Everyone's favourite Hearthstone Dad, Dean "Iksar" Ayala has brought us another Q&A! As usual, here's our recap of all the important points and a full transcript of the event.
- All previous Q&As from Dean can be found under our "Iksar's Community Q&A" topic.
- Anything covered in the previous Q&As will not be covered in the recap but will appear in the transcript below.
Next week is Dean's last week of work for the rest of the year. He will continue to do AMAs while out of office every 2-3 weeks. He is taking time off to spend time with the family.
Quote From Dean Ayala That's it for AMA!
Next week is my last week at work for the rest of the year. I'll continue to do AMAs every 2-3 weeks while I'm out. Taking two months off to spend time with my 4-month old before he starts daycare!
See you next week!
Balance
- Gallon says we aren't getting any spoilers for potential balance.
- Gallon also says that they can take another look at Pursuit of Justice next week.
Design
- Being aware of how different types of players consume content is one of the ways to avoid players exploiting systems.
- Designing a rewards system is a good example. How does one not give the game away for free while both rewarding players who play for 8 hours a day and 10 minutes a week?
Datamining
- "Reality of our industry, in a live-service game I think you just have to embrace it rather than fight it."
Battlegrounds
- They haven't felt it necessary to have a pool of rotating content yet.
- Dean thinks they'll rotate tribes at some point.
Mercenaries
- Dean was surprised by the positive response from very hardcore players.
- "I knew there was potential for fun competitive gameplay but thought it would take more time to get that across."
- The team is still digesting the initial reception of the mode before making their future plans.
- Once a more concrete plan is set in place for Mercenaries, they'll share that with the community.
- The change to Mysterious Stranger today is so players don't feel forced to run low-level content.
- They will be looking at feedback around the change over the weekend.
- Its still too early to be talking about balance and the meta is changing drastically still. If it gets stale, they'll make changes.
- The team will continue to improve Mercenaries over time, they aren't going to abandon the mode.
Pandaren Ninjas
- The lack of Ninjas over Pirates is due to them being less prevalent in the Warcraft universe.
- Eric Dodds, Hearthstone's original game director, always talked about wanting to do a Ninjas vs Pirates expansion.
- The Shado-Pan fit into the Ninja role and Dean could see them being a major part of a Ninja theme if/when they go to Pandaria.
Tavern Brawls
- No concrete plans are in place yet for new brawls. The live content team is "really free-form" so content they work on is "open-ended".
Botting
- They ban man, many accounts but it will never be a completely solved problem. Bot authors get better and better.
Priest
- There must always be a worst class.
- "We aren't that far removed from two very powerful (barrens control, shadow aggro) priest archetypes."
- "Priest will be back, but as a wise designer Mike Donais once said, there must always be a worst class."
Dean
- Had a sub for lunch.
- Thinks Hammond/Wrecking Ball from Overwatch would make a great Hearthstone card.
- His current favourite non-Blizzard game is Valorant.
Full Transcript of Iksar's Q&A #34
Quote From Dean Ayala Hearthstone AMA #34 7:30PM - 8:30PM PST Ask me a question about Hearthstone! Or Design! (or anime…) https://t.co/B7tyq6pD0i (Source)
@IksarHS how do you design systems knowing that your users will constantly look for edges to exploit, at many times completely subverting your intentions?
@RidiculousHat Carefully?! Just have to be aware there are players that consume content in vastly different ways and to try to create systems that are appealing to both extremes of users. We often think in terms of different player stories when spot checking a system for fun. (Source)
@RidiculousHat Rewards systems are usually pretty good examples of this. How do you design something that doesn't give your whole game away for free, is rewarding for someone that plays 8 hours a day, and is rewarding for someone that plays 10 minutes a week? (Source)
@IksarHS Have you considered giving the players the power to ban cards/class that they dont want to face in ladder? I think it will make the world a better place.
@DaddyOni_HS I'd like to trial a limited period where players can ban a class of their choice. Would have strange meta implications but I think there is a good chance it makes Hearthstone more fun. Not in development, just on a wishlist as we catch up on content work post mercenaries. (Source)
@IksarHS What do you think about Datamining?
