draw Reno first, followed by Dinomancer, Reno might be discarded. Reason is: Game registers the "firsts", similar to this scenario: You have Piloted Shredder and Piloted Sky Golem on-board. Shredder is played first, then Sky Golem, and wherever you put your minions is irrelevant in any matter. Mage played Flamestrike and your Mechs will start to pop-up: First Shredder, then Sky Golem. Unless an exclusive rule that I have never heard of states otherwise, discarding your lowest-highest card should work the way I have illustrated.
Uldum Essentials - Concept Art Spotlight
BEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEEES!!!!