Zephrys is definitely bad against secrets when you have lethal already, so play him earlier. I had lethal on board against an Exodia Mage and he offered me Pyroblast (I could cast it due to an unanswered Emperor), Gorehowl and Soul of the Forest.
Well, we finally got tournament mode... except that it's only for players in China.
What I don't get is that if they already have the interface and game formatting set up and they're using it in China, why can't they use it everywhere else too?
Yeah, I would not expect anything from a separate client over here. It would have to be baked into the game, available on all platforms, and require resources to actually implement it. RIP
That's amazing but I'm afraid we won't be getting this feature soon on EU or NA although literally everyone has been asking for tournament mode and replays for ages! FeelsBadMan (but hopeful nonetheless)
Those look like some fun decks. Is Sylvanas Windrunner too slow for either deck? I would love to give her reborn. Could help swing the board in your favor.
Maybe in the midrange one. I had considered her when building it, but the lack of immediate deathrattle triggers make her rather slow.
Yeah looking back I can't see how she would fit into the faster deck. Should fit into the midrange deck nicely though since she is a decent body on the board that your opponent has to play around. Plus there are ways to duplicate her or trigger her deathrattle in the deck.
This thread is definitely interesting and should help understand the (current) capabilities of Zephrys. I've only used him for very simple board clears or single target removals so far (and he's very good at those) but he's not perfect by any means. BoarControl even started a tweet thread with weird Zephrys results.
Anyway, I'd imagine RavenSun's issue to be the fact that he probably didn't have minions on board or a weapon in hand, so Zephrys didn't think he wanted secret removal but a lethal instead. Although I don't think trying to offer a lethal in that situation is a massive mistake, the fact that he only offers lethals could definitely be improved as you might well be looking for something else. It also seems he offered only spell-lethals, why didn't he suggest charge minions as well?
Maybe what we are seeing is purposeful dialing back of how "perfect" Zephyrs is so that it can remain a fun and helpful card to play but doesn't feel unfair on the other side. Generally speaking even super powerful legendaries require some build around or thought into how to use them to maximize their effectiveness. Maybe they don't want Zephyrs to give options that are TOO optimal so that he doesn't become an automatic win card.
I don't know if this is the case but it seems like it could be possible.
He's limited within Basic and Classic sets. He's already not perfect, in the solutions he has available.
But at least he should be optimal with what he has, given his public perspective: i do not expect he never fails, but he should always offer what i expect to find, in one of the 3 options. AT LEAST in the reactive scenario where he's played for immediate answer.
He can never be unfair, because one has to cripple themselves to Singleton deck before being able to play him. And that's a huge price already that cannot afford whiffs like those we are gathering here.
You make a very good point here. Given that he is limited to basic and classic sets and you have to have a singleton deck for him to work I am surprised at the lack of variety in choices in the OP. His code should analyze the situation and give three possible different answers rather than 3 essentially the same options. It is strange that he would only offer three damage cards twice in a row and not anything else. Even if he doesn't know what secrets they have it is simply redundant and unhelpful to offer cards that all do the same thing. It would even be better to offer one damage card, one taunt card, and one tech card in that situation. That would allow the player some choice and the ability to determine what they thought was the optimal play.
For how much China hates gambling, that interface looks awfully like a slot machine :D
Sorry was the bit about hating gambling sarcastic? Because if not that's a crazy thing to say - Gambling is HUGE in China. I know it's *technically* illegal on the mainland, which is why Macau gets the special admin status. It is the ninth-highest recipient of tourism revenue in the world and its gaming industry is seven times larger than that of Las Vegas (that's according to the CIA anyways - link below). In 2016, Macau's gaming-related taxes on it's nearly 100 billion in revenues account for a huge % of total government tax revenue. In 2015, Macau hosted nearly 31 million visitors, and over 2/3rds came from mainland China.
I tried to somehow put Brann into this deck numerous times but the problem is in tempo loss. Your huge problem is early game, you just can't hold brann in your hand and wait for the best opportunity - Zephrys or new Brann. Meta is just too aggresive to play Reno Hunter like that.
You can still definitely try that, maybe u will be luckier than I am. With this version I'm curently on 62% WR and maybe I will later on try to add him again tho :D
Zephrys the Great is, for all its fanfare, really a situational algorithm; it just takes a look at the scenario and offers what it's programming determines as "perfect". I know that is kind of obvious, but what I'd like to point out is that means it does not consider what cards will be played against you. It will not take the size of the hand for Big Priest into consideration, even though that is public knowledge, as it doesn't know the trend of the meta and the typical strategies. It doesn't see a Pogo-Hopper on the board and determine you need to kill it before it can be copied into a deck, as it doesn't know what the thief probably has in their hand. You would have to take a screenshot of the board, show it to a stranger who knows all the basic and classic cards (but none of the current decks or play-styles), and ask what card do I need to get an equivalent of the algorithm. I think it is an interesting and fun card which can be extremely useful, but it has definite limitations.
