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I'm not really salty about this, but still got a good kick out of my shit luck. One of the most hilariously terrible hands I have ever had.

Quote From anchorm4n

Quote From Xarkkal

I've been playing quest mage today to learn the deck and see for myself just how broken it is. I've never been a fan of it myself, and have rarely played the archetype. But the current form of it is just ridiculously easy to pull off. 
The biggest problem is the mana cheat. You end up casting so many spells for 0 mana, which can alone end up completing your quest. 
I was thinking about it today on what could be done to slow down the quest completion, but also not just completely kill the OTK potential. It is healthy to have OTK decks in the meta, but the random spell generation and low cost spells have been pushed in Mage to the max for too long, and has made this Quest just way too easy to complete. 
I think the best option would be to make it so spells that cost 0 do not count towards quest progression. That way, only spells you spend mana on would count towards your quest. This would also eliminate The Coin being such a huge benefit. 

(I have debated making it for spells that cost 2 or more just because of the amount of 1-cost spells that mage has, but I think starting with just removing the 0-cost spells should be enough to slow it down to an acceptable power level.)

This also leaves Sorcerer's Apprentice untouched. As much as I hate this card, it is actually perfectly fine. If this card was touched, it would break way too many Mage decks. Any nerfs need to be directed towards the Quest itself, and the Giants. My proposed nerf makes Sorcerer's Apprentice less powerful in the deck, since it would make all your 1-cost spells not count towards your quest. 

I also agree with Lyra that the cost of Mana Giant needs to be increased. I agree that it should start at 12-mana just like Arcane Giant. 

These two nerfs should slow down the speed of the OTK, while not completely destroying the archetype. This will allow for a less polarized meta that Quest Mage could still be a part of, without being a Tier-S deck. 

I'm not sure that's enough, actually. I played the deck a lot in March to grind my Mage to 1.000 wins and my impression is that most spells initially cost more than 0. Like OP said, it's the cheap spells for 1 or 2 mana that get cheaper with apprentice or glyph that make up most of the cycling. Or do I get the mechanic wrong and they wouldn't count towards the quest in your iteration if they get discounted? I always assumed such cards check for the initial state of the card, not an altered form it gained by buffs or the like.

In this iteration, 1-2 mana spells that are discounted down to 0 mana would NOT count towards the Quest. A minimum of 1 mana must be spent on the spell in order for it to count towards Quest progression. 

The altered form is what is read. Look at the interaction with Aeroponics between Garden Gnome and Anubisath Defender. When Aeroponics costs less than (5), it does not trigger Garden Gnome. And if you play Aeroponics for less than (5), it does not give you a (0) mana Anubisath Defender.

This change wouldn't nerf the Quest into oblivion, but it would prevent a huge swing turn with Sorcerer's Apprentice and Mana Cyclone or Evocation where the mage can complete their Quest by just dumping all the 0-cost spells they have in their hand. 

It is strong, but not the best now. I don't know which build do you mean exactly (Totem or Overload package), but Raza Priest is a bad matchup, Odd DH counters your early totems and if you want to hold back to combo a large totem board you're behind on board. Quest Mage will also beat you if it has at least a semi-competent pilot. Secret Mage is really draw dependent. You can try playing it without Vessina or Stormbringer, they're not essential, and you will see for yourself. Instead of those two you can add some tech cards ( Nerub'ar Weblord to counter mages, Windfury against control instead of Stormbringer). That being said, it can definitely take you to Diamond 5 and if you are a good pilot then right to Legend. I suggest try it first, if you enjoy it then craft it, but otherwise maybe wait.

Boring ladder : DH, DH, DH, DH, DH
Come on blizzard do something ! We must play DH to counter DH, Illidan must be nerfed ! There is no fun anymore

So this is a weird venting, I'm actually going to complain about my victory. I switched to DH because I wanted a win to get me out of Silver. First game, hadn't tried the tempo deck yet and found myself facing a quest Priest. Things went his way, he kept himself healed and cleared what I put up. I did not have a great start, not at all.

Then I hit turn 6, Skull of Gul'dan. I'd managed to get set it up so it was the left most card, I'd at least managed that. But after that, it was over. Three turn to kill a Priest from full health, with quest completed and a beefy taunt on the field. All because he couldn't deal with the Priestess of Fury I got on the board. Altruis was barely needed.

