Drawing into any of these is just awful and if you don't get it on turn 2 it also feels clunky to play later on.
Tempo decks wanna push the advantage not give it up for later. Control decks usually have better options anyways.
Also, yet another nerf to Galakrond, the Wretched. Before we know it, that card might actually become as bad as everyone predicteed during reveal season.
is this supposed to be some artificial way to slow down the game by trying to coax people into sacrificing tempo early for BEEG NUMBA later on? If so I don't believe it's gonna work.
Q: So hoarding packs before major nerfs will be a good dust strat if you have a good collection (Editor notes: This is a comment about the new duplicate rule). A: There's a caveat here: once you receive a card, you'll have it marked for "collected" purposes. So if you disenchant a card you've received, it's still considered "owned." So you can't exploit the refund system that way. There's a great benefit to this though: If you don't like a particular card or class, you can disenchant them and not have to worry about getting them in future packs.
Q: And how long is the card will be marked "collected"? For example, I've opened an epic I don't want so I dust it right away. But if I already collected other epics I would like to have them all again. A: Forever. Once you've collected a card, you've collected it.
good to know.
Although how does this work with Golden cards? Do they count seperately? If I open, say, a golden epic and I DE it, is there just no chance that I would ever open a regular copy? If so that kinda makes disenchanting golden cards entirely pointless since there's no actual way to get them in regular form anymore.
Not really exciting. Subject 9 is rotating so whatever reason we had to play Secret Mage is now gone.
Discovering Spells is good, sure, but Mage has been doing that shit since forever and it's never been worth it to combo two specific cards to get that.
Even with the one spell that draws a secret and makes it 0 (its name eludes me) this is average at best.
For fuck's sake, can Mage for once get a card that doesn't have the word "random" attached to it. Is it too much to ask to actually be able have a gameplan or should I just play wheel of fortune instead?
So obviously this is good, but is it even possible to build around this? We already had both Mage legendaries revealed and neither of them really work with this (Evocation does, but doesn't exactly help that much).
There's also the draw problem. Only Arcane Intellect won't cut it if you can't even play the board.
I'm assuming there will be more cards to support this, but without a big payoff card a la Rhok'delar I don't see this working out
Sadly, it seems to not work. The duplicate protection looks at the cards you have opened from packs and have crafted, not at what you have in your collection. Probably to prevent this exploit. See this tweet from Celestalon: https://twitter.com/Celestalon/status/1240320702151942144
well shit that makes opening old packs to get nerfed cards back much less useful. Oh well
Considering how casual is HS' playerbase I even doubt that many players are aware of such method to farm easy dust, so if the system will not be exploited too much maybe Blizzard would simply allow it to exist. Otherwise the best solution is probably to just gift each player the amount of dust value corresponding to how many copies of the HoF/nerfed cards he has, instead of having the player to disenchant said cards in order to obtain the refound.
I think you really underestimate how fast news like this would spread. There'd be at least 2 reddit threads and the obligatory Regis Killbin video "INSANE EXPLOIT, FREE LEGENDARIES????"
So someone on here (I forgot who) brought up that with the new duplicate protection rule there's now a very easy way to farm Dust whenever cards are being nerfed.
The principle is the following: Assuming you own all Rares and Commons of a set and one of them gets nerfed you can then:
1) disenchant all copies of it for their full dust value
2) buy packs from that expansion
3) open them until you have 2 copies of said card again
4) rinse and repeat
If we assume, for instance that 3 cards got nerfed, being 1 Rare and 2 Commons you can technically convert 100g into 300 Dust and essentially buy yourself great value entirely for gold (it would take 6 packs to craft a legendary for instance).
Now I assume that Blizzard is aware of this exploit and will take measures to prevent it. The question is: How exactly?
The most efficient way would be to cap the amount of refunds you can get on a card to only the playable copies so you can't actually DE them for full value more than twice. However, I don't know if that is actually possible in the current code of Hearthstone.
The other possibility would be to treat nerfs like HoF and grant players an automatic dust refund (without having to DE the cards) for all their playable copies. This seems like the most likely solution to me, as it's a familiar system and while it essentially makes players "lose" some dust compared to the previous system it could at least be justified by the duplicate protection rule making up for it.
In any case, I can't imagine they'll keep the system as is, because if they did they'd have to find other ways to incentivize buying packs and I don't believe we'd like that.
Sap on a stick except your opponent doesn't have to actually replay the thing which may or may not be a benefit (the fabled vanCleef counter, are you happy now?)
