Both the reveal season and the first weeks of the Onyxia's Lair Mini-Set have been quite turbulent: while everyone's happy that new cards got added into the game, a remarkable part of the community lamented the fact that most of the 35 new cards (which you can see here in case you missed some) seem to have a rather low power level compared to other mini-sets and, in general, to the meta they were printed in.
In fact, people have been comparing them to today's best decks and pointing out that very few of them are able to stand a chance against, let's say, The Demon Seed Handlock.
At the very end of the Onyxia's Lair reveal season, Hearthstone Game Designer Cora "Songbird" Georgiou, who worked quite a bit on this mini-set, decided to answer the community and share her thoughts on the matter. Here are a few important points:
- Team 5 made a real effort in the last few months to reduce the power level and representation of combo/OTK in the meta.
- With the rotation and the new cards of next year, we'll see an effort to incentivize board-based gameplay.
- A lot of the Onyxia's Lair mini set is designed with the future in mind, and not necessarily just slotting cards into existing decks.
Read on to see everything Cora had to say. It looks like we're in for a fun new year once the rotation hits towards the end of March or early April.
Quote From Songbird I'm seeing some comments about cards in the Onyxia's Lair mini set basically boiling down to "these cards can't compete with OTK decks," and I'd like to share my thoughts.
We've made a real effort in the last few months to reduce the power level and representation of combo/OTK in the meta. Measuring every card reveal based on whether it can compete vs. a Questlock deck is totally reasonable, but the landscape will continue to change.
With the Core set rotation and the release of the first expansion of the new year, I think you'll see an effort to incentivize board based gameplay. It's something that I've personally been keeping in mind when designing cards for this upcoming year.
Basically, we want as much variety as we can have in a standard cycle. This year combo/OTK flourished, and so we will continue to create decks and balance the meta so other strategies have a chance to flourish as well.
A lot of the Onyxia's Lair mini set is designed with the future in mind, and not necessarily just slotting cards into existing decks. Some things certainly would fit the landscape for right now, but we like to think ahead as well.
So yeah. TLDR: I'm excited for what we've cooked up for this year, and I think you will be too. Hope you're enjoying the Onyxia's Lair card reveals. :)
What are your first thoughts on the Onyxia's Lair Mini-Set? Let us know in the comments below!
![All The Great Dark Beyond Card Reveals for October 12 - Day 2 [Finished]](dark-beyond-reveals-day-2-thumb.webp)
Comments
Wild says hello
For me like someone said game is missing neutral tech cards that should always stay in core.
Dirty Rat Unseen Saboteur Loatheb Platebreaker Living Dragonbreath Skulking Geist Wyrmrest Purifier etc. etc.
Right now Kazakusan makes me sad , i can only counter it with Mutanus the Devourer Tickatus and Altar of Fire or do the same but faster.
give me access to Bad Luck Albatross , Weasel Tunneler , a neutral Impbalming in Standard so at least i can block the only dragon interaction.
Loatheb as said by an earlier comment here, really shouldnt be in core, and impbalming a neutral spell isnt a thin
just becouse there are some problems they can do changes to make Loatheb more a tech card instead of aggro/tempo , like remove attack/hp stats so it gives less help to aggro but helps fight an antiburst round like vs Imprisoned Phoenix or Mozaki, Master Duelist , if they dont want to change card too much they can create a new one, they can create some sort of neutral Rebuke
I know you dont like neutral spells, i just want something that does that, so it can be a neutral minion
Loatheb doesnt need to be changed, he is fine for WILD and is a better fititng for standard/core set in the necrolyte (2 3/2).
And i dont think HS should nerf cards that have been wild for like 5+years just for standard, when are otehr option.
And if chaneg all about it,oculld just as well make a new card rather then nerf soemthing thats totally fine in wild just cause standard
So let summarize what needs to change to make board-centric game viable:
And tone AOE removals.
If they want to make things board-based they'd need to make midrange viable. A LOT of shit needs to change to make midrange viable.
