This is not psychological neither rigging. This is one of the way which the game devs tries to balance the game with matchmaking. There is a simple fact for card games. Decks' visible winrates must be under %60 ( or should be at %50 ). If not, they need to nerf or buff some cards which they don't want to do most of the time because of market stance, balancing issues etc.
It is also seem rigged vice versa. I mean, you can see that sometimes you only face the decks that you can counter but no one whines about that aren't they?
Even MTG devs confirmed that they are using some rigged system for it.
If your winrate with a deck is lower than the crowd, you mostly encounter with the decks you can counter or vice versa.
So, Even Hearthstone devs don't confirm this, A card game must (and should in my opinion) use a system like this and Hearthstone has it too.
Why did you think really they are keeping your game stats ? Especially for this. But this is agreed for other players too, not just for you. So this is not rigged game. It is equal for everyone. It applies you and me and others. All of the players who plays this game.
You guys should accept this as a balance, not for rigged game. This is how you balance things. Matchmaking system is not only about matching same ranks. It also tries to match the decks.
Those screenshots on OP proves that your winrate with that deck is higher than expected in the rank you are in so matchmaking system tries to balance it.
Community should be accept this in my opinion or shouldn't be two-faced about how they win in a row against the decks that they are countering or should whine about those too.
That's why some people suggest that "Always make some changes in netdecks while using them, you'll see that your winrates will be higher if you do this." because those changes are unexpected by this system and This is why some homebrew decks are successful at its first days and their winrates decreasing in time parallel to their popularity. This is why Rogue Decks(Not Rogue class) couldn't exist in this system. Sooner or later it would be discovered and because it is known from system and mirror matches, it is sentenced to lose its winrate.
So, the system wants your winrate around %50 and you are trying to beat it. That's what you are playing. You are not trying to beat people who plays the game, you are trying to beat the system to gain your ranks. Strategy is that how you can beat this. This is not personal. You can use netdecks and beat it with your pilotting skills, you can create a succesful homebrew deck to beat the system or you can tinker netdecks to trick the system, you can stick with one deck for 4 months and beat it with your patience etc. There are so much ways but it is between you and the system. It is not like rigged for you but not rigged for anyone else. It is agreed for everyone and we all are trying to beat it. So everyone is equal. This is rigging at first glance but equality in it makes it "balanced". All players are equal and all are random, you should think.
TL;DR: It is not a rigged game, It is a known balancing feature.
Reminded me of Unidentified Elixir. Seems like a combination of its Elixir of Purity and Elixir of Shadows and according to this resemblance, i can say that the card is perfectly balanced. They just removed +2/+2 buff and mixed their effects. Cool card.
After no duplicate rule for every rarity, i stopped disenchanting nerfed cards because we can't open new copies from packs and my economy style in this game isn't like hoarding all of my gold and only open packs on first month of the expansion. I'm openning packs even in last month of the expansion and sometimes even when it is in wild.
So, people who wants to disenchant them keep that in mind that you can't open new copies from packs until you complete that rarity. Especially for epics and rares. You will get new copies after you complete all of other epics and rares.
Also, in wild, there is always a way to make nerfed cards work and also there is always a posibility to be reverted back when it goes wild. if you are new to game and planning to play wild in future, reconsider your dusting decisions.
I can give my Dr. Boom, Mad Genius example here. Even I enjoy to play with him, I disenchanted him when it got nerfed. I still couldn't get it from packs and I missed to play with it but don't want to spend my dust for it for now and they even reverted its nerf back.
Some of the cards are not just for success, some of them really fun to play. So, think twice while you are disenchanting.
Don't you think that much powercreep for yeti stats is really much ? I mean, ok its battlecry is situational and its a class card (dual class) but taunt and heal for 4 mana and 4/5 stats just a bit overstatting in my opinion and that's really sad that Groundskeeper may not see play if there is no more support for that archetypes for both classes which uncovers the power level of the game.
1 mana 1/4's with no text, vanilla stats with keywords and an upsides, I really am afraid to see that 4 mana 7/7 without any downsides may be normal in future of hearthstone. Which direction is this game really going ?
I'm not worried about a warlock meta. I'm worried about repetative gameplaying experience. That's what I wrote up there, and this warlock card was just an example of that repetetive stuff which the game devs cooked over and over again and served to us over and over again.
We are playing same strategies with fancier cards, they are fancier just because they are new but they are old, not new. That's what I was talking about.
