Legends of Runeterra is a unique game in the sense that many champions offer infinite card advantage.
We have champions that generate removal, champions that generate draw, champions who double your spells, champions who generate token, champions who outright win the game.
So if thats the case why do sooo many players sit and do nothing marveling at their 10 card hand as they loose the game.
Its because they haven't realized one simple truth...card advantage is for control decks.
When each piece of removal equals a dead resource on your opponents end card advantage absolutely matters.
But if you're midrange, combo, or aggro it frankly doesn't. You should instead move actively towards your game plan.
If you're thresh Nasus, absolutely kill your own creatures I'd you can't kill your opponents.
If you're Lee Sin, cast spells they don't have to do anything I'd you're 3 cards ahead anyway just cast them.
The sooner you realize that flipping that champ or sequencing the cards correctly is how you win games...the sooner you'll stop card haording.
And the faster you can start winning games, and it won't take you 30 minuites to do it.
I had said previously that rise of the underworld was absolutely a top notch expansion for brewers but I have to say that these card releases during this event might be just as good if not better
----lets run through a few of the standouts---
Champions:
Akshan is a very flexible card, he can be aggressive and combo oriented, he can be a card advantage tool for control decks, and he's just great landmark support.
Shadow dude is a bit meh by comparison, I like the idea of mind control being better implemented into the game (follower stealing) but I don't like that he's also a better Nasus at the same time. (A little too easy mode) but not op because of how slow he is.
---Removal----
We were just talking about how there's no good removal in shadow isles, and we just got two really strong pieces. It turns out spending 4 mana for slow speed champion removal is actually kiiiinda good, it also adds value to all your healing
Similarly 5 mana drain two from two units is kind of a high value static shock I love it.
---followers---
Shurima gets a 5 mana 5/5 finally and getting free treasures is pretty strong if you have the support to keep it alive
6 mana for a better cat submarine in Ionia is beyond strong. Because you can choose slow, fast, or burst you can actually reliably tutor out answers...like I dont know 4 mana champion removal.
I like Ibex a lot for more support pieces poor lulu needs some love.
Getting free attacks in noxious is pretty interesting, having a way to turbo level MF in a pirate aggro shell ads nuanced possibilities to a hunga bunga deck
Ice wolf mother is probably my low key favorite, even without running "a lot" of frostbite I found the wolf cub getting to like a 12/12 in Long games and it offers a finisher for frostbite decks that makes more sense thematically
Fury dude is the last one to mention, it's a little akward because if you get a really big Shivana you need to give her overwhelm to win, so that's absolver or sunlight blade, and I'm not an all in on one card kind of player.
Overall just a really solid event that pairs well with both the new champions/cards we got last go around plus the large number of balance changes.
I'm willing to admit that this outstanding work by Riot and honestly if they want to adopt the it ain't broke dont fix it mentality for the rest of the summer they've earned it honestly.
Depends on your definition, feel the rush pulls out two other cards from your deck and is therefore a 3 card self contained combo. Lor is definately a strange game. Like harrowing is similar, it's one card that pulls out all the other cards you already played and is most definately a combo piece
Feel the rush was exactly the combo card I was thinking of. I've seen it run in all sorts.of lists with all sorts of Champs...want to know why because as a combo card the exact decklist doesn't matter as long as it excels as stalling out the game and giving you that magical top deck.
Combo more so referring to decks that have their entire wincon based around one decisive turn and everything else is just stalling.
Like dragons is midrange because you play Asol but you dont win that turn, usually it might not be till 2 turns after.
Ezreal always has a burst turn, lissandra has an overwhelm swing turn, Lee Sin has his flip turn.
A better example of control is tf swain, or kegs...and again drawing a bit of a blank because as mentioned earlier removal spells arent great in this game so real control decks are rare.
But something close is interaction heavy lists like the j4 one I built, like it or not single combat and it's 3 mana counterparts are the best way to "hard remove" things in this game. Because burst spells are so strong the only way to beat them.is to counter with your own tricks while your removal hangs on the stack.
Those of us who have a background in MTG or even Hearthstone have a pretty good idea of what a control deck is.
Take warrior for an example, he equips a weapon and smacks a dude using life as a resource.
He wins when the opponent runs out of stuff.
In MTG a control player might run planes walkers who have their own health gage to be used as a resource to grind the opponent out.
But in Legends much of what we call "control" is actually combo decks.
Ezreal is a great example he encourages you to remove your opponents followers to level him, he's a control card right? No...because he actually becomes a combo card once leveled bursting the opponent down to 0.
We see something similar with Lee Sin overwhelm, they who endure/nasus and karma is often used as a direct dmg tool as well.
