I think you hammered that nail nicely on the head.
But then again, I just came back from a game where my opponent (who by my judgement makes too many small mistakes) just beaten me because he managed an rng ride from a solarian prime (into puzzlebox, no less) that completely flip the board in his favor, then proceeded to taunt me with Jaina's trademark 'hello's.
Was it skill that got him that win? Not by my judgement. Could I have possibly played better? I was in the lead all the way up until then, getting him to 5 health, so my answer is no. How many evocations was played that game? Three. How often have this happened? Way too many times over the last 6 months.
You're right in pointing out the flaws in the statement 'you have less control of the outcome, therefore that outcome requires less skill'. Unfortunately, that doesn't detract from the point that that outcome was entirely out of my hands (and my opponent's hands as well), my opponent was not as skilled and yet still won, and no amount of mathematical equations could have saved me from my untimely fate.
Often its not merely rng. Its also the amount, and its impact. And there are quite a few rng card generators in hearthstone that wins games on its own. That I think is the real issue at heart. There's no playing around with cards like puzzlebox. If they play it, then its time to start praying.
Honestly, this interview, at least as far as the new progression system is concerned, is just piecemeal. There's plenty of nice statements, but it kinda feels like they are trying very hard to put a nice little spin before exposing us to reality. If its supposed to be a positive move, why not be more transparent and just let us see the entire 50 levels (I think this is the cap) of progression and its rewards. Of course, I'm not discounting any possibilities that this can actually end up better than we feared.
What really concerns me is the introduction of new 35 cards mid expansion. Kinda feels like trying to shoehorn in mini-expansions to make more money. At very least they're not doing the same shit as with Galakrond's awakening where a mandatory 20 bucks is required to just stay on par with others. There's obviously more than a few implications, like do you buy as many packs as you can at launch, then save up for the mid expansion, thereby jeopardizing your savings for the next expansion? It won't surprise me one bit if there's a convenient bundle sold at 20 bucks just right after the mid-expansion launches; we need only pray that they are packs from the current expansion.
One last thing I got from the interview;
Quote From Liv Breeden
Over the course of an expansion how many "10 golds" do you get? I don't know. But now, you can actually see how may packs, how much gold, et cetera that you end up getting.
I think that's a subtle hint that that 10 gold every 3 wins is kaput in the new system.
But until they release the full progression, or until 12 Nov when we find out for ourselves, I guess we will never know.
Yeah, I saw some guys post on orange's twitter on the stats in the euro side, just to show how skewed europe is. Guess it will be a tall order to ever see hunterace or orange back in gm.
Honestly lol. Even the card art reflects its roots. Amazing that when it was revealed no one in blizz bothered to at least quote a few lines from the show where this came from.
I guess we'll be seeing paladin or priest get holy hand grenades then.
As a card however, its just arena fodder. No one in standard will be playing this unironically. Most 10 drops are expected to do two things if not win you the game; value trade, and go face. This card can do neither, nor can it win you the game too. Any deck that needs a 10 mana removal can and should be expected to do better than kill 3 minions with one card.
Its a card that fits well into decks that play expensive things like warlock, priest, and other midrange decks. And its a really good card to boot, when corrupted. Even uncorrupted its still a 5 mana deal 4, which in a pinch is not really that bad.
Combos really well with yshaarj. And that alone is reason enough to find ways to play this card.
But since its not easy to manipulate, I'll stick with my opinion that most of the time this is played its just to act as single target removal, and nothing else.
Its honestly too expensive. Given how bad shaman have been throughout this year, you'd think this card would be worth 3 mana. Even at 3, its not really broken, since it needs to be corrupted to truly be amazing.
That said, this is not a bad card. Shaman needs some clears, and removal cards are by their nature not really played on curve anyway. Since shaman doesn't generate hundreds of small bs spells like priest and mage, its not hard to imagine it playing a 5 mana card somewhere near turn 5-6 where removals are generally more useful anyway.
Combined with Mo'arg Artificer, it deals an incredible 8 damage to a minion and 4 to others while also keeping the mo'arg alive. That's what I would call value worth exploring.
The problem is not that its weak. You can generally get this to a decent 5/5 taunt no problem, easily 6/6 taunt for 5 which is already above par. The real problem is why would priest ever play something like this? Tempo priest needs early game, and spell priest would prefer to play [Hearthstone Card (cobalt spelkin) Not Found] on 5.
If the idea is that you can easily get it to a 10/10 for 5, its still just a minion that is easily removed by the myriad of removals around from Sap to just being silenced.
Just galakrond fodder, honestly, and its not even a very good one.