That all being said, I agree that the options given should be fairly diverse (although, since Zephyris will not know the popular decks, the diversity offered may seem ridiculous within the current meta) and range across potential play styles. To offer a set of 3 spells that all do direct damage, or 3 taunt minions, or to value Hex over Polymorph is bad coding...
that looks pretty neat. I hope it's something they're looking to implement in other regions. China's HS always feels separate from NA/EU/AP though so i'm not too optimistic.
Anyone else have a fully created profile, yet no profile achievement? Am I missing something?
That one is still broken due to one part of the achievement, the trigger for a person having user profile created in a first place :) Once that is fixed, you should get the achievement. You might have to edit your sig or something to re-trigger it tho, possibly. Keep a look out on Site Updates.
Wonder if this will make it to the rest of the world. I know I am still waiting to get the more complete user data/history. I would really be interested in seeing that information.
Maybe what we are seeing is purposeful dialing back of how "perfect" Zephyrs is so that it can remain a fun and helpful card to play but doesn't feel unfair on the other side. Generally speaking even super powerful legendaries require some build around or thought into how to use them to maximize their effectiveness. Maybe they don't want Zephyrs to give options that are TOO optimal so that he doesn't become an automatic win card.
I don't know if this is the case but it seems like it could be possible.
He's limited within Basic and Classic sets. He's already not perfect, in the solutions he has available.
But at least he should be optimal with what he has, given his public perspective: i do not expect he never fails, but he should always offer what i expect to find, in one of the 3 options. AT LEAST in the reactive scenario where he's played for immediate answer.
He can never be unfair, because one has to cripple themselves to Singleton deck before being able to play him. And that's a huge price already that cannot afford whiffs like those we are gathering here.
Haven't played Zephrys against secrets yet, but I have found him to be very predictable in some scenarios. I had one game with opponent at 12 health with a large taunt, and I had a 10 attack minion. I played Blessing of Kings first so my minion had lethal damage, then played Zephrys for a Sap. I also had a hilarious game where I had stuck an Annoy-o-Module on a Mechano-Egg. My opponent played Zephrys at 8 mana, got Cabal Shadow Priest and stole the egg. I played Zephrys in response, and you guessed it ... Cabal Shadow Priest.
I think a good way to interpret "Wish for the perfect card" is "Set up the board if possible so the card you want has maximum value." If a Fireball or a Bloodlust will give lethal and you have the mana, he WILL offer it.
Zephrys: the great fails
Zephrys is definitely bad against secrets when you have lethal already, so play him earlier. I had lethal on board against an Exodia Mage and he offered me Pyroblast (I could cast it due to an unanswered Emperor), Gorehowl and Soul of the Forest.
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
Except... you get 388 points for 1st place, one packs costs 420 points
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
Well, we finally got tournament mode... except that it's only for players in China.
What I don't get is that if they already have the interface and game formatting set up and they're using it in China, why can't they use it everywhere else too?
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
Yeah, I would not expect anything from a separate client over here. It would have to be baked into the game, available on all platforms, and require resources to actually implement it. RIP
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
would be awesome something like this. playing "competive" and gain some packs.. seems to be a lot fun
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
That's amazing but I'm afraid we won't be getting this feature soon on EU or NA although literally everyone has been asking for tournament mode and replays for ages! FeelsBadMan (but hopeful nonetheless)
Cart Crash at the Crossroads
Hunter + Shaman combination always feels OP a bit.
The new cards from SoU make for some pretty fun aggressive and midrange builds with the Old Quest
Yeah looking back I can't see how she would fit into the faster deck. Should fit into the midrange deck nicely though since she is a decent body on the board that your opponent has to play around. Plus there are ways to duplicate her or trigger her deathrattle in the deck.
Zephrys: the great fails
This thread is definitely interesting and should help understand the (current) capabilities of Zephrys. I've only used him for very simple board clears or single target removals so far (and he's very good at those) but he's not perfect by any means. BoarControl even started a tweet thread with weird Zephrys results.
Anyway, I'd imagine RavenSun's issue to be the fact that he probably didn't have minions on board or a weapon in hand, so Zephrys didn't think he wanted secret removal but a lethal instead. Although I don't think trying to offer a lethal in that situation is a massive mistake, the fact that he only offers lethals could definitely be improved as you might well be looking for something else. It also seems he offered only spell-lethals, why didn't he suggest charge minions as well?
Zephrys: the great fails
You make a very good point here. Given that he is limited to basic and classic sets and you have to have a singleton deck for him to work I am surprised at the lack of variety in choices in the OP. His code should analyze the situation and give three possible different answers rather than 3 essentially the same options. It is strange that he would only offer three damage cards twice in a row and not anything else. Even if he doesn't know what secrets they have it is simply redundant and unhelpful to offer cards that all do the same thing. It would even be better to offer one damage card, one taunt card, and one tech card in that situation. That would allow the player some choice and the ability to determine what they thought was the optimal play.
