If you want control: then you probably want to look more like a classic freeze mage, with Frost Novas, Doomsayer, Tortollan Pilgrim, etc and focus on stalling the game out until the Murloc deck runs out of gas.
Here's one of the most reliable meta reports, for anyone who wants to have a look. Some pretty interesting things happening in the meta presently, particularly with regard to the newest addition to Tier 1 status, Aggro Warrior. Data Reaper Report
It also makes note that the meta is just about to get completely shaken up when the wild cards enter the standard game.
This angry amphibian gets antsy when other frogs enter it's territory, always quick to act they rush into battle to defend their turf! Okay so this is basically Pre-Nerf Patches the Pirate with Rush instead of Charge, which I'm aware is still strong, especially being an Epic (Two copies in a deck).
I went mostly for flavour over balance with this card, although being that the trigger is attached to something much harder to pull off than playing a Pirate, this shouldn't be as oppressive and swing-ey in the early game as Patches the Pirate.
I particularly like it for looking back and putting decks from the game's history into perspective. E.g. old pirate warrior is parked much closer to the aggro corner than equivalent standard decks today, while in the days of classic there simply weren't the tools to stray very far from the mid-range centre (not that we knew the triangle extended any further at the time!).
I like the visualization of the triangle quite a bit. That’s the goal of my article for sure is to demonstrate that they’re all on a spectrum across the different archetypes. I may have to steal that from ya.
Thanks for the feedback! I had briefly considered Dune Sculptor, but it makes a lot of sense in this deck over Mana Cyclone - you can just run it out on 3 mana and protect it with Taunts, hopefully gaining incremental value over several turns. Also works well with Ancient Mysteries.
I honestly had no idea about the alignment, so sorry! I write my stuff in Google Docs (where it was all left-aligned) before pasting into the OoC editor, so maybe something happened there. I'll make sure to double-check that from now on!
Well now I know what I'll play on rank 5 for the next few days.
Little advice: isn't Book of Specters better than Arcane Intellect? Your deck has 24 minions, so even a 2 mana "draw 2 discard" 1 is dope since you're aggro and you don't look for value. Moreover, I think that Fishflinger deserves a spot.
If you have time and taste for it, i say go and make a great guide! Even just putting the words down give you something back already, it's like going through your replay, you write down how a deck should be played and you might realize you sometimes miss a step here and there and this could remind you to do it corectly :)
"Ah, Thief Rogue. ... I decided to call it a Combo Deck rather than Aggro or Control, although the deck's play falls heavily into the mid-range category."
This is why I like to view archetypes as more of a tetrahedron than a triangle. Aggro, control, combo and value sit at the 4 corners and mid-range sits in the middle of them all. Really each individual deck sits somewhere in the middle, but closer to one corner than the others, and sometimes along an edge (e.g. a hypothetical combo-control hybrid that replaces a lot of card draw for removal, hoping to get the combo pieces by living long enough to draw it naturally rather than by power-drawing).
Anyway, in my mind Thief Rogue sits towards the value corner, but the nature of thief cards and the class in general mean it retains some amount of tempo (which I guess is mid-range-y aggro?). Plus the right RNG can shift a particular game towards control or combo... This is why I have always loved Thief Rogue, not only does it let you play with any and all cards, but you get to play all primary archetypes too!
Given the constraints of the article however, I agree with putting a value deck down as 'combo' (even without the multiplying Tess combos) since they both prey on control but struggle against aggro.
Very good analysis! I will add some thoughts on possible changes:
Mana Cyclone route seems good, but maybe not good enough. Feels like you would still have rather small amount of spells to really go out and i learned this myself playing some conjurers mage that not pairing the Cyclone turn with Elemental Evocation gives you so much less room to play out your turn. The 2 mana difference is a big deal. If you dont have it, you can never do the combo in the early to mid game, cause you will not get a good value out of that play.
Also, another thing i learned in a deck that aimed to generate card advantage through spells was that Dune Sculptor is an amazing -and very underrated- value generator. Can generate win conditions on his own: Kalecgos, Archmage Antonidas, Hex Lord Malacrass and so on. And not only that, a lot of mage minions are quite powerful in general.