This is my long winded way to say that Demon Hunter is busted and it clearly needs toning down. And I'm saying that after playing and winning with it. I didn't feel clean after.

I feel like Bomb Wrangler is the most awkward card in the deck. It is an ok 3-drop but I rather have other cards.

Hsreplay is a basis for argument. Just displaying stats is also a basis for argument. To say that hsreplay is always misleading is just reading the titles. Go a little deeper and you will see why stats are showing the high values as they are. Also analysis requires actual quantitative or qualitative data, and there's nothing wrong using hsreplay stats to justify your reasoning. The content creators are assuredly not idiots enough to just copy paste data, and we as readers are surely not idiots ourselves to blindly believe it.

Hsreplay tends to show the aggregate of all the matchups, which includes favorable matchups like spell druid and poor decks like quest shaman, hence the high aggregate win rate. Totem shaman isnt trash, its just really bad against the current top tier decks like tempo dhunters and rogue.

Also, if you need an illustration of how good tempo dhunters are, just review the innivitational they had last month where the last round featured all classes against dhunters. The participants were all aware of this and built all their decks to counter tempo dhunters. The result was 6-4 if Im not mistaken. And these are decks specifically designed to beat them.

Yeah, it´s one of the better decks in the meta currently.

I mean, this data represents games played from Diamond to Legend over the last week, from players enfranchised enough to have HSReplay installed.

Are there decks which can likely counter some of these strong decks? Of course! Can the average player pilot these decks effectively enough to have a better winrate with them? Not always. It's not wrong to tell someone that if they want to ladder as quickly as possible, here's the easy decks to do so.

Zoo and Face Hunter are strong laddering decks because of how quick the games tend to be anyway, not because they're necessarily exceptional in the overall meta. The next level up is looking at HSReplay stats and thinking 'okay, now that I know what the majority are playing what deck can counter that?'.

As in the title. Is it worth to craft even shaman in this meta? I wanted to grind to legend for the first time ever this month, the only cards i'm missing are Vessina and [Hearthstone Card (Storm Bringer) Not Found]

I am curious, why in the world is this not on Twitch? I do not really recall watching these types of events on YouTube... has there been some move away from using Twitch for some reason?  Haven't seen any articles or posts on this, just wondering if there is a story here?

Hearthstone [WILD] Blutrane's WILD Even Hunter: Garrison Commander + Dragonbane = Amazing! (1080p)

Even Hunter. Garrison Commander. Steamwheedle Sniper. Dragonbane. Call of the Wild?! What a beautiful deck. Thanks to Blutrane for the list (https://twitter.com/blutrane). One thing to consider is the inclusion of Explosive Trap against aggro.

Deck code original deck: AAEBAR8EgAeY8ALN9AKHsAMN9w3bD4cQ1BHVE8euAvixAo7DAt/SAqKlA/uvA7q2A6S5AwA=

Deck code Egg version: AAEBAR8EyQSY8ALN9AKHsAMN9w36DccP2w/UEdUTx64C+LECjsMCvaYD+68DpLkD9roDAA==

https://youtu.be/UlGLM-q1G_g

I'm purely F2P now, and as someone who only has one complete deck (Corrina Control), I'll be happy to face those matches..

Okay, I really disagree with this emphasis on HS replays stats WHICH HAVE ALWAYS BEEN MISLEADING AND BIASED.

Never ever HSreplay put a control as the top meta deck, even when control groups where the best decks. HS replay will always overrate aggro decks because they are the easiest to play and more players manage to reach the minimum skills to have decent results with them.

HS replays stats shouldn't be used to analyse the meta, it's just wrong. If you listen to HSreplay, totem shaman and murloc pal are actual decks.

Look at this thread : just disgruntled people saying "OMG DH is so imba" "Meta sucks" and such kind of BS, simply because they are presented biased stats and it makes them feel oppressed.

Truth is full aggro decks like zoo warlock and face hunter are not in top 5 decks, not even remotely. Truth is when you get to a rank were people know how to play egg warrior, DH is much weaker. Truth is galakrond priest, galakrond rogue and highlander mage are better decks than some presented in this list.

