The current workaround is to run zero golden core cards (but both you and your opponent have to do that, so that only improves your odds of getting a game....if the opponent you queue into has golden core set cards in the deck, you'll still get the error)
It does seem like, with a wealth of information about what decks are seeing play, etc., they should have a better definition than just "the community says it's perfect." But there's something to be said for saying that the meta is only perfect if the fans are happy with it.
@cydonianknight I tend to agree that the health cutoff is too low for A Champion Arises. You could feasibly make a legendary-heavy deck in Wild with lots of cards you're happy to cheat out, but in Standard I think you'd run out of generically good legendaries (i.e. cards for which you don't care about battlecries, rush, etc.). So moving it up to 15 seems safe to me.
Obviously legendary cards have higher power levels than non-legendary cards, but what are people thinking about adding Secrets to non-secret classes? The prompt seems to allow it, but because it would be your only possible secret (i.e not secret at all, leaving you pretty vulnerable to being played around...), the power level would probably have to be even higher than for legendary secrets in a secret class (or the trigger would have to be nearly unavoidable - probably the safer route to go so the card isn't totally game breaking).
I feel like the rules probably don't explicitly state it because it's probably just common sense that you shouldn't submit a Secret for a non-Secret class. You certainly can try if you want to, but I feel like they tend to be looked down on as they don't really make any sense unless you put them in a set with other Secrets for that class. You can't exactly do that here, so you run into the problem of it being the only Secret we know for the class. If one uses a custom watermark for their Secret, then we can be sure that it would hypothetically exist in an environment that would include other Secrets for that class, but we don't know exactly what those Secrets are, which provides an obstacle for the card in the judging process. If I see a Secret for a non-Secret class without context as to what other Secrets exist for that class in the same set, then it's difficult to judge it on its own merit.
Speaking of watermarks, this actually transitions into my next point. All Rogue Secrets that use improper watermarks (years whey they don't exist) I automatically rate 1 star regardless of how well designed the card is otherwise since they would run into the problem of being the only Secret for the class that exists within a certain time frame of Standard, rendering the card non-functional. If I had it my way, those cards would just be outright disqualified because of this, but this would likely result in having to disqualify several cards. Secrets for non-Secret classes also run into this same exact situation.
Basically, I would recommend that you stick to the Secret classes when you make a Secret (for any prompt that is). But if you do for some reason make a Secret for a non-Secret class, be prepared to take some hit in score and use a custom watermark. I know I'm a stickler for this more so than other people, but it's actually pretty important in this instance.
The advice regarding secret classes seems reasonable - it would be hard to decide what to do with non-secret class secrets anyway - but with the invention of the annual "Core Set" it seems like it might be overkill to give 1 star for a watermark. While it's not terribly likely today, it's also not hard to imagine a world in which Blizzard decides that Rogue should get some secrets in the core set for Year of the [Some Creature]
It's true that Year of the Gryphon has its own core set watermark, but it's not like Hearthcards has access to watermarks for any future years - I doubt Blizzard has even made them yet, let alone leaked them. Personally, I'd interpret any Rogue secret with a classic watermark as intended for whatever the current core set is.
One of the things I think Hearthstone was very smart to do was to add new characters to the WoW lore when it helped create interesting legendary figures for the game. Riot being concerned about adding The Void as the 10th region due to a lack of champions suggests they aren't willing to see LoR and LoL diverge in terms of their "main characters."
That seems like a very bad idea long term. The "core fantasy" of any given champion may not be easily realized in CCG format (or vice verse) because of how fundamentally different MOBAs are from CCGs - they could just be setting themselves up for massive, and totally unnecessary design hurdles in the future.
Obviously legendary cards have higher power levels than non-legendary cards, but what are people thinking about adding Secrets to non-secret classes? The prompt seems to allow it, but because it would be your only possible secret (i.e not secret at all, leaving you pretty vulnerable to being played around...), the power level would probably have to be even higher than for legendary secrets in a secret class (or the trigger would have to be nearly unavoidable - probably the safer route to go so the card isn't totally game breaking).