@RaneTDF reality of our industry, in a live-service game I think you just have to embrace it rather than fight it (Source)
@IksarHS why multiplayer games, in general, do not celebre "player's account anniversary". I think the day a player started playing a game is very relevant, but it is rarely ever used and even remembered. Some companies (riot, for example), goes one step further and doesn't allow me+
@IksarHS celebrate*
@Shmilia There are some light versions of this like the monthly card back reward, but I agree we could generally do better at conveying a players history in a game where the intention is you collect and play over many (10+!?) years. (Source)
@IksarHS Has there been any discussion of having Battlegrounds have rotating content, or stick with the status quo of regular updates? We've seen some heroes rotate, but would be interesting if certain tribes or cards did, with the intent of them returning, not necessarily for balance.
@pocky_plays We've rotated out cards and will rotate out tribes at some point, just haven't felt it necessary yet. (Source)
@IksarHS What surprised you most from the first (almost) two weeks of Mercenaries?
@WickedGood I actually wasn't expecting such a positive response from very hardcore competitive players. I knew there was potential for fun competitive gameplay but thought it would take more time to get that across. (Source)
@IksarHS Naoki Urusawa's monster? Ever seen it?
@Alex_Marcy no what do you rate it out of 10? (Source)
@IksarHS What was for lunch today?
@InziHS subway (Source)
@IksarHS do you think it would be possible for a kind of mercenaries AMA to happen about the future of the mode? Im sure many, as I do, have many questions about how the team will handle content, updates, mercs and balance.
@Wiibomb I think the mercs team is digesting the initial reception of mercs before setting all the future plans in stone. Once they have a clearer picture on the future of the mode with current feedback in mind we'll share that with the community. (Source)
@IksarHS Are we gonna have 100% chance to find "Mysterious Stranger" now that we have to fight in a more difficult bounty?
@Yank_07 Intention of the change was to stop players from feeling like they have to farm the same low-level content over and over again to play optimally. Paul (lead design) and Ben (game director) will be mulling the feedback of the recent change over the weekend. (Source)
@IksarHS @Yank_07 Dear Iksar, in CN community there are totally bad feedbacks. Please really re-consider about this. I have reported this to Mr. Ding early this morning by Twitter. Farming low level content isn't a bad feeling way. We need to pay more time, even more than now. This is really…
@Romencasa @Yank_07 I've heard some feedback already from Chinese community. Have some close friends there that have been translating the feedback. Thanks for sharing, we'll consider over the weekend. (Source)
@IksarHS Happy Friday Lord @IksarHS … hope you are doing well. Since you added DH in HS, my question for today is: Have the team discussed the idea to add DK and/or Monk any time soon (any time soon = within the next 2-3 years)? Have you considered other "classes" outside WoW?
@HolyKnight077 Yes… We've considered all three of those things rather carefully…. Not ready to talk about which one of them is most likely 👀 (Source)
@HolyKnight077 No timeline yet, but we'll do another class at some point 😃 (Source)
@IksarHS @HolyKnight077 Iksars edgy it's always death knights :)
@BenMorrow1 @HolyKnight077 a good guess but I don't decide that sort of thing these days :) (Source)
@IksarHS Boxers or briefs
@ottersHS pfft briefs man, who wears boxers?! (Source)
@IksarHS Whats one non-Warcraft Blizzard character that you think would make a sweet Hearthstone card?
@MyntyPhresh https://t.co/OjHy9aevK1 (Source)
@IksarHS Good choice, here's my take https://t.co/eZnAKicjxe
@MyntyPhresh that's just a good body (Source)
@IksarHS Asked this one a few times 😛 Are we ever likely to see a buff to Auctioneer Jaxon and Pursuit of justice? Pursuit feels bad at 2 but could be great at 1, similar to Wildfire. Jaxon feels too situational even in decks with lots of tradeable cards. Thanks Dean!
