Especially in a game that requires resources, bought with gametime or real money.
And the community is not asking for changes afaik, just more frequent content release, which is another story.
The game needs good changes, not just changes.
If one can't answer a t2 extra arms, they should adjust their decks accordingly. The card is strong now, but definitely not as broken as to be unanswerable.
Extra Arms was unplayable at 3, Priest was the worst class in HS for a long time, now it has a tier 3 deck, I really don't understand this nerf, they are trying to cancel the class or what?
Whoa whoa whoa, I completely agree that the Extra Arms nerf should not happen. But combo priest is one of the strongest decks in the game right now, which I don't mind, since the deck has a high skill celing and isn't unbeatable, but calling it tier 3 is just plain wrong.
Geez, the communitiy is asking for more frequent changes and now that we finally got those, you guys start complaining allready?! Changes of any nature are super healthy for the game. Frequent changes keep the meta fresh.
I don‘t see a problem with nerfing previously buffed cards. In contrary, it‘s Team 5 admitting they did a mistake and that’s a very good attitude.
Nerfing extra arms is debatable but not for your reasons. It makes priest playable right now but the card is polarizing af. It simply wins most games when played on turn 2.
PS: they obviously can not predict the meta. Noone can. That‘s why nerfs and buffs happen in the first place.
I'd like to know how long other players stick with a deck before they decide to refine it or just make an entirely new one
Huh? Isn't the point of testing your own decks to refine them? If through experiencing games you find that some cards are underperforming, why wouldn't you change them immediately? Maybe it'll take a few games to be sure something is not working, but once you figure it out, there's no reason not to make changes. You won't know how much better your deck could be if you don't try and if the changes fail, you can always try a new package/card
Don't expect the first thing you come up with to be good or win unless it's some netdecked archetype. If you want to build good decks, you'll need to refine them and refinement requires testing. There's no way to get around it
Losing those early games might be hard, but you should know it's not a reflection of your gameplay or deckbuilding skill; it's a consequence of the refinement process. Someone smart once said success requires many failures... I am too lazy to look it up lol ... but it rings true in deckbuilding
I totally agree about the risk of having no-stop changes going on every now and then, buffing and then nerfing the same cards. It seems like Team5 cannot even understand how their own game works.
Mechwarper x2+Faceless on the Mechwarper+Sn1P-Sn4P on a previously played Galvanizer, which the LK ignores during his Frostmourne phase. That’s how I beat him with the last 2 classes I needed (Warrior and Paladin)
For me, it varies. Some ideas just stick in my brain and I will spend a lot of time trying to make it work. Quest Hunter (The Marsh Queen) was a deck I had a ton of fun working on and playing regularly with Prince Keleseth. It was a pretty weak deck but crazy fun since Prince K didn't have to be high-roll mulligan. Dropping him AFTER you played Queen Carnassa was insane value.
Other deck ideas where I feel like I'm a genius who had an epiphany get trounced and I immediately realize it was a flawed concept so I move on after 4-6 games.
Quest Hunter was definitely a cool deck. Something really fun to do was play Brann, Carnassa, then Keleseth. You end up with 30 1 mana 5/4’s in your deck that all draw a card
Priest deserves to be hit only in the old summon/resurrect cards. Basically Wild. The rest of the class is absolutely fine, and hitting Extra Arms is completely undeserved.
More in general tho, reverting buffs, right or wrong, would be a huge failure. Much worse than simply nerfing cards.
I don't want the game to get in a continuous hysteria of buffs and nerfs on the same cards.
The content is def a lot better than what Hearthpwn is providing right now. This site will continue to grow more and more because of its quality. Great job!
There are so many decks I beat this decks with already. The overall winrate is not even that insane and it is on a steady decline aus you can see on HSreplay
Neither of these changes make sense, Conjurer's Calling at 4 is still strong while Extra Arms doesn't need a nerf. Priest just isn't that strong right now that it needs correcting, except perhaps a slight buff.
Other deck ideas where I feel like I'm a genius who had an epiphany get trounced and I immediately realize it was a flawed concept so I move on after 4-6 games.
The other day I thought I had a great idea with combining Ironhide Direhorn and BEEEES!!!. However, when I actually played the combo, it turned out that the dead bees stay on the board until after all four have attacked, so there is no board space to summon lots of Runts. A 7/3 and two 5/5s is not that great for a 10-mana 2-card combo; I had hoped for a slightly weaker but easier to set up version of Chef Nomi.
One thing to look at is whether the deck defeats itself or the opponent defeats it. If an interaction just doesn't work or is too difficult to set up, there is no shame in abandoning the concept early. I usually create a small text file to record my experience and the deck code, just in case cards from a future expansion make the deck more viable.