So what is a "control" card in Legends given the unique way this game is designed.
Lux is a pretty obvious choice, she literally just gives you free removal, J4 for sure, Tom ketch, kindred, TF, Aphelios, and thats kind of it right now.
It doesnt help that many of these cards aren't very good, with the exception to the recent buff to j4 he's great.
Personally I think the developers should be less scared to print hard control tools and Champs going forward, because even lisandra is being used as a combo piece right now.
No word of a lie I've been getting my butt handed to me.since rise of the underworld dropped.
The meta was very weird, like all the decks seemed to generate infinite value, had tons of beef on board, and was incredible hard to control out with spells.
Well turns out I was doing it wrong, challengers are like better versions of removal because they present situations where the opponent has to react with a spell to go even with your follower, then you can counter with your own spell.
Factor in 6 card that provide extra attack phases and if your opponents deck is all about playing solitaire (most are right now) you will win guaranteed.
What do I mean by solitaire?
Turbo thralls, I do a bunch of stuff till I have a massive board.
Yetis I do a bunch of stuff till I have a massive board.
Poros I do a bunch of stuff till I have a massive board.
Delivers, sivir, you get the point.
So if every deck relies on building up steam, what if we just prevent that from happening every attack phase.
If it feels like this meta might be a little weird you'd be right.
What we're seeing across the board is that except for the top 3 decks those being pirate aggro, turbo thralls, and sivir
Every deck is roughly equal in terms of winrate at 52% suggesting it doesnt really matter what you play.
Swim got to diamond with Poros and lists it as an A tier deck, is it actually no...but again it doesn't really matter what he chose to play outside of that narrow margin of top decks.
How do I feel about this? The competitive deck brewer in me is frustrated by the fact that the only way to get a leg up is to play lists that essentially don't make sense.
But the casual player in me is happy that you can essentially play whatever the hell you want and have the same chance of winning as long as you aren't rolling S tier deck lists.
Yeah man it's a great time to be brewing I'm playing absolute tosh and I won't be seeing diamond again anytime soon. But I'm actually enjoying the gaming again which is the most important thing to me personally
1. Deep has a 56 percent winrate suggesting in the right hands it will work just as well as turbo thralls, this is great the deck used to be unplayable
2. Discard aggro at a 55 percent winrate suggesting the nerf to rumage didn't really hurt it
3. Shurima overwhelm needs a deck list update, but is still hitting 57 percent
4. Thresh Nasus obviously, only got hit on it's aggro lines of play 55 percent
5. Leblanc Sivir , very scary now thanks to the new treasure seeker 58 percent
Honestly, these winrates would be top tier in any other meta and things are so balanced
Yeah Zoe sorry. Honestly, don't pay attention to the meta reports, like I'm absolutely slapping with kegs. Mogwai was playing yetis. Things are basically balanced right now so kudos to the devs.
The 3 top decks are turbo thralls, LeBlanc sivir, and pirate aggro.
So typically when we see decks with high winrates like these but relatively low play rates.
The meta is very healthy.
While these decks might statistically be doing well right now, people aren't really playing them in any number to be concerned of.
It also means nobody has attempted to counter these decks yet, meaning what we are really seeing is early climbers blitzing ladder before people can adjust
Other good news signs, Azir Irelia is down to a 50/50 winrate which sounds right given its supposed to be a "combo" deck.
Honestly, still feeling very optimistic about things overall.
Legends of Runeterra is a unique game in the sense that many champions offer infinite card advantage.
We have champions that generate removal, champions that generate draw, champions who double your spells, champions who generate token, champions who outright win the game.
So if thats the case why do sooo many players sit and do nothing marveling at their 10 card hand as they loose the game.
Its because they haven't realized one simple truth...card advantage is for control decks.
When each piece of removal equals a dead resource on your opponents end card advantage absolutely matters.
But if you're midrange, combo, or aggro it frankly doesn't. You should instead move actively towards your game plan.
If you're thresh Nasus, absolutely kill your own creatures I'd you can't kill your opponents.
If you're Lee Sin, cast spells they don't have to do anything I'd you're 3 cards ahead anyway just cast them.
The sooner you realize that flipping that champ or sequencing the cards correctly is how you win games...the sooner you'll stop card haording.
And the faster you can start winning games, and it won't take you 30 minuites to do it.
Uhuh then why is it that when I play dragons against every Nasus or Shadow guy deck the opponent just sits there wide eyed as I level Asol?
They are so used to passive play, mindless card advantage, and empty passing that they can't believe other decks actually have active play strategies
That deck just wants blockers and doesn't really care about hard removal
It's just stalling till atrocity
With the exception of black spear most of the cards you listed have been outstripped by burst speed combat tricks.
