I can recall playing against a fair number of Mistwraith decks shortly after the Kalista rework. I don't know if those decks are still at all popular, but they were already pretty good thanks to the fact that Shadow Isles had been such a strong region for so much of the game's existence, which in turn made playing a mostly or entirely SI deck very easy to do. In my mind, that was always the funny thing about a card like Wraithcaller. It generates a lot of stats for its cost, and it's allowed to do that because the Allegiance keyword is supposed to be something of a drawback - you're getting a powerful effect by trading away access to some second region (or splashing a second region but risking a misfire). But for SI, that really hasn't been a drawback at all.
Risen Mists seems like a really potent finisher for a deck like that - in the late game, summon one or two massive fearsome units at burst speed (potentially buffing your board at the same time) and then open attack. Because the Allegiance "penalty" is not a uniform offset of a card's power level, Wraithcaller is probably a little too good for what it's supposed to be. If this deck becomes really strong, that's the first place I'd expect to see a nerf.
More generally, though, it seems like Allegiance is not something Riot has a great handle on. They've struggled with balancing Basilisk Rider and Vanguard Bannerman, and other Allegiance cards like Kinkou Wayfinder and Yordle Grifter have been a big part of meta decks from time to time. The bonus effects probably need to be a bit more narrow to ensure they aren't so easily abused.
I think they made the right call in not cramming too many unique elements and sticking with the Saurok. I'm always happy to hear how much the team cares about the lore, and I think the toutolians are a big enough contribution as it is, seeing as they had a heavy presence in WoW during the Battle for Azeroth expansion these last two years. Seeing them in game felt stratifying because there was such a spotlight on them in Un'goro. That spotlight and satisfaction would have been diluted if they had to share it with another new race at the same time.
Argent Braggart is 100% going to end up on the nerf list eventually, that card is quite possibly the only reason why Libram Paladin is doing as well as it is.
Alright, I finally went through my whole collection and dusted all the duplicates and goldens that aren't likely to be nerfed soon. Lo and behold, I got enough dust together to craft your list and the Pure Libram Paladin meta deck.
Thank you so much for sharing this, your deck is great fun and competitive enough not to get too frustrated playing it. I only wish Xarkkal was still around, he surely would have enjoyed this.
Happy to hear that. I hope you won't be disappointed in the long run.
After Priest and Shaman, it is Hunter's turn to have its core sets revised. I have all classes ready. However, neoguli already dealt with Warlock, Druid, Rogue, Warrior, and Paladin. For the moment, I will focus on classes that weren't modified yet.
In terms of core set quality, Hunter is above average, although its sets aren't as good as Mage's or Rogue's. The main issue with Hunter's current set is its one-dimensionality. Up to 2017, Hunter was a one-dimensional class with an extremely linear gameplay. It had only one viable archetype (at best), oscillating between face and midrange.
After 2017, internal diversity increased: Egg, Cube, No-minion, Big, etc... Deathstalker Rexxar enabled late-game-oriented Hunter archetypes. Big Beast synergies enabled non-linear playstyles. One major constraint, as Blizz themselves noticed, is Hunter's lack of card draw. Lack of card draw intrinsically limits a class' design space. However Blizz developed workarounds such as card generation (Rhok'delar)or costly but powerful tutoring ([Hearthstone Card (Scavenger Ingenuity) Not Found], Ursatron) as opposed to general card draw, or "Recruit" mechanics.
Directions
General directions I follow for the core sets
Blizzard's official post on class identity is weird. It mixes class mechanics with strengths and weaknesses so most of the stuff doesn't make sense. The way I proceeded is completely different. I started by listing what should be the primary and secondary mechanics of the class, the strengths and weaknesses of the class as well as the archetypes available to it should follow from this list.
I say "core sets" a lot, but the Basic and Classic set are NOT interchangeable in their functions.
The Basic set is the spine of the class. It ensures the class' viability and establishes its primary mechanics.
Must be simple. Most cards must have 2 lines of text or less. Only simple keywords.
Versatile to support multiple playstyles
Minimal kit of everything a class needs to be viable (card draw; removal; direct damage; good standalone minions;...) even if not part of identity
Fine if slightly more OP than what you would expect from expansions
The Classic set is the limbs of the class. It ensures the class' internal diversity and estables its secondary mechanics.
