Yes, it's way more expensive than it used to be. Obviously the large number of class legendaries is a significant issue but I don't think epics get enough criticism. If you get unlucky with pack openings, you can basically end up paying for the equivalent of 2 or 3 legendaries in epics just to complete a deck. But hey, who needs a useful epic when you can have soooooo much fun playing cards like Desert Obelisk lolololol.
It's not a false dilemma. If you run the quest you are statistically less likely to have a cleric along with other early game cards, and there isn't a single matchup you don't want cleric or the other early game cards. Combo priest wins by snowballing the early game, having a dead card for the first chunk of the game doesn't help you get early board and snowball, it does the opposite. Of course you can mulligan the quest, but what is the point of having the quest if it is better to mulligan it in literally every matchup, because it's just not good in the deck and does not fit your gameplan. Having to mulligan it also still weakens your mulligan because that could have been a good card. What are these matchups where a 3/3 buff is going to help a deck with no comeback mechanics, because you haven't mentioned them yet. Even if these mythical matchups exist, it wouldn't be enough to justify weakening your opening mulligan and potential draws.
Calling it a streamer thing is ridiculous and is showing some serious weird bias you have going on. You think pros going to korea for masters and people winning open cups with priest are just playing what they play because "lol a streamer played it". Combo priest isn't the highest winrate deck in the meta because a streamer played it, and it isn't better with the quest. This stuff has been tested. For the record, completely standard combo priest has 49% winrate with the quest in it on HSreplay which is a whopping 10% lower than the most played list. It's almost like having a terrible card in your hand every game is bad. The quest has the third lowest drawn rate in the deck.
You're the one not thinking critically here, sometimes things stay outside the box for a reason.
Adding random cards to your hand from a large pool is never going to be consistent, I think. Stonehill Defender was consistent in Odd Paladin because there were two great class cards it could discover, but in Wild I now count 6 options and while most are decent, they're not at the same level as Tarim and Tirion. Mana Cyclone is somewhat consistent, but it operates on a relatively small pool of only class cards of reasonable quality; if Glacial Mysteries were still in Standard, I think Cyclone would be less popular.
Ethereal Peddler. If they started printing more cards like this, Thief Rogue would become scary even in Wild.
Efficient generators and efficient synergies.
The problem so far is that most generators and most synergies have been value-oriented, without enough Tempo.
i really like the idea of defensive structures as Cards. Regarding balancing - well once you would introtruce such a Card type you could also create Cards to destroy thesecards (like Secrets and Flare etc.).
My Suggestion for such a Card
I also like the wording from DestroyeR so i kept it. :)
That's your problem, I've been running Totemic Might the whole time. It's the same as Murloc Shaman using Coldlight Seer before swinging to face. They see three health and don''t panic, then you use Totemic Might and the Emotes ensue. Always wait to use it right before you swing. False security is how I win most matches against mages since secrets are mind games anyway.
Shatterstar1998 and I did something like this for Timestream Tracking. One of the sets there had a "Shrine" mechanic (bear in mind this was made before Rastakhan's Rumble, hence the name). Ironically, this year was called Year of the Dragon, and had a plot overarching all of the sets, kinda like Hearthstone's "real" Year of the Dragon.
They worked as collectable dormant cards that you would place on the battlefield, and would destroy themselves after a certain number of turns.
You're not just losing tempo, or, better put, you're not always losing tempo. You're losing a card. You're literally starting the game with one less card than the opponent, and the reward is an extra powerful card in the late-game. Changing the reward to an automatic hero-power upgrade was an interesting way to bypass having to play the reward, but I would argue that it probably takes three turns/hero-powers to make up the card disadvantage across so many turns. That should theoretically work in a control deck, but the card disadvantage is just too huge. I have to think that after this expansion the Hearthstone team will be completely done with Quests. A noble experiment that just didn't work.
