I guess everybody agrees that this expansion's general power level is off the roof, perhaps even more so than KFT two years ago. What worries me in the most is that; in this sea of OP cards, warlock's cards are very weak in comparison. Supreme Archeology is a joke and is even worse than Lakkari Sacrifice. Tekhan is nice but unlike The Caverns Below, it requires to be drawn. Overall, I think Lackey support won't save zoo.
RIP warlock players.
I agree that Warlock didn't get as much as some other classes.
But Warlock's bigger problem this metagame wasn't that it was inherently bad. The meta just wasn't a good fit for it. Rogue, Warrior, and Mage's playing Freeze have been Zoo's nemeses since the beginning of the game, and they happened to be the best classes this time around.
That said, Zoo got some really good shit. Neferset Thrasher and Diseased Vulture are disgusting cards. Riftcleaver is also pretty busted.
There was a post a while ago calling for content contribitors. I have a thought.
For starters, there is not a lot of strategy articles around for hearthstone. To contrast, for Magic the gathering there is a wealth of content with genereal strategy, deck guides and much more. I would be interested in such articles for Hearthstone.
Now, I do not have the time to write a lot of articles myself, and even if I had the time, I would quickly run out of material to write about. What I could do is to write an article every once in a while. Could be with arena strategy, a deck guide to something I've played a lot, deep-diving into a certain matchup...
I'm sure there are many others who could write something interesting about their pet deck or something else, but not too often. Maybe just once. Why not have an open, or semi-open, column where users of the site can contribute with an article? Could be a weekly thing, or more often, or less. Maybe you'd organize it so that you apply for a slot in a schedule and get a deadline a week priot, or just send in articles whenever you have lne and they are put in the waiting line (would like the former better myself). Maybe with some general guidelines like preferred length and roughly what kind of content it should be.
Anyways, just an idea aiming to help the site, get some interesting to read stuff and have some fun as a community. A nice side effect is giving people who never really write articles some motivation for trying their hands at it, a very useful experience!
And you can combine it with cyclone to get fresh minions AND spells :) Say a turn 5 with SA on bord, you play this, all your zero cost one mana spells and cyclone and get a full hand of random aweseomeness.
Sadly it's still running so there's a competition between the 2 sites.. this site is clearly higher quality but the traffic is split between the sites so we get less discussion here.
Okay, so we've identified the problem. How do we fix this?
I see some traction was gained in thy discussion so i will add a little bit more of my thoughts on this new stuff.They are on only based on 4 months of this expansion in standard.
Rogue quest-5 star, it has the power to enable an incredibly fun archetype which was tried and failed for up to 3 years by now.The new 2 mana (clever disguise) makes it easy to enable this on about turn 4-5.It is insane.What i think is also worth overlooking is that it will probably see play in exactly thief rogue, not tempo rogue.Tempo rogue does not need value generation, it needs to go face.And i think it is great that it wont fit into tempo rogue.The reward is 3 mana worth of hero power, this is exactly the long term sustainability that thief rogue thrieved for while trying to set up tess and then shuffle her with tog scheme, most of the time there wont be enough time to do this, but with this reward i think the chances are now pretty high.Great card for the most fun archetype in the game.Too bad it itself is boring.The deck itself will probably end up in tier 2m however quest is still 5 star because it enables the deck to function normally, by providing incredible board control tools.
Shaman quest-4 star, remember jambres mutate shaman in may patch.Incredible deck,much fun.But it was not enough power to win most games, since the only win conditions where a bunch of mutates, storm bringer, shudderwock.This quest fits right into that archetype perefectly and just makes it much more stronger, while removing the need to run some less synergetic cards like the murloc package jambre ran in his deck.The quest would be fast to complete on average(lackeys in early game), it is natural synergy with shamans class identity.I belive this mutate shaman deck will now be good enough to make it into tier 2
Druid-3 star. Another quest which is in itself interesting and can potentially create a new archetype.Vs control this will be very strong, because the quest would probably be completed on about turn 4-5.Aggro however is a diffrent story, it forces druid to spend all of its mana in order to remove strong threats, making the basic gameplan of the deck useless, and just leaving it with a bunch of mediocore choose one cards, this is why i rate it 3 stars.However, i belive this archetype will be viable as a counter to a meta where contorl dominates, or just warrior.