Will fit well in decks that don't have access to hard removal and need to stall for answers (mainly Druid, but possibly also Demon Hunter, ironically)
you know, now that the duplicate protection rule is in effect I don't even mind the old packs anymore. Gives you the opportunity to get back some of the nerfed cards you dusted and never recrafted. Also good for some stray epics
and then what exactly? There'S only one spell in Standard that summons minions and there's only 3 spells that deal direct damage. Everything else is freeze or removal so this 4-card combo only makes sense if there'S something to remove on the board...in which case, why don't you just put removal in your deck?
actually the problem with Raid the Sky Temple is the fact that it doesn't really fit into any particular deck and the Quest makes you start with one less card for very little payoff.
It doesn't lead into anything, it's not a buildaround, it's just a one time RNG bomb. We already have ways to get a hand full of random stuff we don't need more.
It's not even permanent so what'S the point? Use it when you need an answer but have none so you just pray to RNG?
Are you supposed to combo this with Kael'thas to hopefully get enough 1-cost spells for a double rotation?
This doesn'T help Cyclone MAge beyond "you didn't draw your combo pieces so here have some random shit to pass the time"
It doesn't have Control Mage either.
Look, I get that it's not a terrible card altogether, but I'm really tired of seeing Casino Mage being pushed every single expansion because they can't be bothered to actually come up with (or support) a new mechanic.
Remember Hero POwer Mage from Rastkhans? That wasn't even terrible but then they rotated Baku and didn't even bother to support the archetype further (until DoD with the laughably late Arcane Amplifier)
Remember Card draw Mage from Witchwood? That didn't get anything beyond the initial set
Remember Spellpower Mage from Boomsday? Same thing.
Is there really nothing else you can do with a spell based class other than attach the word "generate randomly" to every other card?
If you look at the design philosophy for DH, it's very clear that one of their main weakness is dealing with big minions efficiently (and also being vulnerable to taking face damage)
This is basically the main buildaround finisher that allows them to actually beat their opponents and not be immediately cucked by an instant taunt wall that they couldn't possibly get past in any capacity (I honestly don't see how they'd get past something like a buffed up Tomb Warden without losing the game shortly afterwards)
Sure, this might end up pretty op if DH can build an efficient sm0rc deck, but in that case I'M sure we'll see a swift nerfhammer.
This card would be broken for any other class, but with DH I think it's a part of their core identity...and if that ends up being cancer...well if we survived Shaman, we'll get through this.
I'm just not sold on this.
Drawing into any of these is just awful and if you don't get it on turn 2 it also feels clunky to play later on.
Tempo decks wanna push the advantage not give it up for later. Control decks usually have better options anyways.
Also, yet another nerf to Galakrond, the Wretched. Before we know it, that card might actually become as bad as everyone predicteed during reveal season.
is this supposed to be some artificial way to slow down the game by trying to coax people into sacrificing tempo early for BEEG NUMBA later on? If so I don't believe it's gonna work.
good to know.
Although how does this work with Golden cards? Do they count seperately? If I open, say, a golden epic and I DE it, is there just no chance that I would ever open a regular copy? If so that kinda makes disenchanting golden cards entirely pointless since there's no actual way to get them in regular form anymore.
Not really exciting. Subject 9 is rotating so whatever reason we had to play Secret Mage is now gone.
Discovering Spells is good, sure, but Mage has been doing that shit since forever and it's never been worth it to combo two specific cards to get that.
Even with the one spell that draws a secret and makes it 0 (its name eludes me) this is average at best.
For fuck's sake, can Mage for once get a card that doesn't have the word "random" attached to it. Is it too much to ask to actually be able have a gameplan or should I just play wheel of fortune instead?
So obviously this is good, but is it even possible to build around this? We already had both Mage legendaries revealed and neither of them really work with this (Evocation does, but doesn't exactly help that much).
There's also the draw problem. Only Arcane Intellect won't cut it if you can't even play the board.
I'm assuming there will be more cards to support this, but without a big payoff card a la Rhok'delar I don't see this working out
well that's a buildaround
I guess that makes the legendary spell less bad.
It's also been a while sine we had a Mage spell that can actually go face (last one was Cinderstorm I believe?)
well shit that makes opening old packs to get nerfed cards back much less useful. Oh well
I think you really underestimate how fast news like this would spread. There'd be at least 2 reddit threads and the obligatory Regis Killbin video "INSANE EXPLOIT, FREE LEGENDARIES????"
no you shouldn't. 60g are the best average and the chance to get 80 or 100g quests is very slim.