@Tacticalian a better question for @Chakki_HS @GallonHS or @BoarControl (Source)
@IksarHS @Tacticalian @Chakki_HS @BoarControl No spoilers for any balance change considerations! But I think we can take another look at Pursuit of Justice next week 🙂
@GallonHS @Tacticalian @Chakki_HS @BoarControl that sort of sounds like a spoiler https://t.co/QUWtJaMkgn (Source)
@IksarHS @Tacticalian @Chakki_HS @BoarControl No spoilers for what does and what doesn’t constitute a spoiler (Source)
@IksarHS Is it likely that we'll see some Ninja representation in the future? I think Team Pirate has overtaken the spoils a bit
@VillalobosChamp Ninjas are slightly less prevalent in the warcraft universe :). Our original game director Eric Dodds used to talk about doing a Pirates vs Ninjas set but I wasn't sure if he was actually serious or just liked saying Pirates vs Ninjas. (Source)
@VillalobosChamp Shado-Pan from Pandaria are probably the closest representation of ninja I can think of in Warcraft. If/when we ever go to that continent for expansion content we'll probably make a fair bit of ninja stuff (Source)
@IksarHS About Mercs… when can we expect some balance changes? The tier list and the guides show a clear sland between high end heroes like Cairne and Diablo, and bottom of the barrel garbage like Millhouse. There are only 2, blink fox and Tyrande to support, but Mllhose is fragile
@cinco5cuatro4 @IksarHS ¿Team 5 balance? Hahahaha
@Rullopo @cinco5cuatro4 https://t.co/e3yRQPv4cC (Source)
@cinco5cuatro4 Still pretty early. Meta decks shared in the community and played on pvp ladder have been drastically different over the first few days of play. We'll see if the same meta still persists for longer than another couple days before swooping in to make changes. (Source)
@IksarHS What're some of your favorite non-blizzard games?
@Hyperin7 right now my favorite is valorant props to @Max_Grossman and team it's such an excellent game (Source)
@IksarHS We are getting a New Tavern Brawl November 3rd! 👏🏼 With Team 5 having hired a Live Content Designer and Mercenaries being out what are the plans for new Tavern Brawls going forward? https://t.co/678EQGxatf
@ben_heathstone That team is really free-form, so the content the new designers will be making is really open-ended. No details quite yet! (Source)
@IksarHS @ben_heathstone Like water. (Source)
@IksarHS What did you think of the ending of squid game?
@GamblerStream I didn't mind it but it was my least favorite of the beginning/middle/end (Source)
@IksarHS I'm a CN hearthstone player. Too many robots in Standard or Wild, even worse in Mercs. You do have ways to identify the robots and why not try your best to ban them? And what can we expect for priests in the future, because the redesign of priests didn't save them.
@h0COAa2eEIF039W we ban many, many robots turns out, robot makers are very smart and make new robots that are harder to track we'll keep fighting the good fight but it's unlikely this will ever be a completely solved problem (Source)
@IksarHS Should users/players report bugs? If so, what is the best way to report bugs? (For example, I heard posting on forums is one way)
@contigwrites bug report forum is good (Source)
@IksarHS Do you see a re-write for Priest in general coming up? Possibly to a mid-range style of play? Just feels like Priest is just subpar at everything lately. Quest is far too slow, combo destroys control and aggro is outclassed by other aggro classes.
@ScottyH_0823 We aren't that far removed from two very powerful (barrens control, shadow aggro) priest archetypes. Priest will be back, but as a wise designer @mike_donais once said, there must always be a worst class. (Source)
@IksarHS Any news on the miniset?
@kkkkoren_ we will have one :) our publishing team will announce the dates when they are ready (Source)
@IksarHS why was the mercenaries change made??
@WTomack paul (lead designer for merc) left some comments here: https://t.co/5hWGbcGJeo (Source)
@IksarHS will we see changes to the progression path in mercenaries after today's changes? Personally current PvE feels boring/monotonous and has kept me from playing mercs, if PvE was a more enjoyable experience I'd be way more into it
@JBrightt_ Hard to interpret the feedback. If the question is 'will the team try and make mercs better and better over time?' the answer is yes, of course. (Source)
Comments
"The change to Mysterious Stranger today is so players don't feel forced to run low-level content."
So, the solution is to literally force us to do high-level bounties only instead and not have any choice at all? Cool.
They are banning people man....
Man has been banned from HS, only elves and orcs are allowed to play from now on.
At this point, I am convinced we will eventually see a class ban system. I hope if it does get implemented, they are willing to remove it if it is not as successful as Dean imagines it to be.