Im really dubious whether paladin will ever play this in standard. Air Raid functions 1 turn earlier with 1 less dude, and you can do it again. Plus, this card cant be naturally played on 3 for full value, and the third mana slot is taken by Salhet's Pride and Goody Two-Shields. You would also need to play something more than 3 mana to corrupt it, and with the librams being so handy the only thing that fits is Aldor Truthseeker
My guess is that team5 will introduce other ways to buff dudes, but make it hard to fit into libram paladin. In this case, I still think air raid is better, and I also think that nothing but the most broken synergies will ever dethrone librams from paladin until it all rotates away.
Flexible in use, and when used with stuff like overgrowth, gives a near insurmountable advantage to druid. We're talking best case scenario would be turn 2, 2x lightning bloom + 1 solar eclipse + overgrowth = start turn 3 with 3 out of 7 mana crystals. Then turn 4 guardian animals. Obviously the situation is more highrolling, but these are perfectly what's wrong with druid cards at the moment.
In other areas, this can be turn 6 deal 8 damage to something and 2 to other enemy minions via swipe. Or it can be as easy as 2 mana deal 6 damage with lunar eclipse. Either way, this is just too good not to build around.
Its a card that deals 3 damage for nothing. But wait. It doesn't exactly do that.
For this card to be worth its use (at 0 mana), you need another spell that is 2 mana and above, and also needs to be casted the same turn its played.
So, at its very best, its a deal 3 damage during your Overgrowth and Wild Growth turns. Outside of that, its almost always going to cost at least 1 mana at the end, since druids typically play lots of cheap spells. And when they don't need to, this is completely superseded by Bogbeam.
We'll need to see the rest of druids cards first to determine anything from this card.
Properly considered, this is a bad card. Druid has never been low on card draw and mana, so what does this do exactly?
Its a fair card for druid, and when most druid decks are filled with broken stuff, this just will not make it. Unless of course, there's some card behind the scenes that basically guarantees the 2nd draw.
It gives you both eclipses, but from what we have seen druid capable of doing, I don't really see where this one fits. Still, both eclipses are basically deal 6 damage for 2 mana, so that's decent for druid I guess.
The flexibility of the eclipses will determine whether this is worth the inclusion, basically.
Also, why the hell isn't this card a beast when the minion presented is obviously a moonkin?
Its basically a small nerf to Wandmaker and [Hearthstone Card (cobalt spelkin) Not Found] for dhunters. Its not really that great to be honest, and unless there's some version of control dhunter to be revealed, I can't see anyone put this card unironically in their deck.
On its own, its deal 1 damage to 3, heal for 3, which is fair. It can be improved with spell damage, but dhunters have better cards to control the board like Blade Dance or Eye Beam.
I would rate it 0 stars, but we have yet to see the rest of the cards.
Its basically currently the weakest of the 4 gods, but only because we don't have all the corrupted cards to review this with.
But we do have knowledge of a few, and the corrupted Fleethoof Pearltusk at 0 mana is more than enough to justify playing this card. I expect at the end for Ysharaj to be the 2nd most consistent/best of the 4, but it will all depend on the corrupted cards to be revealed.
If you needed a definition of flexible and broken as hell, this version of n'zoth can and will do it.
Basically you can have your pick. Whether its a Charged Devilsaur, or King Krush, or something defensive like Evasive Drakonid or even Enhanced Dreadlord. The flexibility here is the key, and I wouldn't be surprised if every pro will try to abuse this card with nearly every class.
We haven't even seen all the new cards yet, so there's even more potential for this to be more powerful. 10/10
Okay, since cthun doesnt actually start in the deck, that means you can't cheat him out without something like Emperor Thaurissan or Imprisoned Satyr. And its a deal 30 damage to all enemies at the end, which in most cases will not seal the deal but set yourself for victory.
The pieces are decent, but a bit expensive. Since Cthun is basically a win condition, it will still see play, but will likely only ever be tier 2, unless there's a broken way to cheat out those pieces for cheap.
Edit: Got confirmation that Cthun will form inside your deck once you play all 4 pieces. So that's another layer of rng. Probably because of that it will fit very well into rogue, or any deck that can afford to hold onto pokelt without dying.
For anyone interested in what Yogg Saron can give you, and the percentages. Needless to say, pyro to win is 5% to cast.
Mind control 3 guys, and pyro for the win is definitely broken. Expect druid, priest, rogue and mage to main abusers. Maybe shaman can get in for some value. But bottom line is that this card basically decides games, and will definitely see competitive play.
Adding Robes of Gaudiness was a mistake. It is literally the most broken treasure and confirmed a win almost all the time, even against the most crazy bosses. Now in the hands of players, I shudder to imagine what it feels like to both play and face it.