If the deck itself works, but is not powerful enough to win games, you can try tuning it. I tend to play at least 5 games if it feels like the concept has some promise. But I know the feeling of rage-deleting decks; it can be frustrating to have your own creation be crushed by a netdeck. It also depends on whether it's a meme deck or a regular ladder deck that I'm trying to make: I don't mind if I have a 20% win rate with a Mogu Cultist deck, as long as I can get the combo off sometimes, but with a generic mid-range deck it feels bad if my win rate stays below 40%.
It might help to log your plays, either manually or with a deck tracker, and then evaluate some properties after a game. Which cards were stuck in your hand for a long time? Did you have too little or too much card draw? Which played cards felt powerful and which felt underwhelming? By analyzing you can get something positive out of the game rather than focusing on the loss.
If you haven't already, watch Firebat's Deck Doctor videos. He typically tries tuning a deck for about an hour before settling on a version or declaring the patient deceased. It doesn't happen often that he gives up on a deck; usually he can make a deck work somewhat decently, although it requires pretty large changes in some cases.
One thing I learned from his videos is not to try and do too many different things in a single deck. Not only does that make it hard to have the right synergies at the right time, it also makes it difficult to tune the deck, since there are few free slots for cards that can get you through the turns when you cannot play your synergies.
Actually, if you play the skelesaurus hex encounter in LoE and conjurers one of the minions it gives you for 0, the resulting minions will also be 0-costs, even if the original minion wasn't. So the "coding" is already there.
If you have Mecha'thun, I was just able to beat the Lich King with Paladin using a Mecha'thun+Skaterbot+Subdue combo (with 2x Galvanizer to discount the mechs). The deck I used had a few wild cards in it, but the ones it had were either card draw or heals to help me stall out the game until I drew out my deck and not actually necessary to pull off the combo itself. There was a Warrior deck I borrowed from the internet that also used Mecha'thun to beat him, but I can't remember right now if it needed any wild cards.
Gurubashi Chicken + Bees TTK
Where do you come up with these ideas?
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
Changes for the sake of changes are bad.
Especially in a game that requires resources, bought with gametime or real money.
And the community is not asking for changes afaik, just more frequent content release, which is another story.
The game needs good changes, not just changes.
If one can't answer a t2 extra arms, they should adjust their decks accordingly. The card is strong now, but definitely not as broken as to be unanswerable.
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
Whoa whoa whoa, I completely agree that the Extra Arms nerf should not happen. But combo priest is one of the strongest decks in the game right now, which I don't mind, since the deck has a high skill celing and isn't unbeatable, but calling it tier 3 is just plain wrong.
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
The slap that rogue got with both prep and raiding party lets me hope that mage will be hit twice aswell.
Allthough the current reno lists with a single giant and conjurers are not even that oppressive anymore. Hunter eats those for breakfast
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
Geez, the communitiy is asking for more frequent changes and now that we finally got those, you guys start complaining allready?! Changes of any nature are super healthy for the game. Frequent changes keep the meta fresh.
I don‘t see a problem with nerfing previously buffed cards. In contrary, it‘s Team 5 admitting they did a mistake and that’s a very good attitude.
Nerfing extra arms is debatable but not for your reasons. It makes priest playable right now but the card is polarizing af. It simply wins most games when played on turn 2.
PS: they obviously can not predict the meta. Noone can. That‘s why nerfs and buffs happen in the first place.
How long do you play your own decks for?
Huh? Isn't the point of testing your own decks to refine them? If through experiencing games you find that some cards are underperforming, why wouldn't you change them immediately? Maybe it'll take a few games to be sure something is not working, but once you figure it out, there's no reason not to make changes. You won't know how much better your deck could be if you don't try and if the changes fail, you can always try a new package/card
Don't expect the first thing you come up with to be good or win unless it's some netdecked archetype. If you want to build good decks, you'll need to refine them and refinement requires testing. There's no way to get around it
Losing those early games might be hard, but you should know it's not a reflection of your gameplay or deckbuilding skill; it's a consequence of the refinement process. Someone smart once said success requires many failures... I am too lazy to look it up lol ... but it rings true in deckbuilding
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
I totally agree about the risk of having no-stop changes going on every now and then, buffing and then nerfing the same cards. It seems like Team5 cannot even understand how their own game works.
It's not good for the game.
Rock, Paper, Scissors - An Arsenal, Wonderful Waters, and Crazy Combos
amazing content, as usual!
Unlock Arthas with Uldum standard decks
Mechwarper x2+Faceless on the Mechwarper+Sn1P-Sn4P on a previously played Galvanizer, which the LK ignores during his Frostmourne phase. That’s how I beat him with the last 2 classes I needed (Warrior and Paladin)
How long do you play your own decks for?