Not sure if anyone heard of this yet, but there seem to be a new way to farm for xp. Start a game in mercs, then leave it hanging. No bots, no mods, no macros. Just leave it while the virtual pinwheel turns and the tumbleweed tumble. Apparently this works, but I have too much self respect to test it out.
On the subject of botting. Its still somewhat rife down in bronze wild, but I'd argue that in a way that's good for most people. Its certainly easy to farm out the achievements if nothing else. Somewhat annoying because you can take a 10 second move and then proceed to wait out a minute but that's just an easy way to grind out achievements without dying by turn 6.
And I hope that they do something about the tasks grinding in mercs. No one likes grinding up that poor air elemental for tasks but the requirements for a maxed out character - or indeed, to upgrade an ability at all - requires so many coins that we're really forced to do it to get anything progressed at all. Just make it easier to get the coins we need. Here's a suggestion: How about to guarantee the coins received from boss chest so when I beat a boss I get exactly what I want: instead of getting yet another marvelous 20 coins for Cariel because the random generators for coins are completely, and utterly whacked.
Its amazing how many characters I maxed out on even as I completely ignore them from day 1. Old Cornelius got so much for doing so little its almost like he has a mandated government pension cut from every boss chest I open.
Or just make strangers a guaranteed deal at higher difficulties. I know some players likes the potato, but its obvious that this along with sabotage and portal are mere fillers that frustrates rather than excite.
As someone who is enjoying playing the Mercs PvE for what it is, I have to say I'm a little perplexed (though not entirely surprised) by people's need for an optimised grind for coins. I haven't touched PvP at all, but isn't it designed so you're not actually at a disadvantage if you don't have maxed out mercs? If so, why would people need to rush it?
I would happily stay out of the discussion as I play it at my own pace, but I'm conscious that what benefits PvP-focused grinders is a bit misaligned with what benefits PvE-focused players, who want the game to be tolerably fast to grind (which it already is) while retaining the game's longevity. Your comments about the potato, sabotage and portal acknowledge this disconnect, but disregard the opinions of the PvE players who like them rather too lightly for my liking.
Ive stayed out of pvp and I cant say I can see myself ever going there. Talking strictly as a f2p (whom the lord may forgive but I cant let go of that 5 bucks deal), there is a good reason to grind the stranger and that's because that's the most efficient way of getting additional mercs so you can execute sweeter combos. Besides which, the upgrade requirements aren't exactly slouches themselves. You get 10-20 coins per boss chest and anything above the first upgrade comes in the hundreds. It is only with the bonuses granted by strangers that the grind feels even remotely tolerable - unless one is prepared to wait day by day for tasks to come in.
Its not a misalignment because clearly grinding is not mandatory for those who would rather take it slow. But for those who prefer a faster lane, blizz has just erected a metaphorical speed bump and that's just a downgrade worthy of being pointed out as slightly scummy, especially since there's really nothing wrong if a person would like to grind up air elemental for hours on end. Dean has pointed out that they didn't want "players...feeling like they have to farm the same low-level content over and over again to play optimally" but let's be honest here, there are plenty of alternatives other than this 'hotfix' that would achieve the same thing without pissing both sides of the divide off.
Lastly, Im not sure what's with the potato that apparently pve players like so much. I can only name one boss that it really genuinely helped but in all other times its either completely useless or usually end up blowing my face off.
Well there is certainly some misalignment somewhere, as evidenced by you not understanding why some people like the potato. Wherever the split of the playerbase exists, there IS a downside to cutting out the non-stranger events to pander to those eager to farm asap. I don't want them removed because they make the bounties more interesting:
As for Blizz's change, I'm on the fence about it. I was never planning on grinding heroic air elemental anyway. However, I do respect that a monotonous grind of taking level 30s on a level 8 bounty is not the game Blizz wanted to make, and they have every right to modify systems to encourage players to properly interface with the game as they intended. The affected players will argue that they are within their rights to play the game however they choose, and that is true, but I do think the change happened early enough that it is better described as 'conceptual debugging' (I.e. a tweak to make the game better fit what the designers where conceptualising) than a plain scummy move.
