I do think it would be good to remove the gold farming from casual though. Just make it so you can only earn gold on the ladder, and I believe it would change the makeup of casual dramatically. Completing quests is fine, just remove the 10g earnings.
It seems kinda silly to me that people want there to be less rewards for playing Hearthstone.
I don't play much ranked, so this would make me lose about a third of the gold I collect. Also, I don't think it would solve the issue. I don't think the people playing T-1 decks in casual are doing so because it is an easy way to farm gold, if you have a 60% winrate and an average hearthstone game takes about 10 minutes, then after about 8 hours you would get 1 pack. This reward system is awful and I don't think playing in casual as opposed to ranked does much to help you make more gold. We don't get much rewards for playing Hearthstone beyond the daily quest, and as a F2P player I would hate to lose what little gold I had.
I was actually excited about Battlegrounds, but having played it for a day I must agree with other players. Here is a quote I made in another thread in response to it:
So, having played early access battlegrounds, I wanted to share my thoughts. While overall a fun mode, there isn't enough dimensions to keep most players entrained past initial week in my opinion. Already in 1 day of playing I started seeing the same end-game patterns over and over. The main end-game strategies are very repetitive (I really hope the complexity of this mode increases to keep it enjoyable long-term):
1. Go all in on beasts: Get Mama Bear and beasts that spawn more beasts (i.e. Rat Pack) and a cleaver or 2 (Cave Hydra)
2: Go all in on mechs: Get Junkbot and mechs that spawn more mechs (magnetize them) and a cleaver or 2 (Foe Reaper 4000), sound familiar?
3: Go all in on demons: Get Wrathweaver and rotate a bunch of demons between rounds to buff him, eventually get Annihilan Battlemaster with ~200 health (optionally get Malganis temporarily so Wrathweaver stops hurting you)
4: Go all in on murlocs: Try to discover poison + divine shield from Gentle Megasaur for every minion on board, or give it manually to your murlocs through other battlecries.
Oh, and of course, regardless of which of the only 4 endgame strategies you pick, buff/max out your Nightmare Amalgam, giving it a ton of health, poison, divine shield, etc. and magnetizing anything you come in contact with.
In my opinion, the Co-Op mode (2 players fighting a rogue minion, similar to some Brawls - but more variety and ability to use the entire card sample space) would have been a more interesting addition. Don't get me wrong, I'm still enjoying the mode, but I doubt I still will a week from now.
There is definitely a concern of the longevity of the mode. I'm sure they'll swap out minions within those tribes (mechs for mechs) and eventually tribes for tribes (murlocs for dragons). This does *potentially* give opportunities to introduce new tribes (such as treants) with different interactions, but we'll see.
I don't have an issue with tier-1 decks in casual. Mainly because there's no good way to solve the problem, so you might as well accept it. Personally, I like messing around with semi-meta decks in casual because I'm not stressed about losing.
I play all sorts of decks in casual. Many times I'll practice meta decks until I feel confident enough to take them to the ladder.
I do think it would be good to remove the gold farming from casual though. Just make it so you can only earn gold on the ladder, and I believe it would change the makeup of casual dramatically. Completing quests is fine, just remove the 10g earnings.
Also, you guys are talking a lot about tennis. Has Rafael Nadal even made Legend, bro?
I‘m a little tired of those casual complains. I get your point, you want those Trolden worthy Highkeeper Ra or Desert Obelisk finishes... well they aren‘t worth a dime if you have to face a Mecha‘thun hunter to get there. You may aswell play against the inkeeper.
Other people use casual as a place to learn new decks they just crafted. How can you blame them for that?
Can‘t you just see netdecks as the ultimate challenge for your homebrew? If you can’t get to 40% winrate, the roblem may not be the netdeck but your own.
It‘s like casually playing Tennis but using a badminton racket.
That's not an apt analogy at all.
A better one would be: I'm an amateur tennis player at my local club looking to casually play against other middle-age weekend schlub players, except wow look at that today my opponent is Rafael Nadal. Mr. Nadal could and should easily find better opponents than me, but here he is kicking my teeth in because he wants to try out a new backhand or restrung racket.
See how that might make me resent him for raining on my parade even though he may have a "good reason" for doing so?
I know the analogy isn‘t perfect but it underlines my argument.