I can't believe how Team 5 finds themes for classes in new expansions. Same shit over and over again. No new mechanic or playstyle, Everytime same playstyles. Cheat big minions, burn, random fiesta, aggro pushovers, armor stacks, resurrecting etc. You may think that i'm shittalking here but I really meant it.
Just look at fan creation forums and look for those brilliant ideas that fans create and how much possible creative and interesting mechanics that can be brought to the game. I really feel sad to see same mechanics pushed in new expansions over and over again.
We already experienced Big Demon recruiting and Mana Cheating well enough in K&C. The only meta was Warlock there and they are pushing it for Warlock again. What's the purpose of this really ? Didn't it become meta before?
Why do you only think for hero powers ? lifesteal and all healing effects on your turn also counts. I don't see any differencies between warlock and priest here honestly.
just drop some lifesteal minions and let them do the job for you.
Also, that's valid for warlock too. So, you might be right about it is easier in warlock.
Damn Healing Rain would decrease its cost to 0 for just 3 mana if it was a Shaman card. :(
People are falling heads over heels for these cards saying they're insanely strong, but I highly doubt it.
Many people have mentioned Fluffy Fight's interaction with Kael'thas Sunstrider, but that requires you to play a lot of small spells to ensure you can get your big spells for free, but that means you're probably not playing any minions. And considering the way effects like this have worked in the past, this doesn't activate on summoned minions, which means you can't get value out of Druid's token spells or Exotic Mountseller, unless you save it until you get your combo off, but even then you're just buffing a board that can get wiped and you've effectively wasted the card, since there are no other minions in your deck to benefit from it.
About the Broom, I don't think it's as bonkers as people say either. The biggest factor of this card is that it's a battlecry that gives minions rush, meaning you have to play this on the same turn as you play other minions, because otherwise you lose the battlecry effect. In a big minion deck, that may mean one minion versus your opponent's giant board. While I do agree that the card is strong and can make some big plays, I doubt it's as amazing as people think it to be. I think this card excels in the midgame with decks that have multiple 3 or 4 drops to play and then give rush to value trade the opponent's board.
You know, Card generation is a thing in HS ? Cobalt Spellkin is even already enough to make it work for Kael'thas Sunstrider. There are even more options in wild like Banana Buffoon. Cheap spell generating with minions is a reality in Hearthstone. Any two cheap spells will do the trick for Kael'thas Sunstrider and Cheap spells in Druid are not useless ones generally so randomness wouldn't be an issue for it, i guess.
The thing is, You might be right about card's power tho but with wrong statements. The true statement might be "in How many games you can find Kael'thas Sunstrider and Fluffy Fight + 2 cheap spells in hand at turn 7 to turn 10 ? ". So, it doesn't change the truth that this might be an inconsistent game plan.
I think he meant he hopes it works on tokens from spells after you cast Fluffy Fight. Considering the way these effects have worked before, if you cast Fluffy Fight then something like Dreamway Guardians, the tokens will not get the +4/+4 buff.
Yeah i meant it and i know it won't work like that unfortunately because of its wording. I wish its wording would be like "All friendly minions have +4/+4 for the rest of the game." since it makes more sense for a better card but well, if you are pushing hand/deck buff archetype, it is normal to make the card like how it is but this card gives buffs to board too and it doesn't makes sense that it won't give buffs to future tokens. Also this game still doesn't have a real enchantment mechanic after 6 years which is a shame in my honest opinion. There are just some quest cards which works like enchantments (The Caverns Below - Crystal Core)but still there is no real mechanic. I think it was a great opportunity to add this type of cards to the game as 'enchantments' with this Fluffy Fight -whatever the real name is- . It might be also a solution to cheating mechanics such as Kael'thas Sunstrider since it wouldn't be spells anymore so they won't feel they need to nerf those cards for future brokenness but well, devs didn't think like that it seems.
I really don't get it why devs are so ungenerous and scaredy-cats when the topic comes to adding new card types. You don't need to save it always as a weapon for future market stance.
Thanks for this full recap of all revealed cards !
It would be wonderful if you also add which keywords are added to the game, explanations of them and how much total cards we will get etc. as how you do for Hearthstone expansions at the beginning of the page. :)
Empathy is the answer here I guess. Think like you are doing that. Why would you do that?
If you are a long-term player, you probably will find the reasoning by yourself.
