The reason they introduced Standard and Wild in the first place was, among other things, to allow classes to do something different for a certain amount of time. For example, Hunters had difficulty generating value, so lets give them DK Rexxar for a year and a half, let them wear that hat for a while (I know, Hunter have a LOT of value nowadays but that wasn't the case before).
The post they made to describe class identity was literally a way for them to spit on that idea. Quite frankly, if they go through with it, there is a chance that the rotation cycles will no longer feel special because the classes will be forced to play the same way, just with different cards.
In the meantime, a rotating classic set (for example) which would allow them much more freedom to tweak with classes for a period is something that eludes them. Not only that, the fact that the dust and gold systems continue being outdated and extremely detrimental to new players is also ignored.
MTGA is a more expensive game than Hearthstone and even they allow for a F2P guy like me to get pretty much every deck I want without the fear of crafting cards and getting them from packs later. HS only allows that for Legendary minions. Meanwhile, I crafted one Jumbo Imp so I could have two to try a Demonlock deck and I got two extras as my two following epic drops from RoS. By doing stuff like that, they maybe make a small percentage of whales spend an extra 100$/€ on packs for that extra golden legendary but, guess what, they were already going to do that.
What will also happen is people who decide to sometimes spend money on pack promotions feel like their money won't mean as much if half the epics you get are extras while you never get the two copies of the cool yet terrible card you just want to have fun with.
PS: Yeah, the last two paragraphs were mostly unrelated rant filled with confirmation bias, but those greedy business practices of treating costumers like cash registers really annoy me. And this "class identity" speech really reeks of the greedy business practice.
In fact, you should never craft epics in hearthstone; and that means that you will not play some deck until you find the right epic in packs. That sometime won't happen. Then you find 2x druid odd epic in Witchwood and use Odd Druid to (un)climb just because.
However, I think almost the same you wrote: the system of classes and rotations means that every expansion is not based on class identity: it's based on breaking some point of class identity. For example: in a set X we give a good healing to warlock just to push controllock, then after rotation we print a lot of small minion for pushing zoolock; in the same set X, we print a lot of Rush/charge minion for warrior, while after the rotation we print a new way to gain the upgraded hero power.
This would mean that in standard you always play classes in the standard way (pun intended) and in a new way that change yearly, while in wild after some sets you will be able to play every archetype (aggro, midrange, control, combo) with every classes, but in 9 different ways.
Instead, if we focus too much on class identity, we'll have always the same standard archetype in standard, and the same standard archetype but overpowered in wild. Only that in standard you can forget to reprint some tools for some classes, so they'll disappear while others shine.
This card is too expensive for a token deck. You should have played your game much before turn 8, because at turn 8 most of classes have got enough board clear to overcome the token generation. I think it's unplayable.
Yeah, but if the only good Blackrock card is Emperor, I can just craft him tbh.
As legendary, yes. But the other can be used as budget solution for some archetype, or they are still worth 400 dust each, that means a free legendary of your choice. This is a point too.
For non legendaries, the card in Blackrock are part of the dragon engine you can use in dragon warrior or dragon priest, and other interesting card too like flamewalker or grim patron. Most of Blackrock cards are used in some kind of deck, from zoolock to egg druid to the various dragon archetype you can build (warrior, priest, paladin, other).
Adventures are funny! You should buy them for this reason ;)
For the cards, every adventures have cards that are played in wild meta: Naxxramax has some good low rarity card, Loatheb and Kel'Thuzad, while the Mountain has Thaurissan, LoE has Reno Jackson and Brann Bronzebeard, and Kharazan has Barnes and Medivh.
I don't like it very much because it's not "real" yugioh for me.
Yes, modern yugioh with master rule 4 (the Link Summon thing) isn't real too, but whatever. I used to own 16 different meta deck with the old rules to play with friends IRL, now I don't own anything :'(
And while you are right saying that it's a user driven things, it's also true that if they don't find a place, they won't do it. This is why I suggested a generic ccg section instead of a set of sub category for every game or something like that. For example, the guy that started talking about eternal has almost sold it to me, I'm thinking about trying it. I would like not to have to look for a site specific for that, but instead going there where there is a community I like.
Often people don't understand that if something isn't forbidden you can do it, they'll wait for the right place in the right moment. However, you can wait to see if more people are willing to use this feature of course, I just wanted to share the idea :P
As Out of Cards isn't an hearthstone only site as some competitors of old, I think that we should change a little how we handle discussion about things that aren't hearthstone related.