I did begin to suspect that something was up with the meta when I posted a Highlander deck only to discover that its crafting cost was 20,660 dust. Most of the non-SOU legendaries weren’t a product of crafts, but just the fact that the first legendary I opened was Antonidas, the first free dragon was Alexstrasza, and I’ve weirdly rolled into the Mage legendaries in each of the last expansions. (And here I’d been hoping to play Deathrattle Rogue.) So yes, while the costs have clearly crept up, I do think that it’s slightly fitting that in a “reboot” of an old expansion the reintroduction of singleton mechanics have created a reward structure for people who have older unplayed cards sitting around collecting dust. (Pun originally not intended...
I'm playing too a combo priest with the quest and have similar experience, quest being an alternative for buffing minions and have a wining condition. But I feel with the quest the deck is more controlish. Anyway there is some potential in my opinion in a more refined combo priest with quest.
Here's the first version I came up with, inspired by @Aldrad's idea. I couldn't figure out a proper weakness or way to destroy it though, especially in regards to card space. Feedback appreciated.
MTG >>>>>> HS because of many reasons: no RNG, multitude of archetypes, better art, more adult feel etc
On the ftp side, as people above said very well, you can slowly build your collection for free, but it's gonna take a looong time to build really good decks, except the hyper aggro ones, which you use to grind. Anyway, it's a very satisfying game, with more than 20 years of successful history. Really, what are you waiting for??
Literally you're first reason is "NO RNG"? Your leading argument out of the gates, and you're already stumbling...I'm laughing out loud as much as JJJ here. If you believe that, not only are you a naive fool; but I've got a statue in Booty Bay to sell you.
Thanks for the reply, Mr. Politeness!
I'm the naive fool when you can't even differentiate between Hearthstone's intrinsic RNG foundation (draw a RANDOM x-card, summon a RANDOM 2-cost creature, cast 5 RANDOM spells you've cast this game) and Magic's occasional mana screw/flood?
Both games have their charms and intrinsic pros and cons. I had my share of HS addiction. Can't even touch it now. MTG on the other hand with its absurdly larger variety of strategies is a whole new world to discover.
I like what you've got so far! The Meditate keyword is a great idea, although I hope the rest of them are big enough effects to justify waiting 2 turns for the effect to happen (Cursed Pandaren is on the right track IMO). Are all of the Locations 1 Mana or is it just the Warlock one? Also, you could check here for some other Wrathion artwork if you haven't already.
No, locations will have different mana costs. They'll be cheap cards, max of 3 maybe 4 mana. Thanks for the artwork suggestions but already had seen those and I didn't liked them all except his hearthstone art. For now I'll keep as it is :(
The lackey that you've created is underpowered. All of the lackeys currently do something worth ~1 mana (easy example: Kobold Lackey) while your's has an effect worth 0 mana: Regenerate. You can up the health to 5 to be a Flash Heal if that's the direction you want to take. Otherwise, I love the expansion idea!
Heart of Fear is a little underwhelming for a card that affects the entire battlefield and seems more like a detriment than an advantage considering as a warlock you're more likely to be damaged than your opponenet.
Cursed Pandaren seems really broken though. I understand it's at the expense of not attacking but it has premium stats with a powerful effect.
Also Prey on the Weak is completely out of flavor for rogue. Rogue has historically never had effects that rely on minion attack; instead a better option would be to change it to say "Deal 2 damage to a minion. Add a random card from another class to your hand." Maybe that's not even balanced, but considering WANTED! has never seen serious play, I think it's fine.
You're absolutely right about the lackey. I was scary of quest shaman healing 10 with this but maybe that's not a big deal. I've updated it and Heart of Fear aswell. Not sure about Cursed Pandaren, probably i'll take out 1 health. 3/5 still good stats. Prey on the Weak I was thinking more about the card name itself... and I think the effect as it is now meets well with the card name/idea.. I don't think "deal 2 damage" would to fit in tho. Well I'll have to think about it. Anyway, thanks for the feedbacks!
Secret Mages have been the bane of my existence playing this deck. Even teching in an Eater of Secrets isn't enough. Flame Ward is devastating and there's nothing you can do about it. Tempted to try Totemic Might
Excellent ideas both of you. :) Thanks for sharing. I'll see what I can come up with and am open to what anyone else wishes to suggest as well. There's a lot of options to choose from.
Interesting video: Just how expensive in dust is the meta compared to previous?
