I just had the idea that maybe this could bring back Quest Shaman?...or at least open up new possibilities. If you run plenty of spells (which Shaman has some archetypal support for) you can run this as your main quest completion engine and maybe not have to run so many battlecry cards to make it work. As a result you can bypass the typical weakness of Quest Shaman which is being very easily pushed off the board with no way to recover (especially since MCT has passed).
Stuff like Torrent and the AoO Elemental that discovers spells are fantastic for this. You basically have a recycleable ping spammer that gets bettter after finishing the quest. Maybe you can even incorporate a totem package since EVIL Totem is already a staple. Add a few more totems and the 0-cost totem buffers (better thanks to Totem Goliath) and you have plent of cheap spells to recycle the author (also gives you something to do before finishing the quest)
Basically Quest SHaman could return as a very value focussed deck that uses this guy for boardcontrol and pressure.
Fuck it, I'm gonna try it, it's not like Shaman can get any worse.
lol as if quest shaman had an issue finishing quest with infinite lackey generation lmao
Its not really that bad, honestly. You made some worthy points, and I will add that even control decks rarely have more than 5 cards when facing down tempo dhunters. If you're not playing cards every turn against dhunters, chances are good you will lose that matchup anyway.
But as pointed out by others, this card is problematic because;
- Its not fun to be at the receiving end of this card, especially if you get rng-ed to death by your draws
- It can be discovered, so even if the card itself doesn't make the cut, there will be games where this just blow the opponent away, in the most unfun fashion ever seen
- It actively punishes card draw , and for some archetypes and indeed classes, its simply impossible to play around. What does, for example, handlock propose to do against something like this? Another severe example would be the fact that priest cant draw for shit, so this just hit the entire class.
- Anything that can affect the opponent's hand needs to come with severe drawbacks to be remotely justified. There's a good reason why warlock, thus far anyway, is the only class that has hand disruption tools. This is being given to one of the best tempo-face class in the meta currently. Not a good sign.
The only drawback of this card is, in my opinion;
- You need to play this card, at a cost of 4 mana. Not many aggro decks can do that without losing tempo, which in some matches is game ending
- In some matches this just ensures you can't outcast other cards. If this gets stuck on your left side and you're holding more than 4 cards, then its one of those russian roulette games again where die if you do, die if you don't. Of course, this also means you almost never play skull with this card in the same deck. A worthy tradeoff? considering that skull was the only card that breaks Altruis the Outcast, one of the strongest cards in the game right now.
Yes, this does not kill control as an archetype, but its a little like quest rogue, in that control decks might as well just auto concede when it appears. Or like aggro against odd warrior. See it, know your win rate is easily near the 30s, just concede and save time.
I can only hope that this have actually went through play testing and found to be impossible to include into tempo dhunters. Also, there's plenty of new cards unrevealed down the line, so let's sit on this until we see everything before crucifying Glide upside down under the sun.
They don't test anything anymore, remember when they said that they wouldn't print two cards that were bullshit if combined in the standard set? Well....
Grave Rune + [Hearthstone Card (conniving infiltrator) Not Found] proves they don't care about that anymore. So what makes you think they care. It's literally KFT 2 demon hunter boogaloo, where they want more players to join the game off busted new mechanics of a broken new class, and they don't care if they screw over the other older ones, because if new players wanted to play those ones they would have done it already. Just when you think it's settling down, where they nerfed all the demon hunter cards they intentionally released with the intention of being batship busted. Here comes the expansion to say:
Your other characters are immune is more bullshit than houndmaster shaw could ever be, a card that carried hunter all the way until it got put in wild. You're always going to be ahead on board. All this card does against aggro is give your opponent a turn to try to catch up to you until you play your next cycle of bullshit DH cards. And against control it singlehandedly wins you the matchup unless they're mage and they just played an elemental last turn with Elemental Allies to draw their aoe back again. Which is so fringe it's glide's downside. Literally nothing.
"This card helps your plot twist warlock complete their quest so it's fair!!!"
Congrats the card is balanced because it helps out a meme deck, with a shitty quest reward that fatigues yourself with no aoe, that already lost easily to demon hunter before this latest influx of new bullshit DH cards.