How things are now: we have a big section called "Hearthstone" that contains a lot of different things about our favourite game, a smaller section called "Magic the Gathering" with things related to different media (Magic Arena and paper magic, but more Arena of course), a "Fan Creation" section that seems to be Hearthstone related, and an "Off Topic" with a "video game" subsection.
What I propose: while it's clear that Hearthstone is the most important reason people come here, we must say that there can be more. So I propose to change the section Magic related to one called something like "Other Collective Card Game", with a Magic subsection and an other sub section. Maybe now it would be nearly empty, but in future, who knows? Yugioh, Eternal, Elder Scroll Legends, Artifacts, the secret thing I'm working on, there are a lot of CCG on the market people can discuss on. For the same reason, in the "Fan Creation" section we should have a section for creations that aren't Hearthstone related. I loved how on hearthpwn there were the card creation contest, I know that it's a feature that will be implemented, but there is no reason to stop around Hearthstone. Why not support people who make fan card of Magic? Or Yugioh? Or who want to share arts or code or projects for new ccg? Both are things that shouldn't go in a "video game" under "off topic" section, that is for things that aren't ccg.
I saw that there are now at least 2/3 thread dedicated to other ccg, so sooner or later it can be something implemented.
Rakano aggro is still an effective budget deck ... as you get higher in the ladder ranks, you'd need a fair number of rares, but you can do it without legendaries. Token decks aren't a huge thing these days, but Grenadin drone still sees play in some decks.
Ahhhh. Ok then. So what sets would I need to buy into to catch up a little? And what sets do I need to avoid?
But the most important campaign, IMO, is called "Into Shadow." This gives you several of the most powerful legendary units currently in the game: Vara, Vengeance Seeker; Azindel, Revealed; and Telut, Queen's Hand. All three of these legendaries are major inclusions in a variety of different decks.
After Into Shadow, probably "Homecoming" is the next most important campaign, followed by "Dead Reckoning."
The campaigns each cost 25k gold, or 1k gems (currency). I stress again: Campaigns are the most important things to get for building a base from which to construct good decks. Quite a few cards from several different campaigns are critical pieces of most highly-competitive decks.
I don't really recommend buying specific card packs - you mostly just want to craft anything that you are trying to get (with such a huge card pool, and needing 4 copies of cards for decks, you rarely get close to your deck needs by opening packs). But you do get 100 shiftstone (dust) automatically with each pack, so that helps a little bit toward crafting. As is often the case with card games, the most recent set is probably the best place to start; otherwise maybe the original expac (The Empty Throne) probably is good as well. Many cards from that original set are still used, especially certain legendaries.
Lastly, here's a quick list I threw together (mostly borrowed from another list that was posted on the site, but its a VERY standard list for Rakano Aggro; doesn't really belong to anyone). I added "sideboard" rares that can be used to upgrade the budget list. https://eternalwarcry.com/decks/d/NYuJCK2lNo8/a-budget-rakano-aggro
25k gold for a campaing is something you can easily or hardly get as a ftp only player? I have spent much money on Hearthstone, and before that Yugioh, and I promise to never do it again :P (except maybe some team fortress hat)
Al'Akir the Windlord is good because he's evergreen, sooner or later he will be played again. In wild he can be played. Control and midrange shaman love this card, so I think he'll find space in the right meta
Scargil is useless, IMHO, as you want a very low curve in this deck. The value generators are more important than this guy.
Electra Stormsurge and Zentimo I own electra and in wild control shaman she is strong, but I wouldn't craft her without a clear deck to craft. The same apply to Zentimo: both are good but only in the right deck. Go ahead and craft them IF you do want to play with that decks.
Darius Crowley is very strong in the right meta. I own him and I can say that tempo/rush warrior is strong... or well, he would be strong if the meta was different.
Archivist Elysiana is a dead card in everything that isn't a control-fatigue mirror match. I wouldn't craft her.
So, in the end, I suggest you Al'akir, or either Zentimo or Electra if you really like this kind of shaman.
No, they will never do anything like that - with only one possible exception.
Because there is an unwritten rule that say if you are a standard only player, you can freely dust all card rotating at the end of the year to gather dust for newer cards coming. Making wild card coming back would be bad for this people, and this would be a bad commercial move.
The only exception I can see is if they add some cards to the "eternal standard" pool, some sort of opposite of the Hall of Fame. But to feel good doing this, they should do it only during the yearly rotation with card that would rotate. For example, they could make Whizzbang into classic during the next rotation.