Presents the more "complex" mechanics of the game (Deathrattle, etc...)
Because Classic packs are bought, there should be a sense of progression
Unlike the Basic set, Classic cards should be slightly below average to let room for expansions
About tribal synergies, each minion type has its own identity
Beasts
All size of minions
Good standalone value
Buff each other a lot
Each type of Beast has its subtheme (Bears=Taunt; Boars=Rush; Cats=Stealth; Wolves=buff other beasts; etc...)
Most common type of minions, as such their identity is less precise
Demons (Warlock & DH)
All size of minions
Powerful but with a drawback (taking damage; discard; ...)
Dragons
Medium to big minions
"If you're holding a Dragon"
Hand synergy
Lots of legendaries
4/12 statline as a signature
Elementals
All size of minions
"If you played an Elemental last turn"
Value generation
Battlecries
Mechs
Mechs were the focus of only 2 expansions (GvG and Boomsday) but they're otherwise a rare tribe and have no central identity!
Murlocs
Small minions
Board-wide buffs for other Murlocs
Relies on early-game snowballing. If allowed to stay on the board, they become nearly unstoppable
Pirates
Small to medium minions
Weapon synergy
Lots of direct damage
Totems (Shaman)
Small minions
0 attack with some exceptions
Powerful ongoing effects (aura/end of turn/whenever)
Tribal synergies are part of a class primary identity in only 3 cases
Beasts for Hunter
Totems for Shaman
Demons for Walocks and DHs
All other class-tribe associations are mostly a matter of coincidence as these tribes happen to fit in the class identity (eg pirates for Warrior/Rogue)
About which keywords I chose to keep in the core sets
Charge vs Rush - As you know, Charge is a dangerous keyword. This is why Rush was introduced...however there are a few cards that were meant to be finishers that wouldn't make sense without Rush. I will replace Charge with Rush on all core cards with Charge (and tweak stats accordingly) EXCEPT when Charge is on a legendary minion. There are 4 legendary minions with Charge in the classic set and they will keep Charge
Discover - Disover offers a choice between cards that are in standard. Due to how easy Discover can become skewed when the right cards are printed, there will be no Discover cards in my core sets.
Poisonous - There were originally no Poisonous cards in the Basic set before the introduction of [Hearthstone Card (Master Poisoner) Not Found]. I will therefore also have poisonous cards in my basic set
Lifesteal - There are currently no Lifesteal cards in the core sets. However the keyword is simple and I will therefore introduce some.
Hunter class identity
I tried not to steer away too much from what Blizzard defined for the class, although there are definitely some directions I disagree with and went against. I will signal it when it is the case.
PRIMARY MECHANICS
BEASTS (big and small): All classes have tribal synergies, but only in Hunter is this particular tribal synergy so central.
SMORC : Face is the place.
DEATHRATTLES : Through cards that trigger them.
SECONDARY MECHANICS
SECRETS - Hunter is a class with Secrets. Unlike Mage secrets (which are defensive) and Paladin secrets (which are situational), Hunter secrets are tempo-focused in nature, and helps you keep the lead on the board.
SUMMONING SPELLS : Hunter has a lot of them. This is what allows the class to have minionless archetypes.
TUTORING - Hunter has few "undiscriminated" card draw but has a lot of cards to tutor exactly the cards they need.
HANDBUFF - Alongside other "Grimy Goon" classes, Hunter has lots of handbuff. Hunter's handbuff tends to be focused on
PARTIAL REMOVALS - Hunter AOE removals tend to be very partial and position-hased. See Powershot.
Hunter is GOOD at
Direct damage : Through spells, charge minions, weapons, and of course Steady Shot. Face is the place.
Horizontal pressure : Mostly through summoning spells.
Vertical pressure : Big Beasts and ways to cheat and buff them.
Hunter is AVERAGE at
Tempo
Single-target removals
Board clears
Hunter is BAD at
Card draw : This is what keep the class in check. However, tutor cards (as opposed to generic card draw) is common.
Multi-target removals : Hunter has a few small and situational board clears ("shots"), but no big one.
Value generation (barring the anomalous data point that is Deathstalker Rexxar).
Deadly Shot(move to Classic from Basic) - The effect feels like a basic effect. It needs to be here.