Yes, it's way more expensive than it used to be. Obviously the large number of class legendaries is a significant issue but I don't think epics get enough criticism. If you get unlucky with pack openings, you can basically end up paying for the equivalent of 2 or 3 legendaries in epics just to complete a deck. But hey, who needs a useful epic when you can have soooooo much fun playing cards like Desert Obelisk lolololol.
Standard Meta Report #1 - August 11, 2019 - August 18, 2019
It's not a false dilemma. If you run the quest you are statistically less likely to have a cleric along with other early game cards, and there isn't a single matchup you don't want cleric or the other early game cards. Combo priest wins by snowballing the early game, having a dead card for the first chunk of the game doesn't help you get early board and snowball, it does the opposite. Of course you can mulligan the quest, but what is the point of having the quest if it is better to mulligan it in literally every matchup, because it's just not good in the deck and does not fit your gameplan. Having to mulligan it also still weakens your mulligan because that could have been a good card. What are these matchups where a 3/3 buff is going to help a deck with no comeback mechanics, because you haven't mentioned them yet. Even if these mythical matchups exist, it wouldn't be enough to justify weakening your opening mulligan and potential draws.
Calling it a streamer thing is ridiculous and is showing some serious weird bias you have going on. You think pros going to korea for masters and people winning open cups with priest are just playing what they play because "lol a streamer played it". Combo priest isn't the highest winrate deck in the meta because a streamer played it, and it isn't better with the quest. This stuff has been tested. For the record, completely standard combo priest has 49% winrate with the quest in it on HSreplay which is a whopping 10% lower than the most played list. It's almost like having a terrible card in your hand every game is bad. The quest has the third lowest drawn rate in the deck.
You're the one not thinking critically here, sometimes things stay outside the box for a reason.
Highlander Secrer Quest Rogue
Well, you can still try the deck without Sonya. Replace with any 3-drop.
Surely she adds consistency to the deck's main synergy, but you can craft her later, when you see you like the deck.
Top Saviors of Uldum Cards That Pack a Punch or Fell Flat
Ethereal Peddler. If they started printing more cards like this, Thief Rogue would become scary even in Wild.
Efficient generators and efficient synergies.
The problem so far is that most generators and most synergies have been value-oriented, without enough Tempo.
But interesting cards are slowly stacking up...
0w0 *notices your thread*
ew furries
Help me refine a Strongholds concept
Hey there,
i really like the idea of defensive structures as Cards. Regarding balancing - well once you would introtruce such a Card type you could also create Cards to destroy thesecards (like Secrets and Flare etc.).
My Suggestion for such a Card
I also like the wording from DestroyeR so i kept it. :)
Top Saviors of Uldum Cards That Pack a Punch or Fell Flat
The power of Armagedilo and Tomb Warden can be illustrated in this hypothetical line of play:
Turn 6: Armagedilo
Turn 7: Dr. Boom Mad Genius
Turn 8: Tomb Warden, as two 5/8 taunts (or 7/10 taunts) with rush
That's your problem, I've been running Totemic Might the whole time. It's the same as Murloc Shaman using Coldlight Seer before swinging to face. They see three health and don''t panic, then you use Totemic Might and the Emotes ensue. Always wait to use it right before you swing. False security is how I win most matches against mages since secrets are mind games anyway.
Help me refine a Strongholds concept
Shatterstar1998 and I did something like this for Timestream Tracking. One of the sets there had a "Shrine" mechanic (bear in mind this was made before Rastakhan's Rumble, hence the name). Ironically, this year was called Year of the Dragon, and had a plot overarching all of the sets, kinda like Hearthstone's "real" Year of the Dragon.
They worked as collectable dormant cards that you would place on the battlefield, and would destroy themselves after a certain number of turns.
Help me refine a Strongholds concept
Going by your original idea, something like this, maybe?
Hold would be the aura effect, and Crumble would be the condition to destroy it
Top Saviors of Uldum Cards That Pack a Punch or Fell Flat
Kinda like The Caverns Below.
It's amazing how often this happens.