Paladin-1 star.Too much mediocore reborn cards have to be played in order to enable it, while also having enough removal not to lose board control.Even when quest is completed(turn7-8), just summoning copies of mediocore reborn minions will not work.
Warrior-1 star-(sadly)outclassed by DR.boom
Hunter-2 stars. will probably see experimentation for some sort of OTK with thundra rhino, scarlet webweaver.Soon to be realised that it is not worth the struggle.This will be completed on average by turn8-9, the saddest part is you cant play zul jin anymore because you lose this hero power, making the quest worthless.Hunter does not have enough refill and minions to make unremovable boards(unlike druid or mage with giants).I dont think this will be viable.
Warlock 2 stars- very fun deck, but unlike rogue, not enough support for plot twist warlock, it was bad before expansion, zero tools were released to help plot twist warlock except 4 mana remvoal and this quest.in any normal warlock deck, this is completed on average by turn 14(i belive) nobody will wait this long.Plot twist doesnt have enough early game removal to sustain its late game plan.Reward is great, but too late.You also have to play a lot of high value cards or pray for good rng on rafaam(which why it is fun to play).
Mage 2 stars-seems weak, no point to run it in cyclone mage.They got another gameplan to win the game,this would just be unnecesseary.Freeze mage, however might like this card, but where is freeze mage now?Nowhere.Can random spells win the game by themselves?No, also most mage spells are either incredibly cheap and will have zero impact or are just secrets for 3 mana.In aggro to slow(if it will ever exist) and control mage has noways of actually winning consistently(unlike warrior with fatigue and a shit-ton removal).
Priest 4 stars.Strong card, will probably take a while to complete(6-7 turns average) however(overhealing doesnt count).But looking at the colossal amount of support it got(even the legendary is made to help this quest,unlike any other classes).I belive that it will work out, it has removal, it has tons of pressure, it has a way to refill its resources(cleric).It has exta arms which i belive to be a broken card.It can succesfully contest aggro while also completing its quest(unlike druid) and it can constantly make new threats for strong control decks with the help of a hero power wich is worth about 3 mana.I think this will be a good tier 2 deck
Sadly it's still running so there's a competition between the 2 sites.. this site is clearly higher quality but the traffic is split between the sites so we get less discussion here.
Okay, so we've identified the problem. How do we fix this?
Create an environment, where new members would like to come and join and everyone can enjoy it. That is our job too, of course, but every user can help with that :)
While it would have been great to just transfer the entire community, having a competition is always good, so one upholds himself to higher standards and wont get lazy to not fall behind, which is ultimately good for the "customer" :)
Cost is far too steep for a board flood deck. Any other deck would not take advantage of the hero power. Just seems in general, maybe there's something I'm missing. Edit: Swarm of Locusts was the missing piece, now it's looking like a thing.
Sadly it's still running so there's a competition between the 2 sites.. this site is clearly higher quality but the traffic is split between the sites so we get less discussion here.
Okay, so we've identified the problem. How do we fix this?
It's not like any site would give up, flux and co. put a lot of efford into the community and the hpwn team is just starting out and I don't know much about what's going there but I doubt they will just make the community migrate to another site just because the traffic and attenttion got split.
There was already a split in the community of HS between HPWN, reddit and blizzard forums it's always like that since reddit every forum community is generally smaller than them by default.
As a user you could see a plus that both sites will put different kind of content as top decks or news topics the downside is of course the lower traffic in both.I am not sure how would you go about it..
Could we have Even Hunter added to the list please? 😇
Also, you might have tackled the issue already, but we're gonna need a new labelling for old Quest decks and the new ones (unless we conceive the new Quests as optional, non-defining for a deck that refers to another archetype).
Even Hunter added ;-)
About the other thing, personally, i think ppl will just have to get used to that "Quest X" can mean two different things now and deck name might have to tell the specifics. We will discuss this internally and maybe we will come to a different solution in the end. But the new quests show, that something like this can very well comeback in the future again, be it a singleton as they did with Hero Cards, or again as a theme for all classes and then what.
I understand that Quests were an archetype on their own cause you had to build your whole deck and win condition around them, this is not true with the new ones and might not be true with ones that can come in future. So yeah, i think that many decks that will involve the new quests will actually not be defined by those quests, but the quests will rather supplement the archetypes those decks are build for.