Like what's better drain 1 for 2 mana, or give somethings, 3/1 for 1 mana?
Now kill a champ for 4 that's pretty okay as these things go, puts in on par with will of Ionia and might be a little better.
I had said previously that rise of the underworld was absolutely a top notch expansion for brewers but I have to say that these card releases during this event might be just as good if not better
----lets run through a few of the standouts---
Champions:
Akshan is a very flexible card, he can be aggressive and combo oriented, he can be a card advantage tool for control decks, and he's just great landmark support.
Shadow dude is a bit meh by comparison, I like the idea of mind control being better implemented into the game (follower stealing) but I don't like that he's also a better Nasus at the same time. (A little too easy mode) but not op because of how slow he is.
---Removal----
We were just talking about how there's no good removal in shadow isles, and we just got two really strong pieces. It turns out spending 4 mana for slow speed champion removal is actually kiiiinda good, it also adds value to all your healing
Similarly 5 mana drain two from two units is kind of a high value static shock I love it.
---followers---
Shurima gets a 5 mana 5/5 finally and getting free treasures is pretty strong if you have the support to keep it alive
6 mana for a better cat submarine in Ionia is beyond strong. Because you can choose slow, fast, or burst you can actually reliably tutor out answers...like I dont know 4 mana champion removal.
I like Ibex a lot for more support pieces poor lulu needs some love.
Getting free attacks in noxious is pretty interesting, having a way to turbo level MF in a pirate aggro shell ads nuanced possibilities to a hunga bunga deck
Ice wolf mother is probably my low key favorite, even without running "a lot" of frostbite I found the wolf cub getting to like a 12/12 in Long games and it offers a finisher for frostbite decks that makes more sense thematically
Fury dude is the last one to mention, it's a little akward because if you get a really big Shivana you need to give her overwhelm to win, so that's absolver or sunlight blade, and I'm not an all in on one card kind of player.
Overall just a really solid event that pairs well with both the new champions/cards we got last go around plus the large number of balance changes.
I'm willing to admit that this outstanding work by Riot and honestly if they want to adopt the it ain't broke dont fix it mentality for the rest of the summer they've earned it honestly.
Depends on your definition, feel the rush pulls out two other cards from your deck and is therefore a 3 card self contained combo. Lor is definately a strange game. Like harrowing is similar, it's one card that pulls out all the other cards you already played and is most definately a combo piece
Feel the rush was exactly the combo card I was thinking of. I've seen it run in all sorts.of lists with all sorts of Champs...want to know why because as a combo card the exact decklist doesn't matter as long as it excels as stalling out the game and giving you that magical top deck.
Combo more so referring to decks that have their entire wincon based around one decisive turn and everything else is just stalling.
Like dragons is midrange because you play Asol but you dont win that turn, usually it might not be till 2 turns after.
Ezreal always has a burst turn, lissandra has an overwhelm swing turn, Lee Sin has his flip turn.
A better example of control is tf swain, or kegs...and again drawing a bit of a blank because as mentioned earlier removal spells arent great in this game so real control decks are rare.
But something close is interaction heavy lists like the j4 one I built, like it or not single combat and it's 3 mana counterparts are the best way to "hard remove" things in this game. Because burst spells are so strong the only way to beat them.is to counter with your own tricks while your removal hangs on the stack.
Those of us who have a background in MTG or even Hearthstone have a pretty good idea of what a control deck is.
Take warrior for an example, he equips a weapon and smacks a dude using life as a resource.
He wins when the opponent runs out of stuff.
In MTG a control player might run planes walkers who have their own health gage to be used as a resource to grind the opponent out.
But in Legends much of what we call "control" is actually combo decks.
Ezreal is a great example he encourages you to remove your opponents followers to level him, he's a control card right? No...because he actually becomes a combo card once leveled bursting the opponent down to 0.
We see something similar with Lee Sin overwhelm, they who endure/nasus and karma is often used as a direct dmg tool as well.
So what is a "control" card in Legends given the unique way this game is designed.
Lux is a pretty obvious choice, she literally just gives you free removal, J4 for sure, Tom ketch, kindred, TF, Aphelios, and thats kind of it right now.
It doesnt help that many of these cards aren't very good, with the exception to the recent buff to j4 he's great.
Personally I think the developers should be less scared to print hard control tools and Champs going forward, because even lisandra is being used as a combo piece right now.
Not sure who downvoted, I have a sense that you guys are just bad at playing off meta lists, or maybe you aren't control players hard to say.
Like if you want meta trash, just go to mobalytics, easy to play, easier to win.
No word of a lie I've been getting my butt handed to me.since rise of the underworld dropped.