Lol, I havent tried it myself. But thanks for confirming literally the most broken treasure in hs history is actually up for grabs.
I think you hammered that nail nicely on the head.
But then again, I just came back from a game where my opponent (who by my judgement makes too many small mistakes) just beaten me because he managed an rng ride from a solarian prime (into puzzlebox, no less) that completely flip the board in his favor, then proceeded to taunt me with Jaina's trademark 'hello's.
Was it skill that got him that win? Not by my judgement. Could I have possibly played better? I was in the lead all the way up until then, getting him to 5 health, so my answer is no. How many evocations was played that game? Three. How often have this happened? Way too many times over the last 6 months.
You're right in pointing out the flaws in the statement 'you have less control of the outcome, therefore that outcome requires less skill'. Unfortunately, that doesn't detract from the point that that outcome was entirely out of my hands (and my opponent's hands as well), my opponent was not as skilled and yet still won, and no amount of mathematical equations could have saved me from my untimely fate.
Often its not merely rng. Its also the amount, and its impact. And there are quite a few rng card generators in hearthstone that wins games on its own. That I think is the real issue at heart. There's no playing around with cards like puzzlebox. If they play it, then its time to start praying.
Honestly, this interview, at least as far as the new progression system is concerned, is just piecemeal. There's plenty of nice statements, but it kinda feels like they are trying very hard to put a nice little spin before exposing us to reality. If its supposed to be a positive move, why not be more transparent and just let us see the entire 50 levels (I think this is the cap) of progression and its rewards. Of course, I'm not discounting any possibilities that this can actually end up better than we feared.
What really concerns me is the introduction of new 35 cards mid expansion. Kinda feels like trying to shoehorn in mini-expansions to make more money. At very least they're not doing the same shit as with Galakrond's awakening where a mandatory 20 bucks is required to just stay on par with others. There's obviously more than a few implications, like do you buy as many packs as you can at launch, then save up for the mid expansion, thereby jeopardizing your savings for the next expansion? It won't surprise me one bit if there's a convenient bundle sold at 20 bucks just right after the mid-expansion launches; we need only pray that they are packs from the current expansion.
One last thing I got from the interview;
I think that's a subtle hint that that 10 gold every 3 wins is kaput in the new system.
But until they release the full progression, or until 12 Nov when we find out for ourselves, I guess we will never know.
Yeah, I saw some guys post on orange's twitter on the stats in the euro side, just to show how skewed europe is. Guess it will be a tall order to ever see hunterace or orange back in gm.
Warma and saiyan getting right back is the epitome of how stupid the system is for gm relegation and promotions.
Also, how did european players get so much money compared to the asia and americas?
Honestly lol. Even the card art reflects its roots. Amazing that when it was revealed no one in blizz bothered to at least quote a few lines from the show where this came from.
I guess we'll be seeing paladin or priest get holy hand grenades then.
As a card however, its just arena fodder. No one in standard will be playing this unironically. Most 10 drops are expected to do two things if not win you the game; value trade, and go face. This card can do neither, nor can it win you the game too. Any deck that needs a 10 mana removal can and should be expected to do better than kill 3 minions with one card.
Its a card that fits well into decks that play expensive things like warlock, priest, and other midrange decks. And its a really good card to boot, when corrupted. Even uncorrupted its still a 5 mana deal 4, which in a pinch is not really that bad.
Combos really well with yshaarj. And that alone is reason enough to find ways to play this card.
Already a win condition in control warrior with Soulbound Ashtongue + Shield Slam
But since its not easy to manipulate, I'll stick with my opinion that most of the time this is played its just to act as single target removal, and nothing else.
Its honestly too expensive. Given how bad shaman have been throughout this year, you'd think this card would be worth 3 mana. Even at 3, its not really broken, since it needs to be corrupted to truly be amazing.
That said, this is not a bad card. Shaman needs some clears, and removal cards are by their nature not really played on curve anyway. Since shaman doesn't generate hundreds of small bs spells like priest and mage, its not hard to imagine it playing a 5 mana card somewhere near turn 5-6 where removals are generally more useful anyway.
Combined with Mo'arg Artificer, it deals an incredible 8 damage to a minion and 4 to others while also keeping the mo'arg alive. That's what I would call value worth exploring.
The problem is not that its weak. You can generally get this to a decent 5/5 taunt no problem, easily 6/6 taunt for 5 which is already above par. The real problem is why would priest ever play something like this? Tempo priest needs early game, and spell priest would prefer to play [Hearthstone Card (cobalt spelkin) Not Found] on 5.
If the idea is that you can easily get it to a 10/10 for 5, its still just a minion that is easily removed by the myriad of removals around from Sap to just being silenced.