For example. something like the new Priest Quest, i would see it being used in a (midrange/tempo) Reborn deck which is the main archetype and the quest just gives it more punch and supplements it.
Or Shaman Quest, the main focus of a deck using this quest might still be Shudderwock, or Murlocs or Jades and the quest just supplements the play style, but is not the archetype by itself per-se.
Not dealing 1 damage to your minions can be seen as a downside in priest, and restoring 1 health is almost insignificant. It works kind of awkwardly with Wild Pyromancer too.
Sadly it's still running so there's a competition between the 2 sites.. this site is clearly higher quality but the traffic is split between the sites so we get less discussion here.
Okay, so we've identified the problem. How do we fix this?
The old site was bought from Curse and necroed by a new group of admins, while the old group led by Flux is now dedicated to this OOC site.
OOC is meant to be a brand new and better version of what was HearthPwn before.
And imo it is indeed already, if anything because this site is muuuch faster. And being fully owned by Flux, they can keep improving and adding stuff as they like.
Was about to open a thread just for Making Mummies but I will post it here, in short I think the quest is the worst designed theme since freeze shaman, it's plain awful, has little flavor within the paladin class and makes no sense.
It's the only quest that requires you to use a set specific keyword so this quest compared to others won't get natural support from other sets and is parasitic and forced upon paladin and any card printed with reborn if any is directly linked to this quest mostly..
Looking at the reborn cards paladin got access to which is just 11 cards and one of those is a legendary so a maximum of 21 card slots to use for the quest maximum (by that I mean to complete the quest).
most of them are neutrals which are not very impressive I think you need around 10~ 12 card slots dedicated to reborn in your deck to complete the quest.
I'm really worried about SoU warlock
I agree that Warlock didn't get as much as some other classes.
But Warlock's bigger problem this metagame wasn't that it was inherently bad. The meta just wasn't a good fit for it. Rogue, Warrior, and Mage's playing Freeze have been Zoo's nemeses since the beginning of the game, and they happened to be the best classes this time around.
That said, Zoo got some really good shit. Neferset Thrasher and Diseased Vulture are disgusting cards. Riftcleaver is also pretty busted.
Regarding content creation
Hi,
There was a post a while ago calling for content contribitors. I have a thought.
For starters, there is not a lot of strategy articles around for hearthstone. To contrast, for Magic the gathering there is a wealth of content with genereal strategy, deck guides and much more. I would be interested in such articles for Hearthstone.
Now, I do not have the time to write a lot of articles myself, and even if I had the time, I would quickly run out of material to write about. What I could do is to write an article every once in a while. Could be with arena strategy, a deck guide to something I've played a lot, deep-diving into a certain matchup...
I'm sure there are many others who could write something interesting about their pet deck or something else, but not too often. Maybe just once. Why not have an open, or semi-open, column where users of the site can contribute with an article? Could be a weekly thing, or more often, or less. Maybe you'd organize it so that you apply for a slot in a schedule and get a deadline a week priot, or just send in articles whenever you have lne and they are put in the waiting line (would like the former better myself). Maybe with some general guidelines like preferred length and roughly what kind of content it should be.
Anyways, just an idea aiming to help the site, get some interesting to read stuff and have some fun as a community. A nice side effect is giving people who never really write articles some motivation for trying their hands at it, a very useful experience!
Quest Trading - Play A Friend!
Battletag: Chriscurry#2883
Region: EU
Trade Only?: Yes. You go first
New Mage Minion - Dune Sculptor
yeah, well......um...........NO YOU.
(oops, I misread a card for literally the first and last time ever.................)
Saviors of Uldum - 5 Pack Bundles Giveaway
My favorite card is Zephrys the Great. I wish I open him in packs. He is my favorite cause he is the coolest card ever and he can save me in a pinch.
New Mage Minion - Dune Sculptor
And you can combine it with cyclone to get fresh minions AND spells :) Say a turn 5 with SA on bord, you play this, all your zero cost one mana spells and cyclone and get a full hand of random aweseomeness.
Can someone give me a run-down on the HearthPwn situation?
XD
Subdue
There were days when Dark Conviction was a card...
Quests and their power level
I see some traction was gained in thy discussion so i will add a little bit more of my thoughts on this new stuff.They are on only based on 4 months of this expansion in standard.