1-) Some T1 decks you saw in casual are first time players which are trying the deck before they play it on ladder. 2-) Some of them are people who tries the deck's playstyle if it fits their gameplay style or not and if they enjoy to play with that deck or not. That might take some time to figure it out. 3-) Some of them are people who wants to play better with that deck, so they do just some practices. 4-) Some of them have only those T1 decks in their collection and they want to do some quests without worrying their rank and they don't want to build new decks for just doing quests. So they play casual. Not everyone has longer free times to build decks and play with them at the same time, you know. 5-) Some of them just want to reach daily gold cap faster and they know, in casual mode, they might face meme decks more than ladder, so they are playing casual to milk meme/homebrew decks. 6-) Some of them are "first game of the day", which some players do before going ladder climb. I am doing that in FPS games to adjust my brain, mentality and reflexes for the game for example. 7-) Some of them just don't want to play stressfully and don't want to care misplays for that day. At the end of the day, you can't know how stressful their real life and what they faced. 8-) and more reasoning i can't empathize. I believe and almost certain that I skipped,forget or can't really find some of them.
Casual is casual. In past, I was like you, I was wondering why they were playing netdecks in casual and i thought like there is no meaning to play netdecks in casual but that doesn't sound right nowadays because if i am free to play my meme decks in casual game mode, They are also free to try, play and practice their t1 decks in casual mode.
I don't think the problem is with mods of these pages rather than the community itself. Hearthstone community is good but it's REAALLY OVERPROTECTIVE over hearthstone and I've tried to test that couple of times. People in the community slam you with insane ammount of dislikes if you have any bad comment for the game. It's not good for the health of the community and game. Chill guys, it's just a game. If I feel a card/deck is op and should be fixed, take into consideration that is ONLY an opinion. And to think that it is a pay to win game too, so I kind of have a right to express my anger and discontent when i feel like it because of the money I've paid for the game. Hearthpwn community seems to have a lot more aggressive people than outofcards. I swear, every time i see a "oh you don't like it? then stop playing" comment i will slap that dislike faster than the speed of light.
I can't agree with this because I have some great discussions here while comparing LoR vs HS with calling something bad about HS.
Well, that might be about those topics was on LoR forum and maybe those fanboys might not even open those other game forums, I don't know but from my personal experiences, people here knows the difference between criticism and defamation and how this is really a good thing for the game you criticize (Hearthstone here).
For that "oh you don't like it then stop playing" comment. I don't think it is a fanboy comment to be honest. That might sometimes mean "I am aware of the problem you have mentioned there but that doesn't bother me to play this game and I have no valid argument against it. if it bothers you, stop playing it because there is nothing you can do about it." To be honest, That's mostly what we can do for the products that we use. We are consumers, we can suggest companies some stuff but we are not decision makers for those products. If they don't care those problems and if they are vital points for you to consume, Stop using is the best valid option for you most of times. So I really think that comment is not salty or flame-y or troll everytime.
This is not psychological neither rigging. This is one of the way which the game devs tries to balance the game with matchmaking. There is a simple fact for card games. Decks' visible winrates must be under %60 ( or should be at %50 ). If not, they need to nerf or buff some cards which they don't want to do most of the time because of market stance, balancing issues etc.
It is also seem rigged vice versa. I mean, you can see that sometimes you only face the decks that you can counter but no one whines about that aren't they?
Even MTG devs confirmed that they are using some rigged system for it.
If your winrate with a deck is lower than the crowd, you mostly encounter with the decks you can counter or vice versa.
So, Even Hearthstone devs don't confirm this, A card game must (and should in my opinion) use a system like this and Hearthstone has it too.
Why did you think really they are keeping your game stats ? Especially for this. But this is agreed for other players too, not just for you. So this is not rigged game. It is equal for everyone. It applies you and me and others. All of the players who plays this game.
You guys should accept this as a balance, not for rigged game. This is how you balance things. Matchmaking system is not only about matching same ranks. It also tries to match the decks.
Those screenshots on OP proves that your winrate with that deck is higher than expected in the rank you are in so matchmaking system tries to balance it.
Community should be accept this in my opinion or shouldn't be two-faced about how they win in a row against the decks that they are countering or should whine about those too.
That's why some people suggest that "Always make some changes in netdecks while using them, you'll see that your winrates will be higher if you do this." because those changes are unexpected by this system and This is why some homebrew decks are successful at its first days and their winrates decreasing in time parallel to their popularity. This is why Rogue Decks(Not Rogue class) couldn't exist in this system. Sooner or later it would be discovered and because it is known from system and mirror matches, it is sentenced to lose its winrate.