Just galakrond fodder, honestly, and its not even a very good one.
Im really dubious whether paladin will ever play this in standard. Air Raid functions 1 turn earlier with 1 less dude, and you can do it again. Plus, this card cant be naturally played on 3 for full value, and the third mana slot is taken by Salhet's Pride and Goody Two-Shields. You would also need to play something more than 3 mana to corrupt it, and with the librams being so handy the only thing that fits is Aldor Truthseeker
My guess is that team5 will introduce other ways to buff dudes, but make it hard to fit into libram paladin. In this case, I still think air raid is better, and I also think that nothing but the most broken synergies will ever dethrone librams from paladin until it all rotates away.
Flexible in use, and when used with stuff like overgrowth, gives a near insurmountable advantage to druid. We're talking best case scenario would be turn 2, 2x lightning bloom + 1 solar eclipse + overgrowth = start turn 3 with 3 out of 7 mana crystals. Then turn 4 guardian animals. Obviously the situation is more highrolling, but these are perfectly what's wrong with druid cards at the moment.
In other areas, this can be turn 6 deal 8 damage to something and 2 to other enemy minions via swipe. Or it can be as easy as 2 mana deal 6 damage with lunar eclipse. Either way, this is just too good not to build around.
Its a card that deals 3 damage for nothing. But wait. It doesn't exactly do that.
For this card to be worth its use (at 0 mana), you need another spell that is 2 mana and above, and also needs to be casted the same turn its played.
So, at its very best, its a deal 3 damage during your Overgrowth and Wild Growth turns. Outside of that, its almost always going to cost at least 1 mana at the end, since druids typically play lots of cheap spells. And when they don't need to, this is completely superseded by Bogbeam.
We'll need to see the rest of druids cards first to determine anything from this card.
Properly considered, this is a bad card. Druid has never been low on card draw and mana, so what does this do exactly?
Its a fair card for druid, and when most druid decks are filled with broken stuff, this just will not make it. Unless of course, there's some card behind the scenes that basically guarantees the 2nd draw.
It gives you both eclipses, but from what we have seen druid capable of doing, I don't really see where this one fits. Still, both eclipses are basically deal 6 damage for 2 mana, so that's decent for druid I guess.
The flexibility of the eclipses will determine whether this is worth the inclusion, basically.
Also, why the hell isn't this card a beast when the minion presented is obviously a moonkin?
Its basically a small nerf to Wandmaker and [Hearthstone Card (cobalt spelkin) Not Found] for dhunters. Its not really that great to be honest, and unless there's some version of control dhunter to be revealed, I can't see anyone put this card unironically in their deck.
On its own, its deal 1 damage to 3, heal for 3, which is fair. It can be improved with spell damage, but dhunters have better cards to control the board like Blade Dance or Eye Beam.
I would rate it 0 stars, but we have yet to see the rest of the cards.
Its basically currently the weakest of the 4 gods, but only because we don't have all the corrupted cards to review this with.
But we do have knowledge of a few, and the corrupted Fleethoof Pearltusk at 0 mana is more than enough to justify playing this card. I expect at the end for Ysharaj to be the 2nd most consistent/best of the 4, but it will all depend on the corrupted cards to be revealed.
If you needed a definition of flexible and broken as hell, this version of n'zoth can and will do it.
Basically you can have your pick. Whether its a Charged Devilsaur, or King Krush, or something defensive like Evasive Drakonid or even Enhanced Dreadlord. The flexibility here is the key, and I wouldn't be surprised if every pro will try to abuse this card with nearly every class.
We haven't even seen all the new cards yet, so there's even more potential for this to be more powerful. 10/10
Okay, since cthun doesnt actually start in the deck, that means you can't cheat him out without something like Emperor Thaurissan or Imprisoned Satyr. And its a deal 30 damage to all enemies at the end, which in most cases will not seal the deal but set yourself for victory.
The pieces are decent, but a bit expensive. Since Cthun is basically a win condition, it will still see play, but will likely only ever be tier 2, unless there's a broken way to cheat out those pieces for cheap.
Edit: Got confirmation that Cthun will form inside your deck once you play all 4 pieces. So that's another layer of rng. Probably because of that it will fit very well into rogue, or any deck that can afford to hold onto pokelt without dying.
For anyone interested in what Yogg Saron can give you, and the percentages. Needless to say, pyro to win is 5% to cast.
Mind control 3 guys, and pyro for the win is definitely broken. Expect druid, priest, rogue and mage to main abusers. Maybe shaman can get in for some value. But bottom line is that this card basically decides games, and will definitely see competitive play.
Lol, I havent tried it myself. But thanks for confirming literally the most broken treasure in hs history is actually up for grabs.