Rogue quest-5 star, it has the power to enable an incredibly fun archetype which was tried and failed for up to 3 years by now.The new 2 mana (clever disguise) makes it easy to enable this on about turn 4-5.It is insane.What i think is also worth overlooking is that it will probably see play in exactly thief rogue, not tempo rogue.Tempo rogue does not need value generation, it needs to go face.And i think it is great that it wont fit into tempo rogue.The reward is 3 mana worth of hero power, this is exactly the long term sustainability that thief rogue thrieved for while trying to set up tess and then shuffle her with tog scheme, most of the time there wont be enough time to do this, but with this reward i think the chances are now pretty high.Great card for the most fun archetype in the game.Too bad it itself is boring.The deck itself will probably end up in tier 2m however quest is still 5 star because it enables the deck to function normally, by providing incredible board control tools.
Shaman quest-4 star, remember jambres mutate shaman in may patch.Incredible deck,much fun.But it was not enough power to win most games, since the only win conditions where a bunch of mutates, storm bringer, shudderwock.This quest fits right into that archetype perefectly and just makes it much more stronger, while removing the need to run some less synergetic cards like the murloc package jambre ran in his deck.The quest would be fast to complete on average(lackeys in early game), it is natural synergy with shamans class identity.I belive this mutate shaman deck will now be good enough to make it into tier 2
Druid-3 star. Another quest which is in itself interesting and can potentially create a new archetype.Vs control this will be very strong, because the quest would probably be completed on about turn 4-5.Aggro however is a diffrent story, it forces druid to spend all of its mana in order to remove strong threats, making the basic gameplan of the deck useless, and just leaving it with a bunch of mediocore choose one cards, this is why i rate it 3 stars.However, i belive this archetype will be viable as a counter to a meta where contorl dominates, or just warrior.
Paladin-1 star.Too much mediocore reborn cards have to be played in order to enable it, while also having enough removal not to lose board control.Even when quest is completed(turn7-8), just summoning copies of mediocore reborn minions will not work.
Warrior-1 star-(sadly)outclassed by DR.boom
Hunter-2 stars. will probably see experimentation for some sort of OTK with thundra rhino, scarlet webweaver.Soon to be realised that it is not worth the struggle.This will be completed on average by turn8-9, the saddest part is you cant play zul jin anymore because you lose this hero power, making the quest worthless.Hunter does not have enough refill and minions to make unremovable boards(unlike druid or mage with giants).I dont think this will be viable.
Warlock 2 stars- very fun deck, but unlike rogue, not enough support for plot twist warlock, it was bad before expansion, zero tools were released to help plot twist warlock except 4 mana remvoal and this quest.in any normal warlock deck, this is completed on average by turn 14(i belive) nobody will wait this long.Plot twist doesnt have enough early game removal to sustain its late game plan.Reward is great, but too late.You also have to play a lot of high value cards or pray for good rng on rafaam(which why it is fun to play).
Mage 2 stars-seems weak, no point to run it in cyclone mage.They got another gameplan to win the game,this would just be unnecesseary.Freeze mage, however might like this card, but where is freeze mage now?Nowhere.Can random spells win the game by themselves?No, also most mage spells are either incredibly cheap and will have zero impact or are just secrets for 3 mana.In aggro to slow(if it will ever exist) and control mage has noways of actually winning consistently(unlike warrior with fatigue and a shit-ton removal).
Priest 4 stars.Strong card, will probably take a while to complete(6-7 turns average) however(overhealing doesnt count).But looking at the colossal amount of support it got(even the legendary is made to help this quest,unlike any other classes).I belive that it will work out, it has removal, it has tons of pressure, it has a way to refill its resources(cleric).It has exta arms which i belive to be a broken card.It can succesfully contest aggro while also completing its quest(unlike druid) and it can constantly make new threats for strong control decks with the help of a hero power wich is worth about 3 mana.I think this will be a good tier 2 deck
Can someone give me a run-down on the HearthPwn situation?
Create an environment, where new members would like to come and join and everyone can enjoy it. That is our job too, of course, but every user can help with that :)
While it would have been great to just transfer the entire community, having a competition is always good, so one upholds himself to higher standards and wont get lazy to not fall behind, which is ultimately good for the "customer" :)
Unseal the Vault
Cost is far too steep for a board flood deck. Any other deck would not take advantage of the hero power. Just seems in general, maybe there's something I'm missing.