Ehhh, we'll see when we'll see it. I don't mind bringing back board-based things (I really enjoy control decks) but I ain't gonna trust on their "putting effort to make things work" thing, we've got bamboozled so many times like this (Or at least in my opinion) that I'll simply wait to see if their putting effort will work (Which I hope will)
I just hope the "more board-based gameplay" doesn't mean we are going back to aggro, aggro aggro decks. I don't trust the designers behind hearthstone.
Aggro is the OG solitaire so it was hilarious when aggro players where claiming that about recent decks.
*gasp* “they’re not wasting time with minions clearing my board while I go face and would have ignored theirs! That’s so solitaire!”
Imagining playing aggro and ignoring the board... have fun loosing most of you aggro vs aggro matches!
Here a very old beginners guide to that topic, so you can learn the basics about aggro decks:
https://tempostorm.com/articles/beginners-guide-to-hearthstones-meta-aggro
Quote: "Aggressive play is not as simple as it sounds. At the very least, it boils down to far more than sending everything to the opponent’s face. The core strategy of aggro is putting pressure on the opponent early, and making good trades is often the best way to do so."
Wanna make it more board based? All you need to do is to not print so many mana reduction stuff like Siphon Mana, don't print infinite damage, bring back Loatheb to standard, and perhaps even Unseen Saboteur and Dirty Rat
Thereafter you may print as many Sorcerer's Gambits and The Demon Seed as you wish.
I dont have anything against OTK decks, when it takes actual effort to win with those things. I take great pride and pleasure at playing malygos rogue 2 years ago because I earned my wins. The whole solitaire meta was only aggravating because there's literally nothing you can do to stop them and as a result they just ignore your board because it doesn't matter. Its not about board, its about interaction. I get annoyed the same way by Sorcerer's Gambit as I do with the worst iterations of face hunter and ramp druid, because these decks don't lose, they just don't win.
As a rogue main I'm so glad they added Savory Deviate Delight and Parrrley to make up for the lack of a neutral like Dirty Rat. SDD didn't do much at first, but as the year has gone on so many decks have become so reliant on so few minions that it has become a perfect anti-meta card. A role helped by it being a 2-of and being playable before the opponent plays their key minion (unlike Mutanus). It has pretty much single-handedly allowed me to play slow, value decks like burgle rogue to decent success in what should be a very hostile meta.
Parrrley has been less reliable in that role, but even when it gets something mediocre, making the opponent effectively lose a draw to it is always nice. Plus it now serves as a backup plan to yoink one of Kazakusan's treasures if SDD misses him. That's all great for rogue, but no help for anyone else sadly.
I agree with @Purebalance on Loatheb though. Yeah, it encourages board-based decks, but primarily aggro since it also shafts midrange and control's ability to claim board control in the midgame.
Hard no on Loatheb. It’ll just get used by aggro like it does in wild so you can’t clear their board on turn 5 when most aoe tends to kick in.
I just want the client to work. Is that so much to ask? Stabilize the damn client on PC and mobile please for the love of Yog.
I have next to no issues on mobile and almost never have. It’s a hardware issue.
I hope they are not attempting to please everyone with this change. The people who complained about losing to solitaire decks are going to complain about not being able to go first or not drawing on curve when their opponent did.
Edit: Also pointing out, in a board centric meta when your opponent has the board you cannot get it back, which honestly isn't too different than watching your opponent cycle through their deck and kill you with their own fatigue.
The thing that worries me with this comment is that they don't entirely say the way in which they intend to go about adding 'incentive' for board based game play. If they don't intend to remove the mechanics that allow games to be put on a clock so consistently then are they going to have to power creep the hell out of these decks in order to ensure that these combo decks can't out pace them? I am not saying this is the plan but I don't see how they can assure us of anything without that being the case. What if they add all these incentives but players just find it is easier to kill people with a guaranteed win-con instead of actually fighting for the board? I don't really want the warlock quest to warp the meta so that they have to always be trying to out pace it in some way when something like that should never have existed in the first place. I don't even know if the warlock quest is that prevalent since I stopped playing all that often, but I do know that if it is bad it is because they have been forcing it to be bad rather than just addressing the problem and moving past it.
They just need to tune down the number of spells that can go face and get rid of charge like they originally intended.