So, the system wants your winrate around %50 and you are trying to beat it. That's what you are playing. You are not trying to beat people who plays the game, you are trying to beat the system to gain your ranks. Strategy is that how you can beat this. This is not personal. You can use netdecks and beat it with your pilotting skills, you can create a succesful homebrew deck to beat the system or you can tinker netdecks to trick the system, you can stick with one deck for 4 months and beat it with your patience etc. There are so much ways but it is between you and the system. It is not like rigged for you but not rigged for anyone else. It is agreed for everyone and we all are trying to beat it. So everyone is equal. This is rigging at first glance but equality in it makes it "balanced". All players are equal and all are random, you should think.
TL;DR: It is not a rigged game, It is a known balancing feature.
and we got an encyclopedia on a card which is unreadable.
Reminded me of Unidentified Elixir. Seems like a combination of its Elixir of Purity and Elixir of Shadows and according to this resemblance, i can say that the card is perfectly balanced. They just removed +2/+2 buff and mixed their effects. Cool card.
After no duplicate rule for every rarity, i stopped disenchanting nerfed cards because we can't open new copies from packs and my economy style in this game isn't like hoarding all of my gold and only open packs on first month of the expansion. I'm openning packs even in last month of the expansion and sometimes even when it is in wild.
So, people who wants to disenchant them keep that in mind that you can't open new copies from packs until you complete that rarity. Especially for epics and rares. You will get new copies after you complete all of other epics and rares.
Also, in wild, there is always a way to make nerfed cards work and also there is always a posibility to be reverted back when it goes wild. if you are new to game and planning to play wild in future, reconsider your dusting decisions.
I can give my Dr. Boom, Mad Genius example here. Even I enjoy to play with him, I disenchanted him when it got nerfed. I still couldn't get it from packs and I missed to play with it but don't want to spend my dust for it for now and they even reverted its nerf back.
Some of the cards are not just for success, some of them really fun to play. So, think twice while you are disenchanting.
Don't you think that much powercreep for yeti stats is really much ? I mean, ok its battlecry is situational and its a class card (dual class) but taunt and heal for 4 mana and 4/5 stats just a bit overstatting in my opinion and that's really sad that Groundskeeper may not see play if there is no more support for that archetypes for both classes which uncovers the power level of the game.
1 mana 1/4's with no text, vanilla stats with keywords and an upsides, I really am afraid to see that 4 mana 7/7 without any downsides may be normal in future of hearthstone. Which direction is this game really going ?
I will meme it with Hoard Pillager.
I'm not worried about a warlock meta. I'm worried about repetative gameplaying experience. That's what I wrote up there, and this warlock card was just an example of that repetetive stuff which the game devs cooked over and over again and served to us over and over again.
We are playing same strategies with fancier cards, they are fancier just because they are new but they are old, not new. That's what I was talking about.
Btw, I'm glad there are cards like Glide, Secret Passage, Magehunter, Star Student Stelina, Lorekeeper Polkelt, Sphere of Sapience etc. even if they become useless because they are actually new. At least they are new for Hearthstone.
Boring af !
I can't believe how Team 5 finds themes for classes in new expansions. Same shit over and over again. No new mechanic or playstyle, Everytime same playstyles. Cheat big minions, burn, random fiesta, aggro pushovers, armor stacks, resurrecting etc. You may think that i'm shittalking here but I really meant it.
Just look at fan creation forums and look for those brilliant ideas that fans create and how much possible creative and interesting mechanics that can be brought to the game. I really feel sad to see same mechanics pushed in new expansions over and over again.
We already experienced Big Demon recruiting and Mana Cheating well enough in K&C. The only meta was Warlock there and they are pushing it for Warlock again. What's the purpose of this really ? Didn't it become meta before?
Why do you only think for hero powers ? lifesteal and all healing effects on your turn also counts. I don't see any differencies between warlock and priest here honestly.
just drop some lifesteal minions and let them do the job for you.
Also, that's valid for warlock too. So, you might be right about it is easier in warlock.
Damn Healing Rain would decrease its cost to 0 for just 3 mana if it was a Shaman card. :(
Shiny !
4 for 4/4 is already good stats, + x/x which would be 3 or 4 at best on t4 sounds pretty good to me except Doomsayer shenanigans ofc.
But weapon removal is a thing. So, don't really know, it seems quite good on paper, but practically will lose to Ooze.