Behind all of this is the time scale over which people want to reach some sort of end state. I think a lot of people are viewing it like everything needs to be achieved over a few weeks, while the game is actually designed for it to take months for F2P players, which makes perfectly good sense when HS has always had updates appear on those time scales.
Ironically, all this really does is to switch air elemental with snowclaw. Is it really a change meeting their expectations? I'd argue if they make the coin drops a guaranteed thing then people might actually want to grind different bosses according to the coins given.
Ive been grinding air elemental before, and currently Im grinding snowclaw instead. My progress has been slowed down and so I play less hours as a result. Im sure for others the implications is similar if not worse, and I feel that the devs fully understand that the community is not happy with the change - hence why Dean was quick to suggest that they would be discussing this next week.
They designed a game that involved a lot of grinding and then decided that they didn't like how people were doing it efficiently. If they wanted us to enjoy the game while including the grind its fairly simple (outside of a game redesign); just make the playing the variety of bosses more rewarding. As for the time scale argument - Im willing to bet that a f2p player would never get beyond the mid tier of the MMR table even in the next 4 months assuming they didn't grind for strangers. And I base that on the fact that Ive been doing so for the last week and a half at over 4 hours per day, completing about 10-15 tasks - the best part is that Im not even close to being ready for high end pvp despite it all.
At least Snowclaw is a level 30 bounty, so there is a modicum of actual gameplay there. Against Air Elemental you can switch off your brain to the point where it isn't even a game anymore; it's just a chore.
The way the 'pick the optimal bounty and grind that for everything' method works is clearly running counter to the designers' intent. They did a sensible thing by telling us bounty X will give coins for mercs A, B and C, giving us a focus on where to grind when we want specific things while building in variety over time as we hunt coins for different mercs. That this isn't being used is an obvious 'conceptual bug' in my eyes. As you suggest, that could be resolved by making the coins given when you lose being for the same pool of mercs as in the final chest.
That influences the time scale a bit too. With completely random coins you're spreading resources thin, which slows things down compared to being able to focus on a sub-set of mercs. Not all of which are needed to be a high-level PvP player, of course.
In a much broader picture though, I see a split by 'healthy' gameplay and 'unhealthy' gameplay. Mercs is weird because it is actually really well designed to incentivise both. There is so much in there that lets super-casual players like me relax and enjoy it without feeling any need to maximise everything immediately, all while setting plausible mid-to-long term targets. But at the same time, I have to acknowledge how many people there are who are slaving away, grinding out coins as quickly as they can for... that's where I get stuck. I don't really see what they are doing it for. To me the game is very clear on not needing to max out mercs, let alone all of them, even for PvP. From what I've read I don't think the devs expected people to take the PvP quite as seriously as they do, although they would certainly have been aware of how obsessed people can get with this sort of game.
All of that is why I have largely kept out of discussions. I am really enjoying it as a casual game where the 'grinding' is really just me playing bounties because I want to, and openly admit I don't fully understand the mentality behind the more aggressive grinding performed by others.
Don't get me wrong, I love to see a stranger, but don't take away my potato :P
It's a matter of "Given the opportunity, players will optimize the fun out of a game". Doesn't matter if it's Hearthstone, Civilization, or Hello Kitty Island Adventure...
Blizzard: How would you guys like a new PvE casual mode with a slice of PvP in it?
Playerbase: *heavy breathing intensifies* Better crank up the grind-o-tron 3000 and no-life unlock everything in less than 2 weeks!
Yeah, it always happens. Sadly it's not just confined to games either. Too often people, companies and countries chase profits and power at the expense of quality of life, which is surely the whole reason people would have wanted money and power in the first place?
I've seen F2P players slave away with meta decks for years in the belief that it will enable them build a large enough collection so they can start enjoying more casual decks, but never actually stop to play those decks. I worry a bit that people are doing the same thing with Mercs, and ruining their own enjoyment for a game they genuinely do like by chasing a dream that Blizz, like every company true to the spirit of capitalism, has placed conveniently just out of reach. You can bet new content releases for Mercs just often enough that it's not actually feasible to both enjoy the game and max out everything (without spending significant amounts of money, of course).
So yeah, having watched players and the world around me chase dreams to no avail, I've learned to aim low, but do so with a smile on my face.