I don't mean to suggest that you'll always have the perfect combo, but rather to point out that Rancor has a lot of synergy with Warrior. If you're just using it as a basic Consecration effect, you're probably using it wrong. It has self-harm synergies, it synergizes with a lot of other AOE type effects that a Frenzy Warrior is likely to play, and it gains you armor (which in turn has other synergies like Shield Slam. You're ignoring all of that.
"You are wrong because 4 mana deal 2 damage to all minions is good because you can pair it with another card to make it work"
Even pointing out that paladin has libram of justice+consecration which most of the time is 1 or zero mana. Imagine if flamestrike made you discard a card to deal 4 damage aoe instead of 2.
I think the right way to say this is more like "Imagine Flamestrike made you discard a card to simply destroy all enemy minions" and frankly, that's a deal I'd absolutely make, particularly if you toss in something like 10 or so armor.
The funniest thing to me about the comparison to Consecration here is the total lack of recognition about how strong Pure Paladin is right now, particularly because they play for the board in the early game and then pair Consecration with Libram of Justice in the mid to late game to wipe out the enemy board and push damage to face.
Warrior has Lord Barov to pair with Rancor to make it a "kill all minions, gain tons of armor," and they also have tons of ways to add on little chunks of damage to power up this AOE (Whirlwind, Bladestorm and Whirling Combatant - maybe even Minefield). These combos aren't as powerful as older Warrior AOE effects like any Armor Gain spell + Reckless Flurry or Whirlwind + Sleep with the Fishes, but that doesn't make them bad.
Reminiscent of Hench-Clan Shadequill, which wasn't really good enough to see much play. This is a little better in terms of pushing damage (since it won't remove its own damage), but it's still probably not good enough.
If you can heal this up for cheat this out without triggering the battlecry, it could be pretty sweet. Maybe not enough support in Standard after rotation, though.
Certainly a worse Grim Patron, but maybe good enough to see play? Particularly since Warrior lost some of their better armor gain cards, having this cascade of frenzy effects could make for a solid way to gain tempo and armor while destroying enemy minions.
This is a very strange value pirate. Maybe it sees play in a metagame where some deck wants to have specific cards in their deck? For example, forcing a Deathrattle Demon Hunter to draw their deathrattles might weaken Death Speaker Blackthorn, or maybe you draw a key beast card to mess with Warsong Wrangler?
Reminiscent of Onyx Magescribe - similar stats, and a powerful one-time effect that you want to trigger before your opponent can toss hard removal at this guy. If you can give this rush and trade with a minion on board, this is a lot of value. Might be really great in Warrior with Overlord Saurfang
Obviously the tempo here is terrible when you play it, but a neutral 5/8 Demon with Taunt is relevant for N'Zoth, God of the Deep decks, so it could see some niche play there.
The current workaround is to run zero golden core cards (but both you and your opponent have to do that, so that only improves your odds of getting a game....if the opponent you queue into has golden core set cards in the deck, you'll still get the error)
It does seem like, with a wealth of information about what decks are seeing play, etc., they should have a better definition than just "the community says it's perfect." But there's something to be said for saying that the meta is only perfect if the fans are happy with it.
@cydonianknight I tend to agree that the health cutoff is too low for A Champion Arises. You could feasibly make a legendary-heavy deck in Wild with lots of cards you're happy to cheat out, but in Standard I think you'd run out of generically good legendaries (i.e. cards for which you don't care about battlecries, rush, etc.). So moving it up to 15 seems safe to me.
The advice regarding secret classes seems reasonable - it would be hard to decide what to do with non-secret class secrets anyway - but with the invention of the annual "Core Set" it seems like it might be overkill to give 1 star for a watermark. While it's not terribly likely today, it's also not hard to imagine a world in which Blizzard decides that Rogue should get some secrets in the core set for Year of the [Some Creature]
It's true that Year of the Gryphon has its own core set watermark, but it's not like Hearthcards has access to watermarks for any future years - I doubt Blizzard has even made them yet, let alone leaked them. Personally, I'd interpret any Rogue secret with a classic watermark as intended for whatever the current core set is.