Reload(custom) - Every class needs card draw to be viable. This doesn't mesh well with the "no card draw" identity of Blizzard. However, Reload strikes a compromise between the necessity of card draw and Hunter's class identity. By limiting the number of cards in your hand, Reload is effective without allowing Hunter to hoard cards like some other classes do.
Animal Companion(artwork changed; effect made more explicit) - The card is functionnaly unchanged, it still always summon Huffer, but a basic card like this needs to give new players and idea of what a "Beast companion" is. (Same reason why I don't like Shaman's HP btw).
Kill Command(artwork changed) - Like AC, I find this artwork much better. The current one is...weird. Especially since it pictures a bird but the animation clearly shows teeth.
Multi-Shot(damage increased by 1) - This will hopefully make it more polyvalent. At 4 damage, Multishot can clear a lot more stuff than before without being OP (I think).
Tundra Rhino(cost reduced to 4; gives Rush instead of Charge) - Honestly, it's a miracle that this card has been dodging nerfs and HoFing since the inception of the game given the broken combos it allows and the design space it screws up. In line with my policy of removing Charge from non-legendary cards, Thunda Rhino now only gives your beasts Rush. I also reduced its cost to (4) because it loses combo potential
Cobra Shot(from GVG 2014; cost reduced to 4) - The original 5-mana Cobra Shot was printed at a time when HS games were very linera and Face Hunter tyrannized the meta. Devs probably thought it wasn't a good idea to give FH further face damage hence the 5-mana cost. Today, however, the game is much more "non-linear" and FH has been matched in degeneracy by another kind of Hunter (that hunts Demons). It can now cost 4 and be balanced. Also put into the basic set because it's a basic effet.
Classic
Webspinner(from NAXX OUT 2014) - I strongly hesitated to put this into the Classic set due to how obiquitous it was back in the day. I still put it back because the effect really feels very "core" and the Hunter class has more internal diversity than it had in 2014 so it might not be as ubiquitous nowadays.
Scavenging Hyena(nerfed to +1/+1) - Hyena's snowball potential is waaay too good for this effect to remain core. It has been in every aggro/midrange archetypes of Hunter since the game's inception.
Unleash the Hounds(nerfed from Charge to Rush) - Follows my policy of cutting Charge of all non-legendary core cards.
[Hearthstone Card (Venomous Trap) Not Found] (from KFT 2017) - Replaces other secrets I feel weren't basic enough or too weird.
Eaglehorn Bow(stats swapped, art changed, "after" for more clarity) - At 3 attack for 3 mana, this weapon is way too good. It's also a powercreep to Fiery War Axe. At 2/3, it is still playable and of acceptable power level. Again art changed as well.
Terrorscale Stalker(from UNG 2017) - Deathrattles, and in particular DR triggers, have been establised as a Hunter archetype. Terrorscale is less risky than either Play Dead or Feign Death because of its high mana cost.
Bursting Shot(custom) - Replaces Explosive Shot which sucks. I wanted to give Hunter some form of board control for late-game oriented decks, while keeping the flavor of Shots only touching certain minions.
Abominable Bowman(from KFT 2017) - Although the card has never seen competitive play, it is a very good building brick for cool but non-degenerate Big Beast decks
Call of the Wild(from WOTOG 2016; re-nerfed to 9 mana) - Honestly CotW is such an obvious and basic effect that it can't possibly NOT be in the core set. CotW originally costed 8. It was nerfed to 9 mana because HS games were fair back in the day. They they rebuffed it to 8 mana because powercreep. However, Classic cards needs to be fair, which is why I'm reversing the cost AGAIN.
Tracking - Waaay too complicated for a basic card. Also goes against the rule of "no Discover in the core sets" (though it's not strictly a Discover).
Starving Buzzard - Unplayable since it was nerfed, unbalanceable effect because remember: Hunter card draw bad.
Hunter's Mark - This is a Paladin effect, not a Hunter effect.
Misdirection - Too random and situtational to be core.
Freezing Trap - The effect (1) is too OP (2) is weird for a card with "freezing" in its name (3) doesn't fit hunter (4) is frustrating when it affects a 9+cost minion.
You left Tundra Rhino as it is!? It's already a miracle this guy has never been nerfed. Rhino is waaay too dangerous to be a classic card. It has never been broken because hunter used to lack combo abilites, and because I guess Blizz designed their expansions around it, but still.