A little pet-peeve to leave you with: for the love of the god, allign left or right, not left and right! My eyes! :D
This is one of the coolest non announcement type articles I have read here. Thank you for such an in depth discussion about taking a deck from idea to build to refinement. Well written.
Yes, I completely agree as well. As much as I like and appreciate allthe interesting articles, I feel like I am missing out on some news here sometimes.
I also want to throw in an idea since - at least for me - it is sometimes hard to find/filter important news inside the heap of awesome content. Most visits to the site or my feed reader I am short of time and just want to quickly scan for news and come back for reading articles when I am more relaxed. Maybe it is possible to label news articles somehow visually, with keyword, prefix,... to separate them from the more from feature articles.
Just bumping this, as I see vegetaz posted again today, and the post has been down voted again (not by me), suggesting another scam victim.
Does anyone have any suggestions about how this sort of behaviour can be addressed, as not only does it mean people can regularly be scammed out of 80 gold, but it damages the integrity of the site? Please share your ideas!
Traversing Azeroth - The Tower of Karazhan
My weekly's favorite read. Keep 'hem coming!
Here's some art, make a card! [Legacy Game]
Next up, a Witchwood minion that has a risk-or-reward for playing it.
Meta Breaker - Menacing Murlocs
My $0.02: I think you need to decide to either commit to aggro or control.
If you want aggro: take out everything that costs more than 4 mana except of Zilliax and look for more early board-control options like Magic Dart Frog, [Hearthstone Card (Sorcerer’s Apprentice) Not Found], Spellzerker, Arcane Missiles, Magic Trick, Ray of Frost, a 2nd Shooting Star, and then a couple of Fireballs to close plus Archmage Antonidas as a late-game Hail Mary.
If you want control: then you probably want to look more like a classic freeze mage, with Frost Novas, Doomsayer, Tortollan Pilgrim, etc and focus on stalling the game out until the Murloc deck runs out of gas.
Honest Hearthstone Cards (Game)
NEXT:
VS Data Reaper Report
Here's one of the most reliable meta reports, for anyone who wants to have a look. Some pretty interesting things happening in the meta presently, particularly with regard to the newest addition to Tier 1 status, Aggro Warrior. Data Reaper Report
It also makes note that the meta is just about to get completely shaken up when the wild cards enter the standard game.
Here's some art, make a card! [Legacy Game]
This angry amphibian gets antsy when other frogs enter it's territory, always quick to act they rush into battle to defend their turf! Okay so this is basically Pre-Nerf Patches the Pirate with Rush instead of Charge, which I'm aware is still strong, especially being an Epic (Two copies in a deck).
I went mostly for flavour over balance with this card, although being that the trigger is attached to something much harder to pull off than playing a Pirate, this shouldn't be as oppressive and swing-ey in the early game as Patches the Pirate.
Next, a Whispers of the Old Gods Mech!
Lack of News posts
I would also like the weekly tavern brawl to have an article about what it is about.
Hearthstone Global Games Returns in November!
You are welcome ^^
Rock, Paper, Scissors - Jambre's Token Shaman, a Swinging Warrior, and Rogue Robbery
Feel free!
I particularly like it for looking back and putting decks from the game's history into perspective. E.g. old pirate warrior is parked much closer to the aggro corner than equivalent standard decks today, while in the days of classic there simply weren't the tools to stray very far from the mid-range centre (not that we knew the triangle extended any further at the time!).
Six-Shooter
Arcanologist
Frostbolt
Research Project
Zephrys the Great
Frost Nova
Ice Block
Unless there is secret hate you win every time.
Blindfolded Challenge!
this is kinda funny to watch but your opponent is probably very frustrated.
Rock, Paper, Scissors - Jambre's Token Shaman, a Swinging Warrior, and Rogue Robbery
I like the visualization of the triangle quite a bit. That’s the goal of my article for sure is to demonstrate that they’re all on a spectrum across the different archetypes. I may have to steal that from ya.
Quest Trading - Play A Friend!