Edit: Swarm of Locusts was the missing piece, now it's looking like a thing.
Can someone give me a run-down on the HearthPwn situation?
It's not like any site would give up, flux and co. put a lot of efford into the community and the hpwn team is just starting out and I don't know much about what's going there but I doubt they will just make the community migrate to another site just because the traffic and attenttion got split.
There was already a split in the community of HS between HPWN, reddit and blizzard forums it's always like that since reddit every forum community is generally smaller than them by default.
As a user you could see a plus that both sites will put different kind of content as top decks or news topics the downside is of course the lower traffic in both.I am not sure how would you go about it..
Grimm Face Hunter
Well, you can try and replace Shaw and DK. Maybe with Savannah Highmane and/or Unleash the Beast.
As long as you have Genn ofc.
Candletaker
What's with the legendary sounding name?
Saviors of Uldum - 5 Pack Bundles Giveaway
Making Mummies! I miss Deathrattle Paladin and it seems to be a great way to upstart the archetype again (Deathrattle / Reborn Paladin)!
Saviors of Uldum - 5 Pack Bundles Giveaway
Zephrys. Better than Reno and Kazakus. Excited :)
Saviors of Uldum - 5 Pack Bundles Giveaway
Zephyrus
Saviors of Uldum - 5 Pack Bundles Giveaway
Zephrys. Better than Reno and Kazakus IMO. Super excited for it.
Saviors of Uldum - 5 Pack Bundles Giveaway
Zephrys the Great ist just awesome !
Deckbuilder - Archetype Request Thread
Even Hunter added ;-)
About the other thing, personally, i think ppl will just have to get used to that "Quest X" can mean two different things now and deck name might have to tell the specifics. We will discuss this internally and maybe we will come to a different solution in the end. But the new quests show, that something like this can very well comeback in the future again, be it a singleton as they did with Hero Cards, or again as a theme for all classes and then what.
I understand that Quests were an archetype on their own cause you had to build your whole deck and win condition around them, this is not true with the new ones and might not be true with ones that can come in future. So yeah, i think that many decks that will involve the new quests will actually not be defined by those quests, but the quests will rather supplement the archetypes those decks are build for.
For example. something like the new Priest Quest, i would see it being used in a (midrange/tempo) Reborn deck which is the main archetype and the quest just gives it more punch and supplements it.
Or Shaman Quest, the main focus of a deck using this quest might still be Shudderwock, or Murlocs or Jades and the quest just supplements the play style, but is not the archetype by itself per-se.
Holy Ripple
Not dealing 1 damage to your minions can be seen as a downside in priest, and restoring 1 health is almost insignificant. It works kind of awkwardly with Wild Pyromancer too.
Can someone give me a run-down on the HearthPwn situation?
Okay, so we've identified the problem. How do we fix this?
Can someone give me a run-down on the HearthPwn situation?
Agreed - the speed is so nice.
A Less Friendly Game of Chess
Good card choices. Once you get poison minions in the center line, you pretty much control the board.
Quests and their power level
Was about to open a thread just for Making Mummies but I will post it here, in short I think the quest is the worst designed theme since freeze shaman, it's plain awful, has little flavor within the paladin class and makes no sense.
It's the only quest that requires you to use a set specific keyword so this quest compared to others won't get natural support from other sets and is parasitic and forced upon paladin and any card printed with reborn if any is directly linked to this quest mostly..
Looking at the reborn cards paladin got access to which is just 11 cards and one of those is a legendary so a maximum of 21 card slots to use for the quest maximum (by that I mean to complete the quest).
most of them are neutrals which are not very impressive I think you need around 10~ 12 card slots dedicated to reborn in your deck to complete the quest.
In paladin I evaluate them as such:
5 stars: Murmy,Bone Wraith
4 stars: Micro Mummy, Temple Berserker
3 stars: Khartut Defender,Candletaker,Wrapped Golem
2 stars:Ancestral Guardian, Wasteland Assassin
1 star: Generous Mummy, Colossus of the Moon(potentially good in big shaman though),
I can just not see the deck coming together much it just doesn't feel very strong and the reborn class cards in paladin are not impressive really.
And I didn't even talk about the reward it just won't win the game very much the micro bot makes kangor's army worse