Honestly the Saurok would probably be good enough to fit a more aggressive role if they needed it for the setting. I wouldn’t be opposed to another Un’Goro set one day with the Tortollans versus the Saurok. Maybe add in a plant tribe as the set’s new thing to give relevance to some of the older Un’Goro cards too
Early burn has definitely been nerfed but Yasuo / Swain combo just keeps popping up it’s like every 3rd match. Now I only see Karma every 15 games or so. What are people using to deal with them? Maybe once the new cards drop they will be easier to deal with. I dropped a ruination to wipe the broad after he was out of mana next turn dropped Hec who immediately got stunned. And then he summoned Legion General.
What the hell is up with Wild? I'm queuing into nothing but Reno Priests. Why did they have to buff this archetype again? As if it wasn't cancer already.
Alright, I finally went through my whole collection and dusted all the duplicates and goldens that aren't likely to be nerfed soon. Lo and behold, I got enough dust together to craft your list and the Pure Libram Paladin meta deck.
Thank you so much for sharing this, your deck is great fun and competitive enough not to get too frustrated playing it. I only wish Xarkkal was still around, he surely would have enjoyed this.
Now I'm usually not one to abuse the forums to promotes my half baked homebrews (that's a lie, I have done that quite a lot, but I'm trying to stop), but this is a very special occasion.
When one does not just spam threads with deck lists and that's it, but starts a meaningful discussion, feel free to promote your decks this way :)
I've been playing since LoE and finally hit standard legend earlier this year after being a dad legend player for a good while before. It's nice to be able to mess around with less competitive decks in dumpster legend without that niggling voice telling to focus on climbing, and to know you've maxed out your rewards for the season. I'm also having a go at the wild ladder now - hit r5 this morning - and just enjoying the game before next week's ladder reset.
And now that I've hit it I don't feel like I need to ever again. I could go after the rewards but I don't want to play to the point where I experience burnout.
This is just another question that can only be answered by someone from the dev team. All else is speculation, and a pretty impossible one at that. Its just not possible to somehow gauge a formula at something that can be from equal percentage to discover, to slightly skewed towards class cards.
...
Actually it is perfectly possible, and even easy if you have the patience. All you need to do is discover enough times with a given card pool and count how many times you see each possible card. That will give you a set of probabilities for each card, and it doesn't matter how it gets there - all the matters is what it ends up at.
Of course I don't have that much patience, so I tested the easiest one: how often does Draconic Lackey present Waxadred as an option? As the only dragon in rogue, and a near endless supply of lackeys, this should be a simple question to answer with enough confidence to guess at the algorithm used.
I'm doing this against the innkeeper (Wild), so the pool is 1 dargon in rogue and 42 in neutral.
Hypothesis 1: Every card has equal likelihood of being presented, irrespective of class.
Here the odds of NOT finding Waxadred are (42/43)*(41/42)*(40/43) = 40/43, so the probability to see ol' Waxy in a discover is 3/43 = 6.97%. Or equivalently, you expect to see him about once every 14 discovers.
Hypothesis 2: Class vs Neutral is chosen before the card
In this case, the question reduces to the likelihood of not choosing a class card. If that likelihood is 50% per option, you would have (1/2)^3 = 1/8 as the probability to be presented with 3 neutrals. I.e. you would see Waxy in a whopping 7 out of every 8 discovers in both Standard and Wild!
Results from testing
Admittedly I got bored pretty quickly, and I only ended up doing 12 discovers, in which I saw Waxadred exactly once, which is perfectly consistent with Hypothesis 1.
The sample size is too small for that to be taken as proof, and perhaps Hypothesis 2 should use a lower probability, but I see no reason why it would. For it to give 1/12 to see Waxadred it would need to be at 1 - (1 - 1/12)^(1/3) = 2.86%, which is preposterously low and just as untenable a suggestion as 50% is.
So I have to conclude it is highly likely every card is weighted equally. The only way for it to be consistent with experience otherwise is for every discover pool to use a different probability of choosing between class and neutral cards, which is too complicated for next to no gain.
I've been playing since LoE and finally hit standard legend earlier this year after being a dad legend player for a good while before. It's nice to be able to mess around with less competitive decks in dumpster legend without that niggling voice telling to focus on climbing, and to know you've maxed out your rewards for the season. I'm also having a go at the wild ladder now - hit r5 this morning - and just enjoying the game before next week's ladder reset.