You know, Card generation is a thing in HS ? Cobalt Spellkin is even already enough to make it work for Kael'thas Sunstrider. There are even more options in wild like Banana Buffoon. Cheap spell generating with minions is a reality in Hearthstone. Any two cheap spells will do the trick for Kael'thas Sunstrider and Cheap spells in Druid are not useless ones generally so randomness wouldn't be an issue for it, i guess.
The thing is, You might be right about card's power tho but with wrong statements. The true statement might be "in How many games you can find Kael'thas Sunstrider and Fluffy Fight + 2 cheap spells in hand at turn 7 to turn 10 ? ". So, it doesn't change the truth that this might be an inconsistent game plan.
Yeah i meant it and i know it won't work like that unfortunately because of its wording. I wish its wording would be like "All friendly minions have +4/+4 for the rest of the game." since it makes more sense for a better card but well, if you are pushing hand/deck buff archetype, it is normal to make the card like how it is but this card gives buffs to board too and it doesn't makes sense that it won't give buffs to future tokens. Also this game still doesn't have a real enchantment mechanic after 6 years which is a shame in my honest opinion. There are just some quest cards which works like enchantments (The Caverns Below - Crystal Core)but still there is no real mechanic. I think it was a great opportunity to add this type of cards to the game as 'enchantments' with this Fluffy Fight -whatever the real name is- . It might be also a solution to cheating mechanics such as Kael'thas Sunstrider since it wouldn't be spells anymore so they won't feel they need to nerf those cards for future brokenness but well, devs didn't think like that it seems.
I really don't get it why devs are so ungenerous and scaredy-cats when the topic comes to adding new card types. You don't need to save it always as a weapon for future market stance.
That's not possible. AI and vs Player experiences are seperated.
I would like to see Fluffy Fight to give tokens +4/+4 also. Hand Beast Druid archetype will be pushed this time it seems.
So next Ionian Champion; Ahri confirmed ? :)
You can only disappoint people once. Blizzard already lost them. There are no one who would do that whines.
Thanks for this full recap of all revealed cards !
It would be wonderful if you also add which keywords are added to the game, explanations of them and how much total cards we will get etc. as how you do for Hearthstone expansions at the beginning of the page. :)
Ursine Spiritwalker = Udyr
Probably the 2nd champion of Freljord.
Empathy is the answer here I guess. Think like you are doing that. Why would you do that?
If you are a long-term player, you probably will find the reasoning by yourself.
1-) Some T1 decks you saw in casual are first time players which are trying the deck before they play it on ladder.
2-) Some of them are people who tries the deck's playstyle if it fits their gameplay style or not and if they enjoy to play with that deck or not. That might take some time to figure it out.
3-) Some of them are people who wants to play better with that deck, so they do just some practices.
4-) Some of them have only those T1 decks in their collection and they want to do some quests without worrying their rank and they don't want to build new decks for just doing quests. So they play casual. Not everyone has longer free times to build decks and play with them at the same time, you know.
5-) Some of them just want to reach daily gold cap faster and they know, in casual mode, they might face meme decks more than ladder, so they are playing casual to milk meme/homebrew decks.
6-) Some of them are "first game of the day", which some players do before going ladder climb. I am doing that in FPS games to adjust my brain, mentality and reflexes for the game for example.
7-) Some of them just don't want to play stressfully and don't want to care misplays for that day. At the end of the day, you can't know how stressful their real life and what they faced.
8-) and more reasoning i can't empathize. I believe and almost certain that I skipped,forget or can't really find some of them.
Casual is casual. In past, I was like you, I was wondering why they were playing netdecks in casual and i thought like there is no meaning to play netdecks in casual but that doesn't sound right nowadays because if i am free to play my meme decks in casual game mode, They are also free to try, play and practice their t1 decks in casual mode.
I can't agree with this because I have some great discussions here while comparing LoR vs HS with calling something bad about HS.
Well, that might be about those topics was on LoR forum and maybe those fanboys might not even open those other game forums, I don't know but from my personal experiences, people here knows the difference between criticism and defamation and how this is really a good thing for the game you criticize (Hearthstone here).
For that "oh you don't like it then stop playing" comment. I don't think it is a fanboy comment to be honest. That might sometimes mean "I am aware of the problem you have mentioned there but that doesn't bother me to play this game and I have no valid argument against it. if it bothers you, stop playing it because there is nothing you can do about it."
To be honest, That's mostly what we can do for the products that we use. We are consumers, we can suggest companies some stuff but we are not decision makers for those products. If they don't care those problems and if they are vital points for you to consume, Stop using is the best valid option for you most of times. So I really think that comment is not salty or flame-y or troll everytime.