Because nowaday Krush deals 8 damage for 9 mana, while Leeroy Jenkins + Hero Power deals the same for 7 mana. This says that without beast synergy King Krush is pointless. At (8) mana instead it could be played with the hero power, becoming as strong as a Pyroblast, that isn't crazy strong, and becoming better then the neutral Leeroy, a thing that class legendaries should be.
You know? I like the competition. This is a reason more to post here my decklist. I just hope more will follow.
I really dislike when people don't recognize the work of other people. I remember how many thread on Heartpwn had that pink/violet deathwing on them. It remember a thing that happened to me some years ago on my old site. I really dislike this kind of people.
Archivist Elysiana is a tech card. She should used only when the deck she counters (other control warrior or other infinite value no fatigue deck, standard or wild) are too much at your rank, and your win rate isn't enough high.
If either one condition isn't met, you should not play it. Just like you don't play Dirty Rat in a meta without combo deck.
My feedback is: isn't too much work needed to get a 15/15 doNothingTheTurnIsSummoned waiting for the right removal? At least the Ancient One was a 30/30, able to kill your opponent in one attack. And I think it's not worded clearly enough - I'm not sure how he's supposed to work. Otherwise, I like the concept of evolving minion. Even if I don't think it would become meta, the deck surely would be fun. Can I suggest to print some card to protect the grons?
IF YOU DON'T PLAY ME, YOUR ARROGANCE WILL BE YOUR UNDOING!
I joined the game :)
after some days in, I'll give a feedback. Other than the fact that I didn't play enough Hearthstone this days :(
The pack's conteint is decided at the time you open it. So, if you wait, you can get the newer cards.
In fact, you should never craft epics in hearthstone; and that means that you will not play some deck until you find the right epic in packs. That sometime won't happen. Then you find 2x druid odd epic in Witchwood and use Odd Druid to (un)climb just because.
However, I think almost the same you wrote: the system of classes and rotations means that every expansion is not based on class identity: it's based on breaking some point of class identity. For example: in a set X we give a good healing to warlock just to push controllock, then after rotation we print a lot of small minion for pushing zoolock; in the same set X, we print a lot of Rush/charge minion for warrior, while after the rotation we print a new way to gain the upgraded hero power.
This would mean that in standard you always play classes in the standard way (pun intended) and in a new way that change yearly, while in wild after some sets you will be able to play every archetype (aggro, midrange, control, combo) with every classes, but in 9 different ways.
Instead, if we focus too much on class identity, we'll have always the same standard archetype in standard, and the same standard archetype but overpowered in wild. Only that in standard you can forget to reprint some tools for some classes, so they'll disappear while others shine.
This card is too expensive for a token deck. You should have played your game much before turn 8, because at turn 8 most of classes have got enough board clear to overcome the token generation. I think it's unplayable.
As legendary, yes. But the other can be used as budget solution for some archetype, or they are still worth 400 dust each, that means a free legendary of your choice. This is a point too.
For non legendaries, the card in Blackrock are part of the dragon engine you can use in dragon warrior or dragon priest, and other interesting card too like flamewalker or grim patron. Most of Blackrock cards are used in some kind of deck, from zoolock to egg druid to the various dragon archetype you can build (warrior, priest, paladin, other).
Adventures are funny! You should buy them for this reason ;)
For the cards, every adventures have cards that are played in wild meta: Naxxramax has some good low rarity card, Loatheb and Kel'Thuzad, while the Mountain has Thaurissan, LoE has Reno Jackson and Brann Bronzebeard, and Kharazan has Barnes and Medivh.
For me is gen 2, I love Typhlosion because was one of the first cards I had on the tcg.
I think this is one of the most reasonable post here. Give more alternatives and we'll see less big priest around.
I don't like it very much because it's not "real" yugioh for me.
Yes, modern yugioh with master rule 4 (the Link Summon thing) isn't real too, but whatever. I used to own 16 different meta deck with the old rules to play with friends IRL, now I don't own anything :'(
https://outof.cards/forums/off-topic/video-games/617-yu-gi-oh-duel-links
https://outof.cards/forums/off-topic/video-games/671-elder-scrolls-legends
https://outof.cards/forums/off-topic/video-games/661-eternal-ccg
And while you are right saying that it's a user driven things, it's also true that if they don't find a place, they won't do it. This is why I suggested a generic ccg section instead of a set of sub category for every game or something like that.
For example, the guy that started talking about eternal has almost sold it to me, I'm thinking about trying it. I would like not to have to look for a site specific for that, but instead going there where there is a community I like.