Interesting read - I just started a week ago and had the same Idea in regard of the Undying. So far it works well for me through different stages - but there is room for some changes because I am lacking some cards like Ruination which I have to collect yet. But in generall it is fun to play if the mulligan and the pressure of this deck works for you.
Greatest opponent so far are all the Freljord decks with massive freeze abuse
Have a look - and thanks for the content. I maybe have a try with the Bilgewater cards.
If you would've told me a year ago that I would be hitting Legend I would have doubted you. I've never played to reach legend until this month, and the reason why? I was having fun.
I casually climbed the Wild ladder using Quest Mage up until Diamond 6-7, then Scholomance Academy came out and I went ALL the way back to Diamond 10. Then I stumbled across Discard Warlock which took me to Diamond 3, then loss after loss to a different kind of Warlock got my attention. The new, big, and scary Pain Warlock took me to Legend and I got that sweet, sweet card back.
Climbing the Wild ladder was fun, and I'm glad I got to see alot of old cards I've forgotten about while climbing. Now I'm hoping for a new Format so I can see more old cards get played again.
Mistwraiths
I can recall playing against a fair number of Mistwraith decks shortly after the Kalista rework. I don't know if those decks are still at all popular, but they were already pretty good thanks to the fact that Shadow Isles had been such a strong region for so much of the game's existence, which in turn made playing a mostly or entirely SI deck very easy to do. In my mind, that was always the funny thing about a card like Wraithcaller. It generates a lot of stats for its cost, and it's allowed to do that because the Allegiance keyword is supposed to be something of a drawback - you're getting a powerful effect by trading away access to some second region (or splashing a second region but risking a misfire). But for SI, that really hasn't been a drawback at all.
Risen Mists seems like a really potent finisher for a deck like that - in the late game, summon one or two massive fearsome units at burst speed (potentially buffing your board at the same time) and then open attack. Because the Allegiance "penalty" is not a uniform offset of a card's power level, Wraithcaller is probably a little too good for what it's supposed to be. If this deck becomes really strong, that's the first place I'd expect to see a nerf.
More generally, though, it seems like Allegiance is not something Riot has a great handle on. They've struggled with balancing Basilisk Rider and Vanguard Bannerman, and other Allegiance cards like Kinkou Wayfinder and Yordle Grifter have been a big part of meta decks from time to time. The bonus effects probably need to be a bit more narrow to ensure they aren't so easily abused.
Journey to Un'Goro's Crocodile Race, Reptari, Was Scrapped in Development
I think they made the right call in not cramming too many unique elements and sticking with the Saurok. I'm always happy to hear how much the team cares about the lore, and I think the toutolians are a big enough contribution as it is, seeing as they had a heavy presence in WoW during the Battle for Azeroth expansion these last two years. Seeing them in game felt stratifying because there was such a spotlight on them in Un'goro. That spotlight and satisfaction would have been diluted if they had to share it with another new race at the same time.
Finish Your August 2020 Ranked Climb With These Top Performing Standard Hearthstone Decks
Argent Braggart is 100% going to end up on the nerf list eventually, that card is quite possibly the only reason why Libram Paladin is doing as well as it is.
I think I made Fletch happen
Happy to hear that. I hope you won't be disappointed in the long run.
Cheese's custom revamp of the HUNTER core sets!
HUNTER CORE SET REVAMP
Introduction
Neoguli's post kickstarted me to finish my own
After Priest and Shaman, it is Hunter's turn to have its core sets revised. I have all classes ready. However, neoguli already dealt with Warlock, Druid, Rogue, Warrior, and Paladin. For the moment, I will focus on classes that weren't modified yet.
In terms of core set quality, Hunter is above average, although its sets aren't as good as Mage's or Rogue's. The main issue with Hunter's current set is its one-dimensionality. Up to 2017, Hunter was a one-dimensional class with an extremely linear gameplay. It had only one viable archetype (at best), oscillating between face and midrange.