"Lol just waste your aoe against 2 minions then when they shuffle your AOE back to the bottom of the deck you could have used them"
There the card is fixed, not broken anymore i am a genius!
Oh wait. If you're wasting all your aoe against a busted aggro deck early you won't have any for later, which means you have already lost. So it's either waste your aoe on boards that are manageable now, or not have it for later. What fun game design. I'm glad the aggrocentric community of this site, where they constantly want warrior deleted if it has even a tier 3 control-based deck isn't biased against this card at all.
Not to mention, that screwing with mulligan shouldn't be a thing. Hand disruption is understandable, and since they don't want to print mill to screw with greedy control players they see this as their best option? "Fuck you i know you played a bunch of draw to keep card advantage against your greedy aggro opponent that just tempos out cards no matter what they are, throw those four cards you needed to the bottom of your deck" "I know you kept that card from the mulligan specifically because you queued into a demon hunter where it's useful more than any other matchup, but it costs more than four mana, so back to the bottom of your deck it goes."
Fun Game. Both to play with and against blizzard....
DH aggro doesn't need this for draw tho, they already have spectral sight, Skull of Gul'dan, and Crimson Sigil Runner.
Tempo relies on draw. Skull was already nerfed. This is an easy replacement. the mana reduction of the spell itself and the more cards drawn is easily better than that.
Also lets be real, if you're aggro and you let your opponent draw cards on your turn that's a game losing move.
Card quality. When your four cards are better than your opponents 4 cards it doesn't matter. And 4 cards from demon hunter are better than 4 cards of any class
People... Opponent doesn't always have 9 cards in hand... Aggro might have their hand empty too.... and then this card sucks...
Worst case scenario, at the end of turn three you run out of cards in your hand, classic DH. Your opponent also empties their hand on their turn after yours. Your turns starts you topdeck Glide. Here is the downside.
Let's assume you went first this game. You hit four mana before your opponent. The "downside" essentially restarts the game but you're not going second without the coin. Except here's the thing. You're no playing normal cards like your hunter/rogue/shaman aggro opponent. You're playing busted DH cards. That 1 for 1, are always going to be better than whatever your opponent draws. Essentially your four draws are worth MORE than your opponents draws, because your class is more busted.
Now. Let's say you went second. Same scenario. You didn't coin out this card, you played it on four mana, when your opponent also has four mana. You'd be behind a turn right? Right. EXCEPT for the fact your cards are so busted as a DH already that making up that distance takes literally nothing. And by turn four you were probably a turn ahead anyway. So your opponent draws their fifth card, and takes the turn playing catchup to you. Now on your turn you resume where you started playing busted minion after busted minion all over again resuming where you left off.
The downside in any other class, with fair mechanics and balanced cards would hurt. A lot. But not in DH. In DH it's literally nothing.
Obvious insane power of this card aside, I think we should consider how consistently will this card be really effective considering it costs 4 and disruption only happens on outcast. Sorry, I haven't really played standard after the nerfs but I got the feeling that the class has been slowed considerably.
Tempo demon hunter can empty their hand before turn 5 for this card EASILY. It's not a tech card. It's not something you think about using. It's draw 4, fuck you opponent.
My logic was that playing this on turn 5 effectively loses you a turn, leaving you with only 1 mana. Sure it can mess up your opponent's hand, but it can also help them if they have useless cards in hand. The only annoying thing is that you have to adapt to a certain playstyle of not saving resources for too long when playing against DH.
It's pretty naive how you think this card was printed because it could help the opponent lose their terrible hand after the mulligan phase, where you're supposed to pick the best cards in a matchup, this card making that literally useless. Also playing this on turn five would float a mana, at least it would if the class didn't have an inbuilt way to use solitary mana. But your last take is literally the worst.
"The only annoying thing is that you have to adapt to a certain playstyle of not saving resources for too long when playing against DH."
Saving aoe against board greedy opponents is a mainstay of hearthstone. "Should i used this boardclear now or should i save it until they play more minions" This has always been a thing. But suddenly you're not allowed to keep boardclears in your mulligan against DH anymore. Because it's useless. They can play this and it's gone to the bottom of your deck again, even though you SPECIFICALLY PICKED the card for the matchup you went into. Is this good game design in your opinion? Even in the worst possible scenario, you as a demon hunter play this when you have no cards against an opponent who also has no cards in hand on turn 4. You both draw up to four cards. And your opponent draws up to five on their turn. All this does negatively for you as the demon hunter playing is set you to the second player to start the game and the game resets. Which is literally NOTHING.