Also, it‘s the tool (i.e the deck) that’s op, not the player. There are no grandmasters, and probably only few legend players in casual. It‘s no Nadal that’s beating your ass, it‘s your neighbour with his new shiny Carbon racket. You can beat him with an average racket, especially with higher skill. But it’s wayyyy more difficult with the 3kg wooden racket you found on the attic of your grandpa.
Ps: People would stand in line for the opportunity to play with Nadal, not resent him. And those people wouldn’t expect to win but maaan would they be proud if they won a ball or two. I would suggest a similar approach to netdeck- matchups
All the basic cards are missing from my collection. Also affected by the note big. Practically impossible to anything but tavern brawl and arena. Hopefully there is some form of compensation.
I‘m a little tired of those casual complains. I get your point, you want those Trolden worthy Highkeeper Ra or Desert Obelisk finishes... well they aren‘t worth a dime if you have to face a Mecha‘thun hunter to get there. You may aswell play against the inkeeper.
Other people use casual as a place to learn new decks they just crafted. How can you blame them for that?
Can‘t you just see netdecks as the ultimate challenge for your homebrew? If you can’t get to 40% winrate, the roblem may not be the netdeck but your own.
It‘s like casually playing Tennis but using a badminton racket.
That's not an apt analogy at all.
A better one would be: I'm an amateur tennis player at my local club looking to casually play against other middle-age weekend schlub players, except wow look at that today my opponent is Rafael Nadal. Mr. Nadal could and should easily find better opponents than me, but here he is kicking my teeth in because he wants to try out a new backhand or restrung racket.
See how that might make me resent him for raining on my parade even though he may have a "good reason" for doing so?
I don't think this is a very good analogy either. What you said is more like what if Thijs wanted to fight against someone who has only been playing for a week. Playing a good deck doesn't mean you are on-par with pro players.
I am fine with meta-decks in casual because it is not against the rules and I personally feel like it is a little silly complaining that your opponent is playing good cards and now you can't win with your bad cards. Tier-1 decks don't 'belong' in ranked mode, Ranked mode was not made as a place for T-1 decks to be played, and casual mode was not made as a place for bad decks to be played. I think some people don't understand that.
Hi all, just shamelessly plugging the 4th installment of my themed deck series: The Banana Saga.
Amazingly this time the deck is not completely awful, but as usual the main feature is the story I have built around it, so check out the deck description if theme decks are your thing.
Although to be fair, they didn't phrase the effect very well to imply this.
I mean i can see how it can look confusing, but when you look at the rest of the cards that give Mana Crystals, they are quite consistent about phrasing giving full or empty ones. I guess Zihi was first to read "set", but it is a precedent for Nozdormu and they do follow it again, so id say in the end, no confusion here :)
I‘m a little tired of those casual complains. I get your point, you want those Trolden worthy Highkeeper Ra or Desert Obelisk finishes... well they aren‘t worth a dime if you have to face a Mecha‘thun hunter to get there. You may aswell play against the inkeeper.
Other people use casual as a place to learn new decks they just crafted. How can you blame them for that?
Can‘t you just see netdecks as the ultimate challenge for your homebrew? If you can’t get to 40% winrate, the roblem may not be the netdeck but your own.
It‘s like casually playing Tennis but using a badminton racket.
That's not an apt analogy at all.
A better one would be: I'm an amateur tennis player at my local club looking to casually play against other middle-age weekend schlub players, except wow look at that today my opponent is Rafael Nadal. Mr. Nadal could and should easily find better opponents than me, but here he is kicking my teeth in because he wants to try out a new backhand or restrung racket.
See how that might make me resent him for raining on my parade even though he may have a "good reason" for doing so?
I‘m a little tired of those casual complains. I get your point, you want those Trolden worthy Highkeeper Ra or Desert Obelisk finishes... well they aren‘t worth a dime if you have to face a Mecha‘thun hunter to get there. You may aswell play against the inkeeper.
Other people use casual as a place to learn new decks they just crafted. How can you blame them for that?
Can‘t you just see netdecks as the ultimate challenge for your homebrew? If you can’t get to 40% winrate, the roblem may not be the netdeck but your own.
It‘s like casually playing Tennis but using a badminton racket.
You do know that depending on how you count, you will get completely different results?