After 2017, internal diversity increased: Egg, Cube, No-minion, Big, etc... Deathstalker Rexxar enabled late-game-oriented Hunter archetypes. Big Beast synergies enabled non-linear playstyles. One major constraint, as Blizz themselves noticed, is Hunter's lack of card draw. Lack of card draw intrinsically limits a class' design space. However Blizz developed workarounds such as card generation (Rhok'delar)or costly but powerful tutoring ([Hearthstone Card (Scavenger Ingenuity) Not Found], Ursatron) as opposed to general card draw, or "Recruit" mechanics.
Directions
Blizzard's official post on class identity is weird. It mixes class mechanics with strengths and weaknesses so most of the stuff doesn't make sense. The way I proceeded is completely different. I started by listing what should be the primary and secondary mechanics of the class, the strengths and weaknesses of the class as well as the archetypes available to it should follow from this list.
I say "core sets" a lot, but the Basic and Classic set are NOT interchangeable in their functions.
About tribal synergies, each minion type has its own identity
Tribal synergies are part of a class primary identity in only 3 cases
All other class-tribe associations are mostly a matter of coincidence as these tribes happen to fit in the class identity (eg pirates for Warrior/Rogue)
About which keywords I chose to keep in the core sets
I tried not to steer away too much from what Blizzard defined for the class, although there are definitely some directions I disagree with and went against. I will signal it when it is the case.
The new core sets
COMMONS
RARES
EPICS
LEGENDARY
Justifications
Basic
Classic
Hall of Fame
Shortlisted cards
The following cards almost made it into my core sets, but didn't because there were no room left for them.
Neoguli's Custom Hunter Core Set Changes
I like most of the changes but..
Group Therapy! Need to blow off some steam? Mega salty? Here's the place!
My opponent played Geppetto as soon as he reached 8 mana (like turn 5), there is no need to say that he played guardian animals the turn before.
Geppetto drawn both Alex and Maly.
I'm dead the turn after.... Cool.
Journey to Un'Goro's Crocodile Race, Reptari, Was Scrapped in Development
Honestly the Saurok would probably be good enough to fit a more aggressive role if they needed it for the setting. I wouldn’t be opposed to another Un’Goro set one day with the Tortollans versus the Saurok. Maybe add in a plant tribe as the set’s new thing to give relevance to some of the older Un’Goro cards too
Nox / Ionia this feel stifling to anyone else?
Early burn has definitely been nerfed but Yasuo / Swain combo just keeps popping up it’s like every 3rd match. Now I only see Karma every 15 games or so. What are people using to deal with them? Maybe once the new cards drop they will be easier to deal with.
I dropped a ruination to wipe the broad after he was out of mana next turn dropped Hec who immediately got stunned. And then he summoned Legion General.
Nox just feels very strong.
Group Therapy! Need to blow off some steam? Mega salty? Here's the place!
What the hell is up with Wild? I'm queuing into nothing but Reno Priests. Why did they have to buff this archetype again? As if it wasn't cancer already.
[Game] Card Treasure Hunt (The Resurrection Attempt)
Looks like R was too impatient to wait more than a few hours and the rest of us didn't pay attention. I'm sorry!
I think I made Fletch happen
Alright, I finally went through my whole collection and dusted all the duplicates and goldens that aren't likely to be nerfed soon. Lo and behold, I got enough dust together to craft your list and the Pure Libram Paladin meta deck.
Thank you so much for sharing this, your deck is great fun and competitive enough not to get too frustrated playing it. I only wish Xarkkal was still around, he surely would have enjoyed this.
I think I made Fletch happen
When one does not just spam threads with deck lists and that's it, but starts a meaningful discussion, feel free to promote your decks this way :)
After six years of playing Hearthstone, I finally made Legend.
Congratulations! :)
Journey to Un'Goro's Crocodile Race, Reptari, Was Scrapped in Development
Tortollans were a great addition to the game, I know at least of one other person who thinks so, can you guess who it is? :D
Reptari tho, they do sound kinda meh.
After six years of playing Hearthstone, I finally made Legend.
Thank you! I got The Black Knight
And now that I've hit it I don't feel like I need to ever again. I could go after the rewards but I don't want to play to the point where I experience burnout.
After six years of playing Hearthstone, I finally made Legend.
Thank you! I was satisfying after hitting rank 1 like 2 or three times this season before I made the final push.
I got The Black Knight but I already had one so it was a free 400 dust.