Battletag: DuckAndCover#11769
Region: NA
Trade Only?: Yes, you go first
Just got scammed by Keef#1624
Here's some art, make a card! [Legacy Game]
Next: a Shaman card related with Hex in some way. It can be a minion that synergizes with Hex, a spell which has a similar effect... Whatever!
Meta Breaker - Menacing Murlocs
Thanks for the feedback! I had briefly considered Dune Sculptor, but it makes a lot of sense in this deck over Mana Cyclone - you can just run it out on 3 mana and protect it with Taunts, hopefully gaining incremental value over several turns. Also works well with Ancient Mysteries.
I honestly had no idea about the alignment, so sorry! I write my stuff in Google Docs (where it was all left-aligned) before pasting into the OoC editor, so maybe something happened there. I'll make sure to double-check that from now on!
Meta Breaker - Menacing Murlocs
Well now I know what I'll play on rank 5 for the next few days.
Little advice: isn't Book of Specters better than Arcane Intellect? Your deck has 24 minions, so even a 2 mana "draw 2 discard" 1 is dope since you're aggro and you don't look for value. Moreover, I think that Fishflinger deserves a spot.
Infinite 6-Shooter Combo
Worked great. Thanks!
Would this be of interest?
If you have time and taste for it, i say go and make a great guide! Even just putting the words down give you something back already, it's like going through your replay, you write down how a deck should be played and you might realize you sometimes miss a step here and there and this could remind you to do it corectly :)
Rock, Paper, Scissors - Jambre's Token Shaman, a Swinging Warrior, and Rogue Robbery
"Ah, Thief Rogue. ... I decided to call it a Combo Deck rather than Aggro or Control, although the deck's play falls heavily into the mid-range category."
This is why I like to view archetypes as more of a tetrahedron than a triangle. Aggro, control, combo and value sit at the 4 corners and mid-range sits in the middle of them all. Really each individual deck sits somewhere in the middle, but closer to one corner than the others, and sometimes along an edge (e.g. a hypothetical combo-control hybrid that replaces a lot of card draw for removal, hoping to get the combo pieces by living long enough to draw it naturally rather than by power-drawing).
Anyway, in my mind Thief Rogue sits towards the value corner, but the nature of thief cards and the class in general mean it retains some amount of tempo (which I guess is mid-range-y aggro?). Plus the right RNG can shift a particular game towards control or combo... This is why I have always loved Thief Rogue, not only does it let you play with any and all cards, but you get to play all primary archetypes too!
Given the constraints of the article however, I agree with putting a value deck down as 'combo' (even without the multiplying Tess combos) since they both prey on control but struggle against aggro.
Face Auction
I suggest you to play earthen scales instead of moonfire, it works for me.
Meta Breaker - Menacing Murlocs
Very good analysis! I will add some thoughts on possible changes:
A little pet-peeve to leave you with: for the love of the god, allign left or right, not left and right! My eyes! :D
Looking forward to the next one ;-)
Meta Breaker - Menacing Murlocs
This is one of the coolest non announcement type articles I have read here. Thank you for such an in depth discussion about taking a deck from idea to build to refinement. Well written.
Lack of News posts
Yes, I completely agree as well. As much as I like and appreciate allthe interesting articles, I feel like I am missing out on some news here sometimes.
I also want to throw in an idea since - at least for me - it is sometimes hard to find/filter important news inside the heap of awesome content. Most visits to the site or my feed reader I am short of time and just want to quickly scan for news and come back for reading articles when I am more relaxed. Maybe it is possible to label news articles somehow visually, with keyword, prefix,... to separate them from the more from feature articles.
Dave Kosak on Tombs of Terror Randomness, Bartender Bob, Zephrys’s Lamp Easter Egg
The apprentice for Reno (play 6 secrets) is neigh impossible to get active. Team 5 should revise it to be more playable without the battlecry.
80g Quest Trading Fraudster: Vegetaz (HaVoC#2426)
Just bumping this, as I see vegetaz posted again today, and the post has been down voted again (not by me), suggesting another scam victim.
Does anyone have any suggestions about how this sort of behaviour can be addressed, as not only does it mean people can regularly be scammed out of 80 gold, but it damages the integrity of the site? Please share your ideas!