Lets say for Hearthstone, we count 2 commons, 2 rares, 2 epics and 1 legendary of each type as complete collection, each expansion lasting 4 months, getting 60 gold per day (daily quest, assuming easy quest aka 50 gold + 3 wins to complete the quest, excluding events etc.) you will get ~6700 gold, which is 67 packs which guarantees you atleast 2 legendaries (excluding the free legendaries you get and other packs you get), with 5 cards per pack, on average you would get 1 legendary every 20 packs and the average joe will get 3 legendaries (they are also guaranteed to be different), 13-14 epics, 66 rares, and hundreds of commons, this will result usually in you having half of the epics, only 3 of 23 legendary, a really high chance to have every rare once, and a decent chance to have most key rares (as in rares being played) atleast once or twice (there are 36 rares per set btw), while you are basically guaranteed to have every common
Now 49+49+ lets say you got 22 rares twice, rest are duplicates, so 22+22, no duplicates in the epics, and ofc. no duplicates in legendary (because that is impossible anyway) Golden cards are not included in the calculation at all, that will throw you out at 64% of the entire set, if we slightly tweak the odds and say you never got any duplicate rare, you are at 73% of the entire set, if we were to include the dust you got from the duplicates, and potentially golden duplicates from for example commons, and gifted cards, and rewards from tavern brawls, free arena runs, more free gold you got, event quests, free legendaries (every expansion atleast throws out 1 free legendary) you will easily reach more than 75% completion
Anyway, i am a HS player too, and i havn´t bought any packs, yet i still always get atleast 80% of every single set, with leftover dust, that i use to craft potentially missing key cards in decks i want to play
Now don´t get me wrong, im not trying to really defend hearthstone, i just wanted to make it clear that even though 75% of a set completed sounds nice, but there are a lot of information missing in that post, is it 75% of the set completed included wildcards gained through shards used on cards? Is it just calculated with average luck, are there stuff like "pity timers", because you can easily juggle numbers around (just look at the example above for hearthstone, you will get 75% of the set, yet you can´t play a lot of decks atleast if decks need core legendary cards, that is if they are real core cards, stuff like ziliax, or leeroy jenkins aren´t true core legendary cards, despite them seeing insane amounts of play, is especially the case for midrange/combo and control decks, aggro/tempo decks rarely have real core legendary cards, most legendaries in there are just in there because they excel at it, they aren´t necessary to play the deck succesfully, they will usually just increase winrates by like 0.1% to 1%, in some cases even drop the winrate, due to winrates being skewed by people copying decks without knowing how to play them)
Anyway, im still excited to play the game, i had quite a bit of fun playing in the first preview build, but i can already imagine how false all of your hopes will be especially regarding champion cards, atleast if you want to run a optimal build you will need the same legendary probably 3 times, and another different same legendary also 3 times, that will probably be absolutely impossible, so im imagining rn. that we will probably get a similar situation to hearthstone, where you have a ton of cards, but you just don´t have some of the core game mechanics, for example you lack 3 fioras, you only got 1, or 3 teemos for example, or something like only having 1 draven etc. etc. etc.
Tbf. i havn´t checked how many things you start with, so i have no idea about how bad it will exactly be, but just remember, that you can easily play with numbers to make things sound better
Mogu Fleshshaper May Be Too Powerful!
Evolve but not Fleshshaper
Mogu Fleshshaper May Be Too Powerful!
What about making it 8 mana?
LUCENTBARK WITH SATHROVARR
literally the only sentence in the guide is "REPLACE SAFEGAURD WITH SATHROVARR".
What do you think Casual is Supposed to be?
It seems kinda silly to me that people want there to be less rewards for playing Hearthstone.
I don't play much ranked, so this would make me lose about a third of the gold I collect. Also, I don't think it would solve the issue. I don't think the people playing T-1 decks in casual are doing so because it is an easy way to farm gold, if you have a 60% winrate and an average hearthstone game takes about 10 minutes, then after about 8 hours you would get 1 pack. This reward system is awful and I don't think playing in casual as opposed to ranked does much to help you make more gold. We don't get much rewards for playing Hearthstone beyond the daily quest, and as a F2P player I would hate to lose what little gold I had.
Mogu Fleshshaper May Be Too Powerful!
It's gonna go away.. After this rotation..