Journey to Un'Goro's Crocodile Race, Reptari, Was Scrapped in Development
Mmh, not a particularly interesting tribe to me.
After six years of playing Hearthstone, I finally made Legend.
Congrats! I reached legend for the first time in Wild too, and it was a truly satisfying feeling. Enjoy it!
I also hope you got a better legendary than I did (Hogger)!
Discover Effect: What are the probabilities?
Actually it is perfectly possible, and even easy if you have the patience. All you need to do is discover enough times with a given card pool and count how many times you see each possible card. That will give you a set of probabilities for each card, and it doesn't matter how it gets there - all the matters is what it ends up at.
Of course I don't have that much patience, so I tested the easiest one: how often does Draconic Lackey present Waxadred as an option? As the only dragon in rogue, and a near endless supply of lackeys, this should be a simple question to answer with enough confidence to guess at the algorithm used.
I'm doing this against the innkeeper (Wild), so the pool is 1 dargon in rogue and 42 in neutral.
Hypothesis 1: Every card has equal likelihood of being presented, irrespective of class.
Here the odds of NOT finding Waxadred are (42/43)*(41/42)*(40/43) = 40/43, so the probability to see ol' Waxy in a discover is 3/43 = 6.97%. Or equivalently, you expect to see him about once every 14 discovers.
Hypothesis 2: Class vs Neutral is chosen before the card
In this case, the question reduces to the likelihood of not choosing a class card. If that likelihood is 50% per option, you would have (1/2)^3 = 1/8 as the probability to be presented with 3 neutrals. I.e. you would see Waxy in a whopping 7 out of every 8 discovers in both Standard and Wild!
Results from testing
Admittedly I got bored pretty quickly, and I only ended up doing 12 discovers, in which I saw Waxadred exactly once, which is perfectly consistent with Hypothesis 1.
The sample size is too small for that to be taken as proof, and perhaps Hypothesis 2 should use a lower probability, but I see no reason why it would. For it to give 1/12 to see Waxadred it would need to be at 1 - (1 - 1/12)^(1/3) = 2.86%, which is preposterously low and just as untenable a suggestion as 50% is.
So I have to conclude it is highly likely every card is weighted equally. The only way for it to be consistent with experience otherwise is for every discover pool to use a different probability of choosing between class and neutral cards, which is too complicated for next to no gain.
After six years of playing Hearthstone, I finally made Legend.
Congrats mate! What legendary did you get?
I've been playing since LoE and finally hit standard legend earlier this year after being a dad legend player for a good while before. It's nice to be able to mess around with less competitive decks in dumpster legend without that niggling voice telling to focus on climbing, and to know you've maxed out your rewards for the season. I'm also having a go at the wild ladder now - hit r5 this morning - and just enjoying the game before next week's ladder reset.
7 Off-Meta Decks Using Unpopular Scholomance Legendaries
I mean...Vectus would, at best, be a 5-mana deal 6 (if you hit double Sandtrooper) so I don't think he's even that impactful, even in face deck
[Game] Card Treasure Hunt (The Resurrection Attempt)
Chameleos?
Get Bloody, Get Paid! A Guide to Runeterra's Championless Undying - Deck Spotlight
Interesting read - I just started a week ago and had the same Idea in regard of the Undying.
So far it works well for me through different stages - but there is room for some changes because I am lacking some cards like Ruination
which I have to collect yet. But in generall it is fun to play if the mulligan and the pressure of this deck works for you.
Greatest opponent so far are all the Freljord decks with massive freeze abuse
Have a look - and thanks for the content.
I maybe have a try with the Bilgewater cards.
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After six years of playing Hearthstone, I finally made Legend.
If you would've told me a year ago that I would be hitting Legend I would have doubted you. I've never played to reach legend until this month, and the reason why? I was having fun.
I casually climbed the Wild ladder using Quest Mage up until Diamond 6-7, then Scholomance Academy came out and I went ALL the way back to Diamond 10. Then I stumbled across Discard Warlock which took me to Diamond 3, then loss after loss to a different kind of Warlock got my attention. The new, big, and scary Pain Warlock took me to Legend and I got that sweet, sweet card back.
Climbing the Wild ladder was fun, and I'm glad I got to see alot of old cards I've forgotten about while climbing. Now I'm hoping for a new Format so I can see more old cards get played again.
So what's next?