One of the things I think Hearthstone was very smart to do was to add new characters to the WoW lore when it helped create interesting legendary figures for the game. Riot being concerned about adding The Void as the 10th region due to a lack of champions suggests they aren't willing to see LoR and LoL diverge in terms of their "main characters."
That seems like a very bad idea long term. The "core fantasy" of any given champion may not be easily realized in CCG format (or vice verse) because of how fundamentally different MOBAs are from CCGs - they could just be setting themselves up for massive, and totally unnecessary design hurdles in the future.
Obviously legendary cards have higher power levels than non-legendary cards, but what are people thinking about adding Secrets to non-secret classes? The prompt seems to allow it, but because it would be your only possible secret (i.e not secret at all, leaving you pretty vulnerable to being played around...), the power level would probably have to be even higher than for legendary secrets in a secret class (or the trigger would have to be nearly unavoidable - probably the safer route to go so the card isn't totally game breaking).
I don't mean to suggest that you'll always have the perfect combo, but rather to point out that Rancor has a lot of synergy with Warrior. If you're just using it as a basic Consecration effect, you're probably using it wrong. It has self-harm synergies, it synergizes with a lot of other AOE type effects that a Frenzy Warrior is likely to play, and it gains you armor (which in turn has other synergies like Shield Slam. You're ignoring all of that.
That's interesting. I knew they were doing that, but had thought it was already applied to my totals.
I think the right way to say this is more like "Imagine Flamestrike made you discard a card to simply destroy all enemy minions" and frankly, that's a deal I'd absolutely make, particularly if you toss in something like 10 or so armor.
I just saw the same thing - a sudden boost to my wins. Sure hope it's not a fluke - I'd hate to see them revert these boosts.
The funniest thing to me about the comparison to Consecration here is the total lack of recognition about how strong Pure Paladin is right now, particularly because they play for the board in the early game and then pair Consecration with Libram of Justice in the mid to late game to wipe out the enemy board and push damage to face.
Warrior has Lord Barov to pair with Rancor to make it a "kill all minions, gain tons of armor," and they also have tons of ways to add on little chunks of damage to power up this AOE (Whirlwind, Bladestorm and Whirling Combatant - maybe even Minefield). These combos aren't as powerful as older Warrior AOE effects like any Armor Gain spell + Reckless Flurry or Whirlwind + Sleep with the Fishes, but that doesn't make them bad.
Great target for hand buffs, and a pretty solid ability for any anti-aggro toolkit.
Reminiscent of Hench-Clan Shadequill, which wasn't really good enough to see much play. This is a little better in terms of pushing damage (since it won't remove its own damage), but it's still probably not good enough.
If you can heal this up for cheat this out without triggering the battlecry, it could be pretty sweet. Maybe not enough support in Standard after rotation, though.
Certainly a worse Grim Patron, but maybe good enough to see play? Particularly since Warrior lost some of their better armor gain cards, having this cascade of frenzy effects could make for a solid way to gain tempo and armor while destroying enemy minions.
This is a very strange value pirate. Maybe it sees play in a metagame where some deck wants to have specific cards in their deck? For example, forcing a Deathrattle Demon Hunter to draw their deathrattles might weaken Death Speaker Blackthorn, or maybe you draw a key beast card to mess with Warsong Wrangler?
Reminiscent of Onyx Magescribe - similar stats, and a powerful one-time effect that you want to trigger before your opponent can toss hard removal at this guy. If you can give this rush and trade with a minion on board, this is a lot of value. Might be really great in Warrior with Overlord Saurfang
Obviously the tempo here is terrible when you play it, but a neutral 5/8 Demon with Taunt is relevant for N'Zoth, God of the Deep decks, so it could see some niche play there.
Seems like a better Ornery Tortoise. Could be exactly the synergy that Tempo/Self-Harm Priest was looking for before rotation.
There are enough decent 5-drop deathrattles that this might see some play in niche decks. Probably too weak, though