So someone on here (I forgot who) brought up that with the new duplicate protection rule there's now a very easy way to farm Dust whenever cards are being nerfed.
The principle is the following: Assuming you own all Rares and Commons of a set and one of them gets nerfed you can then:
1) disenchant all copies of it for their full dust value
2) buy packs from that expansion
3) open them until you have 2 copies of said card again
4) rinse and repeat
If we assume, for instance that 3 cards got nerfed, being 1 Rare and 2 Commons you can technically convert 100g into 300 Dust and essentially buy yourself great value entirely for gold (it would take 6 packs to craft a legendary for instance).
Now I assume that Blizzard is aware of this exploit and will take measures to prevent it. The question is: How exactly?
The most efficient way would be to cap the amount of refunds you can get on a card to only the playable copies so you can't actually DE them for full value more than twice. However, I don't know if that is actually possible in the current code of Hearthstone.
The other possibility would be to treat nerfs like HoF and grant players an automatic dust refund (without having to DE the cards) for all their playable copies. This seems like the most likely solution to me, as it's a familiar system and while it essentially makes players "lose" some dust compared to the previous system it could at least be justified by the duplicate protection rule making up for it.
In any case, I can't imagine they'll keep the system as is, because if they did they'd have to find other ways to incentivize buying packs and I don't believe we'd like that.
Anyways, your thoughts on this?
Sap on a stick except your opponent doesn't have to actually replay the thing which may or may not be a benefit (the fabled vanCleef counter, are you happy now?)
Will fit well in decks that don't have access to hard removal and need to stall for answers (mainly Druid, but possibly also Demon Hunter, ironically)
Yay neutral Removal for Druid...sort of
when the patch hits, that being the 26th I believe. Obviously don't open your packs now
you know, now that the duplicate protection rule is in effect I don't even mind the old packs anymore. Gives you the opportunity to get back some of the nerfed cards you dusted and never recrafted. Also good for some stray epics
and then what exactly? There'S only one spell in Standard that summons minions and there's only 3 spells that deal direct damage. Everything else is freeze or removal so this 4-card combo only makes sense if there'S something to remove on the board...in which case, why don't you just put removal in your deck?
actually the problem with Raid the Sky Temple is the fact that it doesn't really fit into any particular deck and the Quest makes you start with one less card for very little payoff.
Completing the quest was never the issue.
I really hate this.
It doesn't lead into anything, it's not a buildaround, it's just a one time RNG bomb. We already have ways to get a hand full of random stuff we don't need more.
It's not even permanent so what'S the point? Use it when you need an answer but have none so you just pray to RNG?
Are you supposed to combo this with Kael'thas to hopefully get enough 1-cost spells for a double rotation?
This doesn'T help Cyclone MAge beyond "you didn't draw your combo pieces so here have some random shit to pass the time"
It doesn't have Control Mage either.
Look, I get that it's not a terrible card altogether, but I'm really tired of seeing Casino Mage being pushed every single expansion because they can't be bothered to actually come up with (or support) a new mechanic.
Remember Hero POwer Mage from Rastkhans? That wasn't even terrible but then they rotated Baku and didn't even bother to support the archetype further (until DoD with the laughably late Arcane Amplifier)
Remember Card draw Mage from Witchwood? That didn't get anything beyond the initial set
Remember Spellpower Mage from Boomsday? Same thing.
Is there really nothing else you can do with a spell based class other than attach the word "generate randomly" to every other card?
you know, at some point it's getting a bit annoying that all Mage is apparently allowed to do is just throw random spells around.
It gets even more annoying when they keep using the legendary slot for it
I don't think so, Hunter had similar cards yet they were complete garbage. I'd say this is somewhat worse than Rat Pack or Dispatch Kodo.
I'm honestly not even mad this exists.
If you look at the design philosophy for DH, it's very clear that one of their main weakness is dealing with big minions efficiently (and also being vulnerable to taking face damage)
This is basically the main buildaround finisher that allows them to actually beat their opponents and not be immediately cucked by an instant taunt wall that they couldn't possibly get past in any capacity (I honestly don't see how they'd get past something like a buffed up Tomb Warden without losing the game shortly afterwards)
Sure, this might end up pretty op if DH can build an efficient sm0rc deck, but in that case I'M sure we'll see a swift nerfhammer.
This card would be broken for any other class, but with DH I think it's a part of their core identity...and if that ends up being cancer...well if we survived Shaman, we'll get through this.