Among all the other novelties coming to the game, Hearthstone is also getting a round of balance changes with Patch 25.0. This isn't really a big piece of news, as both of these changes were leaked almost a month ago due to an unfortunate gallery update on Hearthstone's official site.
In particular, this balance patch is going to prepare the ground for Death Knight's introduction, therefore addressing existing cards that would've been problematic with the new ones or that were already causing trouble and therefore got adjusted. Here are all the nerfs, which go live on Tuesday, November 29th:
- Theotar, the Mad Duke - Reworked into a 6/mana 4/4 (up from 5 mana 3/3). This is the second nerf to the card.
- Ice Revenant - Now gains +1/+1 whenever you cast a Frost spell (down from +2/+2).
If we have to be honest, we think that Sire Denathrius is missing on the list: this card is too generally good of a finisher and too easy to Infuse. While it gives many decks a win condition they wouldn't normally have access to, there are some cases where it's more than oppressive, especially in combination with Brann Bronzebeard. There's an in-game patch planned two weeks into the new meta, so we hope that, if Sire Denathrius will be too prevalent even with the new cards available, Team 5 will decide to step in and operate a (deserved at this point) change. Our suggestion? Same effect, but Denathrius should endlessly Infuse by 2 instead of 1.
Quote From Blizzard Card Updates
Show SpoilerTheotar, the Mad Duke
- Old: [5 Mana] 3 Attack, 3 Health
- New: [6 Mana] 4 Attack, 4 Health
Dev Comment: The release of a new class is an incredibly exciting moment for Hearthstone players everywhere, and a moment that we want to be as enjoyable and accessible as possible. Knowing the importance of this new class release, our plan with Theotar was to test out a smaller change to the card (from 4 to 5 mana in Patch 24.4.3) before potentially moving for a larger change if necessary. Theotar’s play rate did not drop as far as we would have liked it to with the smaller change, and is still higher than we would like it to be leading into March of the Lich King. Our aim with this second change is to lower the card’s play rate to ensure that the release of Death Knight is as fun as possible for players with a wide variety of interests and experience levels.
Ice Revenant
- Old: Whenever you cast a Frost spell, gain +2/+2.
- New: Whenever you cast a Frost spell, gain +1/+1.
Dev Comment: The nerf to Ice Revenant might appear out of place, but it feels like a necessary one in a world where Death Knight has access to multiple cheap Frost spells (like Horn of Winter). In testing, we were frequently seeing Ice Revenants at game-ending sizes as early as turn 4, and the card was simply overshadowing many of the new and exciting things in the set.
As usual, all the aforementioned cards will be eligible for a dust refund, which will not start before the patch goes live: do not disenchant those cards yet!
In the following article, we're going to discuss the implications of these changes and what they could mean for Constructed.
Theotar, the Mad Duke
Reworked into a 6/mana 4/4 (up from 5 mana 3/3). This is the second nerf to the card.
Imagine releasing a new class, with neat Legendaries and powerful effects, only for them to be stolen by Theotar, the Mad Duke. Not that cool of an experience, right?
Nerfing Theotar because of Death Knight makes sense especially if you think about the Rune system. Let's make an example: You're playing triple Blood Death Knight because you want to have some Alexandros Mograine shenanigans. In order to get there, you're forced to give up on many powerful Frost and Unholy cards (Defrost, Plagued Grain, Blightfang, Remorseless Winter: the list could go on, but you get the point); you queue a game and you're matched against your average greedy opponent, playing Theotar and stealing the Alexandros. Definitely not cool.
Theotar, the Mad Duke already saw a drop in both playrate and played winrate after its first nerf, but increasing its cost once again seems like a reasonable call by Team 5: in the end, we are sure that the devs regretted introducing this much disruption into the game.
Ice Revenant
Now gains +1/+1 whenever you cast a Frost spell (down from +2/+2).
Clear example of a preemptive nerf. If you think about it, Ice Revenant saw very little play in Elemental Frost Shaman right after Fractured in Alterac Valley was released (trying to capitalize on the Windchill package), but fizzling away during the following weeks.
Why was Ice Revenant deemed dangerous to the game with the introduction of Death Knight? We'll give you a single card: Horn of Winter. We are sure that, during development, Team 5 recorded games where Frost Death Knights would play Ice Revenant on 4 or coin it out on 3, play Horn of Winter and possibly other Frost spells like Icy Touch or Frost Strike, generating an enormous wall of stats which would've ended matches by itself, with very little counterplay.