The meta was very weird, like all the decks seemed to generate infinite value, had tons of beef on board, and was incredible hard to control out with spells.
Well turns out I was doing it wrong, challengers are like better versions of removal because they present situations where the opponent has to react with a spell to go even with your follower, then you can counter with your own spell.
Factor in 6 card that provide extra attack phases and if your opponents deck is all about playing solitaire (most are right now) you will win guaranteed.
What do I mean by solitaire?
Turbo thralls, I do a bunch of stuff till I have a massive board.
Yetis I do a bunch of stuff till I have a massive board.
Poros I do a bunch of stuff till I have a massive board.
Delivers, sivir, you get the point.
So if every deck relies on building up steam, what if we just prevent that from happening every attack phase.
Chances are we'll win.
https://lor.mobalytics.gg/meta-tier-list
Big changes here:
1. Zed Sivir being listed as S tier with a 53% winrate, more likely finding its longterm home in A tier
2.Turbo thralls is going down to A tier even though it's numbers are largely the same
3. Azir Irelia is listed in S again, but its numbers aren't doing any better so no idea what's up with that
4. Poros dropping a ton of tiers, it was trash and just because swim could literally win with any meme deck he chooses doesnt mean it was good.
Increasingly, I find the tier lists to be governed by the whims of the editors instead of quantitative data.
Last time I mentioned a ton of decks with a 55% winrate that go ignored, like deep, or Swain Tf or J4 barriers.
If you go into card stats you get an even clearer picture of performance.
Want to know what cards have the highest winrate? Literally every single one in pirate aggro.
Now do I think the deck should be tweaked, probably not this meta is still fun and fresh.
And I think this is the best part of the shurima expansion so far.
I would say it is an improvement for sure. It just feels weird hard to put my finger on it.
I gave the poros example on purpose, and we can lump yetis in.
Like how is this as good as a highly synergistic list built around champions.
Probably because high deck building.costs, card sequencing, and predictability is bad right now vs just playing weird beef from hand.
https://lor.mobalytics.gg/stats/regions
If it feels like this meta might be a little weird you'd be right.
What we're seeing across the board is that except for the top 3 decks those being pirate aggro, turbo thralls, and sivir
Every deck is roughly equal in terms of winrate at 52% suggesting it doesnt really matter what you play.
Swim got to diamond with Poros and lists it as an A tier deck, is it actually no...but again it doesn't really matter what he chose to play outside of that narrow margin of top decks.
How do I feel about this? The competitive deck brewer in me is frustrated by the fact that the only way to get a leg up is to play lists that essentially don't make sense.
But the casual player in me is happy that you can essentially play whatever the hell you want and have the same chance of winning as long as you aren't rolling S tier deck lists.
Spooky Eko is pretty fun.
But don't ask me what's competitive this meta.
All I que into is lurk and pirate aggro
Yeah man it's a great time to be brewing I'm playing absolute tosh and I won't be seeing diamond again anytime soon. But I'm actually enjoying the gaming again which is the most important thing to me personally
https://lor.mobalytics.gg/stats/archetypes
1. Deep has a 56 percent winrate suggesting in the right hands it will work just as well as turbo thralls, this is great the deck used to be unplayable
2. Discard aggro at a 55 percent winrate suggesting the nerf to rumage didn't really hurt it
3. Shurima overwhelm needs a deck list update, but is still hitting 57 percent
4. Thresh Nasus obviously, only got hit on it's aggro lines of play 55 percent
5. Leblanc Sivir , very scary now thanks to the new treasure seeker 58 percent
Honestly, these winrates would be top tier in any other meta and things are so balanced
We're just splitting hairs at this point...
Yeah Zoe sorry. Honestly, don't pay attention to the meta reports, like I'm absolutely slapping with kegs. Mogwai was playing yetis. Things are basically balanced right now so kudos to the devs.
Yeah its interesting how dependent most targon players were on snake.
Lulu into snake, the fangs into snake.
So when it got turned into a 1/1 targon players just noped out of the region.
I think thats bit of an over reaction. It was never meant to be a tempo region in the first place.
https://lor.mobalytics.gg/stats/regions
Straight from the region statistics.
The 3 top decks are turbo thralls, LeBlanc sivir, and pirate aggro.
So typically when we see decks with high winrates like these but relatively low play rates.
The meta is very healthy.
While these decks might statistically be doing well right now, people aren't really playing them in any number to be concerned of.
It also means nobody has attempted to counter these decks yet, meaning what we are really seeing is early climbers blitzing ladder before people can adjust
Other good news signs, Azir Irelia is down to a 50/50 winrate which sounds right given its supposed to be a "combo" deck.
Honestly, still feeling very optimistic about things overall.