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
I'll consider giving BlizzAvision my money again when this makes it to Americas servers.
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
Sorry was the bit about hating gambling sarcastic? Because if not that's a crazy thing to say - Gambling is HUGE in China. I know it's *technically* illegal on the mainland, which is why Macau gets the special admin status. It is the ninth-highest recipient of tourism revenue in the world and its gaming industry is seven times larger than that of Las Vegas (that's according to the CIA anyways - link below). In 2016, Macau's gaming-related taxes on it's nearly 100 billion in revenues account for a huge % of total government tax revenue. In 2015, Macau hosted nearly 31 million visitors, and over 2/3rds came from mainland China.
https://www.cia.gov/library/publications/the-world-factbook/geos/mc.html
GrovesK's Reno Hunter /w N'Zoth (ULDUM)
I tried to somehow put Brann into this deck numerous times but the problem is in tempo loss. Your huge problem is early game, you just can't hold brann in your hand and wait for the best opportunity - Zephrys or new Brann. Meta is just too aggresive to play Reno Hunter like that.
You can still definitely try that, maybe u will be luckier than I am. With this version I'm curently on 62% WR and maybe I will later on try to add him again tho :D
Whitemane in Uldum
Amazing how? I don't think a single competitive deck runs her. Neither now nor pre-SoU.
Zephrys: the great fails
Zephrys the Great is, for all its fanfare, really a situational algorithm; it just takes a look at the scenario and offers what it's programming determines as "perfect". I know that is kind of obvious, but what I'd like to point out is that means it does not consider what cards will be played against you. It will not take the size of the hand for Big Priest into consideration, even though that is public knowledge, as it doesn't know the trend of the meta and the typical strategies. It doesn't see a Pogo-Hopper on the board and determine you need to kill it before it can be copied into a deck, as it doesn't know what the thief probably has in their hand. You would have to take a screenshot of the board, show it to a stranger who knows all the basic and classic cards (but none of the current decks or play-styles), and ask what card do I need to get an equivalent of the algorithm. I think it is an interesting and fun card which can be extremely useful, but it has definite limitations.
That all being said, I agree that the options given should be fairly diverse (although, since Zephyris will not know the popular decks, the diversity offered may seem ridiculous within the current meta) and range across potential play styles. To offer a set of 3 spells that all do direct damage, or 3 taunt minions, or to value Hex over Polymorph is bad coding...
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
that looks pretty neat. I hope it's something they're looking to implement in other regions. China's HS always feels separate from NA/EU/AP though so i'm not too optimistic.
ACHIEVEMENT (need help)
That one is still broken due to one part of the achievement, the trigger for a person having user profile created in a first place :) Once that is fixed, you should get the achievement. You might have to edit your sig or something to re-trigger it tho, possibly. Keep a look out on Site Updates.
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
Another cool feature that has been requested since forever on EU and US, but that will be limited only to China because... Nobody knows.
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
Wonder if this will make it to the rest of the world. I know I am still waiting to get the more complete user data/history. I would really be interested in seeing that information.
And, of course, trying this new way to play.
Hearthstone in China Gets Tournament Mode with Prizes
For how much China hates gambling, that interface looks awfully like a slot machine :D
Zephrys: the great fails
He's limited within Basic and Classic sets. He's already not perfect, in the solutions he has available.
But at least he should be optimal with what he has, given his public perspective: i do not expect he never fails, but he should always offer what i expect to find, in one of the 3 options. AT LEAST in the reactive scenario where he's played for immediate answer.
He can never be unfair, because one has to cripple themselves to Singleton deck before being able to play him. And that's a huge price already that cannot afford whiffs like those we are gathering here.
EGGO-Mancer (Budget Friendly!)
Ah, egg-lock. One of my earliest and most fun decks. It has continued to evolve with new cards being offered. Time to take it for a spin again.
The Explorer's League - Traversing Azeroth
Fun reading. I played all 3 Warcraft games, but never WOW, so I don't know a lot of this stuff.
ACHIEVEMENT (need help)
Anyone else have a fully created profile, yet no profile achievement? Am I missing something?
Zephrys: the great fails
Haven't played Zephrys against secrets yet, but I have found him to be very predictable in some scenarios. I had one game with opponent at 12 health with a large taunt, and I had a 10 attack minion. I played Blessing of Kings first so my minion had lethal damage, then played Zephrys for a Sap. I also had a hilarious game where I had stuck an Annoy-o-Module on a Mechano-Egg. My opponent played Zephrys at 8 mana, got Cabal Shadow Priest and stole the egg. I played Zephrys in response, and you guessed it ... Cabal Shadow Priest.
I think a good way to interpret "Wish for the perfect card" is "Set up the board if possible so the card you want has maximum value." If a Fireball or a Bloodlust will give lethal and you have the mana, he WILL offer it.