Often people don't understand that if something isn't forbidden you can do it, they'll wait for the right place in the right moment. However, you can wait to see if more people are willing to use this feature of course, I just wanted to share the idea :P
As Out of Cards isn't an hearthstone only site as some competitors of old, I think that we should change a little how we handle discussion about things that aren't hearthstone related.
How things are now: we have a big section called "Hearthstone" that contains a lot of different things about our favourite game, a smaller section called "Magic the Gathering" with things related to different media (Magic Arena and paper magic, but more Arena of course), a "Fan Creation" section that seems to be Hearthstone related, and an "Off Topic" with a "video game" subsection.
What I propose: while it's clear that Hearthstone is the most important reason people come here, we must say that there can be more. So I propose to change the section Magic related to one called something like "Other Collective Card Game", with a Magic subsection and an other sub section. Maybe now it would be nearly empty, but in future, who knows? Yugioh, Eternal, Elder Scroll Legends, Artifacts, the secret thing I'm working on, there are a lot of CCG on the market people can discuss on.
For the same reason, in the "Fan Creation" section we should have a section for creations that aren't Hearthstone related. I loved how on hearthpwn there were the card creation contest, I know that it's a feature that will be implemented, but there is no reason to stop around Hearthstone. Why not support people who make fan card of Magic? Or Yugioh? Or who want to share arts or code or projects for new ccg?
Both are things that shouldn't go in a "video game" under "off topic" section, that is for things that aren't ccg.
I saw that there are now at least 2/3 thread dedicated to other ccg, so sooner or later it can be something implemented.
25k gold for a campaing is something you can easily or hardly get as a ftp only player? I have spent much money on Hearthstone, and before that Yugioh, and I promise to never do it again :P (except maybe some team fortress hat)
Al'Akir the Windlord is good because he's evergreen, sooner or later he will be played again. In wild he can be played. Control and midrange shaman love this card, so I think he'll find space in the right meta
Scargil is useless, IMHO, as you want a very low curve in this deck. The value generators are more important than this guy.
Electra Stormsurge and Zentimo I own electra and in wild control shaman she is strong, but I wouldn't craft her without a clear deck to craft. The same apply to Zentimo: both are good but only in the right deck. Go ahead and craft them IF you do want to play with that decks.
The Soularium is nice.
Darius Crowley is very strong in the right meta. I own him and I can say that tempo/rush warrior is strong... or well, he would be strong if the meta was different.
Archivist Elysiana is a dead card in everything that isn't a control-fatigue mirror match. I wouldn't craft her.
So, in the end, I suggest you Al'akir, or either Zentimo or Electra if you really like this kind of shaman.
No, they will never do anything like that - with only one possible exception.
Because there is an unwritten rule that say if you are a standard only player, you can freely dust all card rotating at the end of the year to gather dust for newer cards coming. Making wild card coming back would be bad for this people, and this would be a bad commercial move.
The only exception I can see is if they add some cards to the "eternal standard" pool, some sort of opposite of the Hall of Fame. But to feel good doing this, they should do it only during the yearly rotation with card that would rotate. For example, they could make Whizzbang into classic during the next rotation.
King Krush should be buffed to (8) mana. Why?
Because nowaday Krush deals 8 damage for 9 mana, while Leeroy Jenkins + Hero Power deals the same for 7 mana. This says that without beast synergy King Krush is pointless. At (8) mana instead it could be played with the hero power, becoming as strong as a Pyroblast, that isn't crazy strong, and becoming better then the neutral Leeroy, a thing that class legendaries should be.
What is commander?
You know? I like the competition. This is a reason more to post here my decklist. I just hope more will follow.
I really dislike when people don't recognize the work of other people. I remember how many thread on Heartpwn had that pink/violet deathwing on them. It remember a thing that happened to me some years ago on my old site. I really dislike this kind of people.
Archivist Elysiana is a tech card. She should used only when the deck she counters (other control warrior or other infinite value no fatigue deck, standard or wild) are too much at your rank, and your win rate isn't enough high.
If either one condition isn't met, you should not play it. Just like you don't play Dirty Rat in a meta without combo deck.
My feedback is: isn't too much work needed to get a 15/15 doNothingTheTurnIsSummoned waiting for the right removal? At least the Ancient One was a 30/30, able to kill your opponent in one attack.
And I think it's not worded clearly enough - I'm not sure how he's supposed to work.
Otherwise, I like the concept of evolving minion. Even if I don't think it would become meta, the deck surely would be fun. Can I suggest to print some card to protect the grons?