I'm sorry but this kind of news is not on par with this site's usual standards.

it would be interesting to see this for the wild

Quote From sila

Quote From Aenarion

Warrior is insane rn. I'm playing the VS list with Gromm (very good closing games, specially against priest) and 2x Injured Tol'vir instead of the eggs and Teron. Just got to legend with a 22-4 record on Diamond league.

I've noticed Teron is easily outplayed by rogue 1 mana 1/2 freezing sap

Do you see a lot of rogues though? Anyway when facing rogues, just go for moderate Terons, like just one egg, so you don't loose that much to the Blackjack Stunner

I get the feeling of frustration from playing against tons of the same old aggro decks, especially right after a new expansion drops, but this is commonplace for every CCG. And there are pretty obvious reasons for this:

• People who are playing the newest cards tend to be playing slower, greedier decks (because they want to play all the new cool cards, and see the new wacky interactions that are hypothetically possible but probably not practical)
• Aggro tends to be easier to optimize than control decks (in part because the games go faster, so you get more data with which to optimize)
• CCGs are expensive, so people will often play the old, already optimized decks they have, even when there are new cards available

That last bullet is the most impactful, I think. Legends of Runeterra bills itself as a game that's very F2P friendly, and it is more F2P friendly than most digital CCGs, but its reward systems are mostly random and require grinding wins/daily quests to get them. So, those folks who are F2P need to play and win games and grind through the game to get new cards, and the easiest way to do that is going to be with their old aggro decks.

This is actually something where I think LoR could take a page from Hearthstone's playbook. Hearthstone's recently added a lot of duplicate protection, their ranked rewards give you packs of the latest expansion, and they've taken to giving you interesting login rewards for free at the start of an expansion to motivate new deck building (e.g. Galakrond, tons of Demon Hunter cards, etc.).

Meanwhile, the LoR system of random chests/capsules could give you just about any card regardless of what your collection looks like (and the shard conversion rate is pretty lousy when you do get duplicates). On top of that, the daily login rewards for LoR are mostly random chests/capsules, and the non-random ones give you old cards (Ledros, Ashe, etc.). That's a bunch of good free stuff, but none of it will give you the makings of an expansion deck.

Now, LoR is admittedly in an odd position where they've simultaneously released an expansion and officially launched the game out of beta. As far as I'm concerned, that just means the open beta was the real official launch, but they called it a beta to get some good will from players because they knew there were some graphical bugs (e.g. cards floating over the victory/loss screen), and they knew there were some balance issues with cards and reward systems. Perhaps in the future, when they're just releasing an expansion and not "launching," their login rewards will be more focused on new content, etc., but in the meantime expansion launches are a very hard time to be F2P, even in LoR.

Op should be hired by Blizzard. He would be the guy that nerfs Glaivebound Adept from a 7/4 to a 6/4 and calls it a nerf xd

She's supposed to be a Nerubian corrupted by the Burning Legion (the same way Satyrs are corrupted Night Elves).

Next: A Neutral minion from Knights of the Frozen Throne.

Honesly, it took me 1 day to get to diamond 6 with a zoo warlock (my own list) and a x8 multiplier. The way to beat DH is to drown him in scrap imps and shadow council demons. Getting a 7/12 hulking overfiend helps as well!

Priestess of Fury, Altruis the Outcast and Skull of Gul'dan are still broken.

The much feared Kayn Sunfury looks like a petty minion in comparison.

Nerf those 3 and DH stays strong, but fair.

As you said, right now it feels like an Odd Paladin. But in Standard.

This is not how you keep or lure old players back to Standard.

Good luck to everyone with the votes

I tried Standard after AoO, but honestly I'm done with it, again.

I just don't see the point, it's just a Wild with restricted card pool, but the powerlevel of topdecks is possibly even more oppressive, especially that of the obnoxious DH.

DH is actually even more hateful now, because it's a meta tyrant in the face of the nerfs, it feels like we're being trolled...

Good luck to everyone who submitted, and an extra shot of lock to whoever submitted Impflicting Pain. That's a far more interesting, less swing-y card than my Impvasion!