Top Saviors of Uldum Cards That Pack a Punch or Fell Flat
You're not just losing tempo, or, better put, you're not always losing tempo. You're losing a card. You're literally starting the game with one less card than the opponent, and the reward is an extra powerful card in the late-game. Changing the reward to an automatic hero-power upgrade was an interesting way to bypass having to play the reward, but I would argue that it probably takes three turns/hero-powers to make up the card disadvantage across so many turns. That should theoretically work in a control deck, but the card disadvantage is just too huge. I have to think that after this expansion the Hearthstone team will be completely done with Quests. A noble experiment that just didn't work.
Interesting video: Just how expensive in dust is the meta compared to previous?
I did begin to suspect that something was up with the meta when I posted a Highlander deck only to discover that its crafting cost was 20,660 dust. Most of the non-SOU legendaries weren’t a product of crafts, but just the fact that the first legendary I opened was Antonidas, the first free dragon was Alexstrasza, and I’ve weirdly rolled into the Mage legendaries in each of the last expansions. (And here I’d been hoping to play Deathrattle Rogue.) So yes, while the costs have clearly crept up, I do think that it’s slightly fitting that in a “reboot” of an old expansion the reintroduction of singleton mechanics have created a reward structure for people who have older unplayed cards sitting around collecting dust. (Pun originally not intended...
0w0 *notices your thread*
Any other unashamed furries playing?
Top Saviors of Uldum Cards That Pack a Punch or Fell Flat
I'm playing too a combo priest with the quest and have similar experience, quest being an alternative for buffing minions and have a wining condition. But I feel with the quest the deck is more controlish. Anyway there is some potential in my opinion in a more refined combo priest with quest.
Help me refine a Strongholds concept
Here's the first version I came up with, inspired by @Aldrad's idea. I couldn't figure out a proper weakness or way to destroy it though, especially in regards to card space. Feedback appreciated.
Solving the Saviors of Uldum Gameboard Easter Egg
Thank you, this what I was looking for.
Only missing Frost Lich Jaina, I guess I should finally craft that. What's wild mage without her anyway?
Highlander Secrer Quest Rogue
This looks like a blast to play! Makes me want to finally craft Sonya Shadowdancer since she is the only card I'm missing.
Is MtG:A F2P?
Thanks for the reply, Mr. Politeness!
I'm the naive fool when you can't even differentiate between Hearthstone's intrinsic RNG foundation (draw a RANDOM x-card, summon a RANDOM 2-cost creature, cast 5 RANDOM spells you've cast this game) and Magic's occasional mana screw/flood?
Both games have their charms and intrinsic pros and cons. I had my share of HS addiction. Can't even touch it now. MTG on the other hand with its absurdly larger variety of strategies is a whole new world to discover.
[Custom Expansion] FLIGHTS OVER PANDARIA (Regular Updates!)
No, locations will have different mana costs. They'll be cheap cards, max of 3 maybe 4 mana. Thanks for the artwork suggestions but already had seen those and I didn't liked them all except his hearthstone art. For now I'll keep as it is :(
You're absolutely right about the lackey. I was scary of quest shaman healing 10 with this but maybe that's not a big deal. I've updated it and Heart of Fear aswell.
Not sure about Cursed Pandaren, probably i'll take out 1 health. 3/5 still good stats.
Prey on the Weak I was thinking more about the card name itself... and I think the effect as it is now meets well with the card name/idea.. I don't think "deal 2 damage" would to fit in tho. Well I'll have to think about it. Anyway, thanks for the feedbacks!
Secret Mages have been the bane of my existence playing this deck. Even teching in an Eater of Secrets isn't enough. Flame Ward is devastating and there's nothing you can do about it. Tempted to try Totemic Might
The Way-Too-Early-Nerf Thread
Maybe you're right. I'm not used to them being more open and flexible lately. I guess we will see.
Hakkar card back/favorite back?
Playing a lot of Reno Mage rn, so I just use the Heroic Dalaran Heist Cardback.
My favourite that comes to mind would have to be the Kul’tiras cardback
Help me refine a Strongholds concept
Excellent ideas both of you. :) Thanks for sharing. I'll see what I can come up with and am open to what anyone else wishes to suggest as well. There's a lot of options to choose from.