There's the chance that Ice Revenant might still be relevant after December 6th, although halving its effect doesn't make us particularly confident. Let's put it this way: an almost unplayable minion took the bullet for us to get a new Hearthstone class - we think it's a winning deal.
What do you think about these nerfs? Are there any other cards you would've liked to see hit?
Comments
Thank Yogg. It was absurd being able to snipe important cards and losing on a dice roll at no cost to your opponent. I hate disruption cards where the only counter play is to keep your hand big. At least with Mutanus it cost a lot of mana and you need to build your deck in a specific way to get the most out of it.
@Avalon: Not sure if this is the correct place to make my next remark, but I think it is as good as any.
It has become clear that with every patch, specific articles are written for each related game mode which is quite nice and very logical. However, this time around (with the 25.0 patch) I noticed that by taking such an approach sometimes not all bug fixes and game improvements get listed on OoC, especially the general ones like these:
Of course, not all patch notes are as equally relevant to all of us, but I personally think it would be a nice rule to at least list them all on this wonderful site. Perhaps I am too early and these will still get listed in a yet to be released article. That is why I waited to post this remark. By the way, my intention was not to impose nor criticize, but purely meant as a constructive observation.
To follow up on Avalon's reply, we do keep a db for Patches themselves, so you can always check full Patch Notes there too.
Hey there, thanks for reaching out to me for some explanations. I am going to answer to both yours and Mountaineer's comments in a single go - buckle up!
See, this patch played out a little differently than usual: in fact, we knew a lot of content was coming, so we all prepared to take one or two pieces to make the content flow steadily. However, later in the day night we realized that nobody took care of the actual patch notes article! By the time we realized it, we thought it was too late because we already posted 4 articles, so we just let it slide.
This should not come out as an excuse, but rather as an explanation of why things played out this way with patch 25.0. We discussed the matter internally and we concluded that, in the future, we'll try our best to open with a full notes article like we did in previous iterations - sorry about the disservice!
As for bugs/game improvements, a dedicated article is on the way: however, we deemed this content to not be as pressing as other updates, so we opted for letting it simmer for a bit more time. Therefore, bugs/game improvements going live is a matter of "when" rather than "if". We also took some time to verify that some of the bugs were really solved.
Finally, I want to address the communication side of the two comments: this is actually something I deeply care about, so I don't want to miss the occasion to point out my thoughts.
Nebuchadnezzar, your post was not perceived as an imposition or as a critique to our work: you asked for explanations in a positive and constructive way, pointing out facts while not being a jerk - we do appreciate users like you and we encourage suggestions from our community!
Unlike in the past, none of these posts included the actual complete patch notes. I had to go off site to find those.
Theres too many non-interactible, auto win cards that sit in peoples hands that actually way more frustrating to play against that having your op win condition removed.
However Theotar stealing the card is probably too rough, I would have gone with a neutral version of the rogue one that puts the card back into there deck
So it;'s not gone forever just delayed.
I really like that Theotar, the Mad Duke gets nerfed again, as it's so toxic to play against. But this doesn't solve the problem. Theotar, the Mad Duke sees play mainly because Sire Denathrius is so strong and in almost every deck. (Of course its cheap cost also helps) And it will remain a must-include in a lot of decks even at 6 mana because of Sire Denathrius. I'm baffled that they looked at Renethal for potential nerfs and keep nerfing Theotar, but they never consider Denathrius nerfs for some reason.
The only thing this mana nerf actually fixes is the fact that you can't steal your opponents Theotar, the Mad Duke and play it immediately if your on 10 mana. Which tbh does give you 1 turn to play something important before they steal it from you. (Unless it's Sire Denathrius and your <10 mana)
Have i mentioned Sire Denathrius yet? xD
Edit: Not saying Theotar shouldn't have been nerfed, he definately deserved it. But i'm surprised they didn't nerf Denathrius alongside it.
I generally like Theotar, it is a good idea to have disruption against combos, that being said this card sucks to play against.
Also after nerfing him twice, not sure why they didn't just touch the effect to make it less consistent. If it only offered two choices instead of three I feel it would be a better tap on this card then plus 1 mana. Just feels like choice of 3 in at most a ten card hand is way to reliable.