Quest Hunter was definitely a cool deck. Something really fun to do was play Brann, Carnassa, then Keleseth. You end up with 30 1 mana 5/4’s in your deck that all draw a card
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
Priest deserves to be hit only in the old summon/resurrect cards. Basically Wild. The rest of the class is absolutely fine, and hitting Extra Arms is completely undeserved.
More in general tho, reverting buffs, right or wrong, would be a huge failure. Much worse than simply nerfing cards.
I don't want the game to get in a continuous hysteria of buffs and nerfs on the same cards.
Rock, Paper, Scissors - An Arsenal, Wonderful Waters, and Crazy Combos
The content is def a lot better than what Hearthpwn is providing right now. This site will continue to grow more and more because of its quality. Great job!
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
There are so many decks I beat this decks with already. The overall winrate is not even that insane and it is on a steady decline aus you can see on HSreplay
Group Therapy! Need to blow off some steam? Mega salty? Here's the place!
I have downvoted some of it for example.
Btw what is up with Mods just silently deleting 1-2 pages of posts? Not digging that type of stuff.. Freedom of speech anyone?
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
Neither of these changes make sense, Conjurer's Calling at 4 is still strong while Extra Arms doesn't need a nerf. Priest just isn't that strong right now that it needs correcting, except perhaps a slight buff.
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
Not everyone likes playing control warrior.
How long do you play your own decks for?
The other day I thought I had a great idea with combining Ironhide Direhorn and BEEEES!!!. However, when I actually played the combo, it turned out that the dead bees stay on the board until after all four have attacked, so there is no board space to summon lots of Runts. A 7/3 and two 5/5s is not that great for a 10-mana 2-card combo; I had hoped for a slightly weaker but easier to set up version of Chef Nomi.
One thing to look at is whether the deck defeats itself or the opponent defeats it. If an interaction just doesn't work or is too difficult to set up, there is no shame in abandoning the concept early. I usually create a small text file to record my experience and the deck code, just in case cards from a future expansion make the deck more viable.
If the deck itself works, but is not powerful enough to win games, you can try tuning it. I tend to play at least 5 games if it feels like the concept has some promise. But I know the feeling of rage-deleting decks; it can be frustrating to have your own creation be crushed by a netdeck. It also depends on whether it's a meme deck or a regular ladder deck that I'm trying to make: I don't mind if I have a 20% win rate with a Mogu Cultist deck, as long as I can get the combo off sometimes, but with a generic mid-range deck it feels bad if my win rate stays below 40%.
It might help to log your plays, either manually or with a deck tracker, and then evaluate some properties after a game. Which cards were stuck in your hand for a long time? Did you have too little or too much card draw? Which played cards felt powerful and which felt underwhelming? By analyzing you can get something positive out of the game rather than focusing on the loss.
If you haven't already, watch Firebat's Deck Doctor videos. He typically tries tuning a deck for about an hour before settling on a version or declaring the patient deceased. It doesn't happen often that he gives up on a deck; usually he can make a deck work somewhat decently, although it requires pretty large changes in some cases.
One thing I learned from his videos is not to try and do too many different things in a single deck. Not only does that make it hard to have the right synergies at the right time, it also makes it difficult to tune the deck, since there are few free slots for cards that can get you through the turns when you cannot play your synergies.
I'm just missing Catrina. Any advice re crafting vs replacing?? I'm FTP but can afford 2-3 more legendaries
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
What about boar palladin? Otk on turn 4
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
The weirdest thing about this to me is that they are discussing work related stuff in the battle net chat.
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
You can easily beat decks with that though, at least in wild and with control warrior, I have a 87% winrate against that deck
Remove Salt Thread
It's needed.
Conjurer's Calling & Extra Arms Being Nerfed? Mike Donais Chatlogs
Actually, if you play the skelesaurus hex encounter in LoE and conjurers one of the minions it gives you for 0, the resulting minions will also be 0-costs, even if the original minion wasn't. So the "coding" is already there.
Unlock Arthas with Uldum standard decks
If you have Mecha'thun, I was just able to beat the Lich King with Paladin using a Mecha'thun+Skaterbot+Subdue combo (with 2x Galvanizer to discount the mechs). The deck I used had a few wild cards in it, but the ones it had were either card draw or heals to help me stall out the game until I drew out my deck and not actually necessary to pull off the combo itself. There was a Warrior deck I borrowed from the internet that also used Mecha'thun to beat him, but I can't remember right now if it needed any wild cards.
Unlock Arthas with Uldum standard decks
Most classes have a chessy strategy to beat him, giving enough retries to get the perfect hand.