Hearthstone Battlegrounds
There is definitely a concern of the longevity of the mode. I'm sure they'll swap out minions within those tribes (mechs for mechs) and eventually tribes for tribes (murlocs for dragons). This does *potentially* give opportunities to introduce new tribes (such as treants) with different interactions, but we'll see.
What do you think Casual is Supposed to be?
I don't have an issue with tier-1 decks in casual. Mainly because there's no good way to solve the problem, so you might as well accept it. Personally, I like messing around with semi-meta decks in casual because I'm not stressed about losing.
Blizzard Provides an Update on 15.6 Issues - Patch Next Week, Some Bugs Already Fixed
Not in the Technical Support thread, for sure: they finally published this info there... seven hours ago.
Mogu Fleshshaper May Be Too Powerful!
Water is wet!
LUCENTBARK WITH SATHROVARR
Sathrovarr isn't in your decklist ;)
What do you think Casual is Supposed to be?
I play all sorts of decks in casual. Many times I'll practice meta decks until I feel confident enough to take them to the ladder.
I do think it would be good to remove the gold farming from casual though. Just make it so you can only earn gold on the ladder, and I believe it would change the makeup of casual dramatically. Completing quests is fine, just remove the 10g earnings.
Also, you guys are talking a lot about tennis. Has Rafael Nadal even made Legend, bro?
What do you think Casual is Supposed to be?
I know the analogy isn‘t perfect but it underlines my argument.
Also, it‘s the tool (i.e the deck) that’s op, not the player. There are no grandmasters, and probably only few legend players in casual. It‘s no Nadal that’s beating your ass, it‘s your neighbour with his new shiny Carbon racket. You can beat him with an average racket, especially with higher skill. But it’s wayyyy more difficult with the 3kg wooden racket you found on the attic of your grandpa.
Ps: People would stand in line for the opportunity to play with Nadal, not resent him. And those people wouldn’t expect to win but maaan would they be proud if they won a ball or two. I would suggest a similar approach to netdeck- matchups
Blizzard Provides an Update on 15.6 Issues - Patch Next Week, Some Bugs Already Fixed
All the basic cards are missing from my collection. Also affected by the note big. Practically impossible to anything but tavern brawl and arena. Hopefully there is some form of compensation.
The Banana Saga part 4 is here!
Read the deck "guide" :)
The Banana Saga part 4 is here!
I'm curious since this is Wild and Hunter - why Chief Inspector rather than Flare or Eater of Secrets? Just the bigger body?
What do you think Casual is Supposed to be?
I don't think this is a very good analogy either. What you said is more like what if Thijs wanted to fight against someone who has only been playing for a week. Playing a good deck doesn't mean you are on-par with pro players.
I am fine with meta-decks in casual because it is not against the rules and I personally feel like it is a little silly complaining that your opponent is playing good cards and now you can't win with your bad cards. Tier-1 decks don't 'belong' in ranked mode, Ranked mode was not made as a place for T-1 decks to be played, and casual mode was not made as a place for bad decks to be played. I think some people don't understand that.
Hearthstone Heroes on Sale Until December 10
Never. I started playing during Kobolds and I've been waiting for them to go on sale ever since.
Convert regular HS cards into HS-BG cards
I think a potentially broken card that was woeful in other game modes (a common trend in Battlegrounds) would be
Given a few buffs and she would be devastating, but as long as there is no way to give her poisonous she might be OK at the higher tiers.
Mogu Fleshshaper May Be Too Powerful!
I am not saying that I don't agree with you, but evolve is rotating out in a month.
The Banana Saga part 4 is here!
Hi all, just shamelessly plugging the 4th installment of my themed deck series: The Banana Saga.
Amazingly this time the deck is not completely awful, but as usual the main feature is the story I have built around it, so check out the deck description if theme decks are your thing.
Wild · Quest Hunter · by AngryShuckie · 6 years, 10 months ago
Descent of Dragons: Arena Impact
I mean i can see how it can look confusing, but when you look at the rest of the cards that give Mana Crystals, they are quite consistent about phrasing giving full or empty ones. I guess Zihi was first to read "set", but it is a precedent for Nozdormu and they do follow it again, so id say in the end, no confusion here :)
What do you think Casual is Supposed to be?
That's not an apt analogy at all.
A better one would be: I'm an amateur tennis player at my local club looking to casually play against other middle-age weekend schlub players, except wow look at that today my opponent is Rafael Nadal. Mr. Nadal could and should easily find better opponents than me, but here he is kicking my teeth in because he wants to try out a new backhand or restrung racket.
See how that might make me resent him for raining on my parade even though he may have a "good reason" for doing so?
What do you think Casual is Supposed to be?
I‘m a little tired of those casual complains. I get your point, you want those Trolden worthy Highkeeper Ra or Desert Obelisk finishes... well they aren‘t worth a dime if you have to face a Mecha‘thun hunter to get there. You may aswell play against the inkeeper.
Other people use casual as a place to learn new decks they just crafted. How can you blame them for that?
Can‘t you just see netdecks as the ultimate challenge for your homebrew? If you can’t get to 40% winrate, the roblem may not be the netdeck but your own.
It‘s like casually playing Tennis but using a badminton racket.
Mogu Fleshshaper May Be Too Powerful!
Yeah that's not gonna work.... at all.
Evolve isn't targetted.
Legends of Runeterra - Progression by the Numbers
You do know that depending on how you count, you will get completely different results?
Lets say for Hearthstone, we count 2 commons, 2 rares, 2 epics and 1 legendary of each type as complete collection, each expansion lasting 4 months, getting 60 gold per day (daily quest, assuming easy quest aka 50 gold + 3 wins to complete the quest, excluding events etc.) you will get ~6700 gold, which is 67 packs which guarantees you atleast 2 legendaries (excluding the free legendaries you get and other packs you get), with 5 cards per pack, on average you would get 1 legendary every 20 packs and the average joe will get 3 legendaries (they are also guaranteed to be different), 13-14 epics, 66 rares, and hundreds of commons, this will result usually in you having half of the epics, only 3 of 23 legendary, a really high chance to have every rare once, and a decent chance to have most key rares (as in rares being played) atleast once or twice (there are 36 rares per set btw), while you are basically guaranteed to have every common
Now 49+49+ lets say you got 22 rares twice, rest are duplicates, so 22+22, no duplicates in the epics, and ofc. no duplicates in legendary (because that is impossible anyway) Golden cards are not included in the calculation at all, that will throw you out at 64% of the entire set, if we slightly tweak the odds and say you never got any duplicate rare, you are at 73% of the entire set, if we were to include the dust you got from the duplicates, and potentially golden duplicates from for example commons, and gifted cards, and rewards from tavern brawls, free arena runs, more free gold you got, event quests, free legendaries (every expansion atleast throws out 1 free legendary) you will easily reach more than 75% completion
Anyway, i am a HS player too, and i havn´t bought any packs, yet i still always get atleast 80% of every single set, with leftover dust, that i use to craft potentially missing key cards in decks i want to play
Now don´t get me wrong, im not trying to really defend hearthstone, i just wanted to make it clear that even though 75% of a set completed sounds nice, but there are a lot of information missing in that post, is it 75% of the set completed included wildcards gained through shards used on cards? Is it just calculated with average luck, are there stuff like "pity timers", because you can easily juggle numbers around (just look at the example above for hearthstone, you will get 75% of the set, yet you can´t play a lot of decks atleast if decks need core legendary cards, that is if they are real core cards, stuff like ziliax, or leeroy jenkins aren´t true core legendary cards, despite them seeing insane amounts of play, is especially the case for midrange/combo and control decks, aggro/tempo decks rarely have real core legendary cards, most legendaries in there are just in there because they excel at it, they aren´t necessary to play the deck succesfully, they will usually just increase winrates by like 0.1% to 1%, in some cases even drop the winrate, due to winrates being skewed by people copying decks without knowing how to play them)
Anyway, im still excited to play the game, i had quite a bit of fun playing in the first preview build, but i can already imagine how false all of your hopes will be especially regarding champion cards, atleast if you want to run a optimal build you will need the same legendary probably 3 times, and another different same legendary also 3 times, that will probably be absolutely impossible, so im imagining rn. that we will probably get a similar situation to hearthstone, where you have a ton of cards, but you just don´t have some of the core game mechanics, for example you lack 3 fioras, you only got 1, or 3 teemos for example, or something like only having 1 draven etc. etc. etc.
Tbf. i havn´t checked how many things you start with, so i have no idea about how bad it will exactly be, but just remember, that you can easily play with numbers to make things sound better