Hey it doesn't always disrupt... if your opponent is also aggro you usually help them instead...
Still basically resets the game to the beginning in an aggro vs aggro matchup. A net ZERO. Not even a net zero if your hand was empty, because it draws your four and then resets the game.
Still basically resets the game to the beginning in an aggro vs aggro matchup. A net ZERO. Not even a net zero if your hand was empty, because it draws your four and then resets the game.
this card will be annoying, but fortunately won't see any play in tempo...I don't think
Tempo DH can easily, EASILY empty their hand to play this before turn 5. It's not a tech card. It's not something you think about playing with an effect that could inconvenience you. it's 4 mana draw four, screw over your opponent.
Obvious insane power of this card aside, I think we should consider how consistently will this card be really effective considering it costs 4 and disruption only happens on outcast. Sorry, I haven't really played standard after the nerfs but I got the feeling that the class has been slowed considerably.
Tempo demon hunter can empty their hand before turn 5 for this card EASILY. It's not a tech card. It's not something you think about using. It's draw 4, fuck you opponent.
4 mana draw 4 that disrupts your opponents hand in an aggrocentric class. BULL.SHIT.
remember guys hunter and rogue couldn't have good card draw for YEARS, because they were the aggrocentric classes. And now one of the most cancerous aggro classes in the game gets 4 mana draw 4 that disrupts their entire opponent's hand. You're a mage and you were saving that blizzard or flamestrike to use against the DH opponent? Woops they ran out of cards on turn 5 because they've been tempo-ing you out all game and now they play this and you don't have ANY AOE AT ALL in your hand to deal with them anymore.
People in discussion thinking this card isn't batshit busted lmao. People be like....."i don't know if it'll even be played" XD
God bliz really hates people like me that enjoy playing control man. Control warlock tapping so dark skies actually does damage and then DH plays this card and you go from eight cards in hand down to four. and you still have to deal with their endless spam of bullshit minions. Dark skies does 4 damage now it's literally unplayable and you did 8-10 damage to yourself for them. That's right, i don't know if people missed that bit, but it's not magical mallet, it's not plot twist. Your opponent draws back to four cards. I don't know if you've ever played this game called hearthstone before. But i have, and i have played games where i have needed to draw, to get an AOE against a tempo opponent when i had no chance and YOU ALWAYS WHIFF THE DRAW. That's why mulliganning is so important. But this fucks that right off. Who cares about anything anymore. Who cares if the game is fun to play against. They're playing DH.
4 mana draw 4 that disrupts your opponents hand in an aggrocentric class. BULL.SHIT.
remember guys hunter and rogue couldn't have good card draw for YEARS, because they were the aggrocentric classes. And now one of the most cancerous aggro classes in the game gets 4 mana draw 4 that disrupts their entire opponent's hand. You're a mage and you were saving that blizzard or flamestrike to use against the DH opponent? Woops they ran out of cards on turn 5 because they've been tempo-ing you out all game and now they play this and you don't have ANY AOE AT ALL in your hand to deal with them anymore.
lol as if quest shaman had an issue finishing quest with infinite lackey generation lmao
Right now unplayable, because every class can pull 1 mana deal 2 out of their ass every turn
Maybe when those rotate it will see play. Or maybe if they release more spamable spells in the set. But right now it's pretty lackluster.
This expansion is a joke to every class but DH
They don't test anything anymore, remember when they said that they wouldn't print two cards that were bullshit if combined in the standard set? Well....
Grave Rune + [Hearthstone Card (conniving infiltrator) Not Found] proves they don't care about that anymore. So what makes you think they care. It's literally KFT 2 demon hunter boogaloo, where they want more players to join the game off busted new mechanics of a broken new class, and they don't care if they screw over the other older ones, because if new players wanted to play those ones they would have done it already. Just when you think it's settling down, where they nerfed all the demon hunter cards they intentionally released with the intention of being batship busted. Here comes the expansion to say:
Your other characters are immune is more bullshit than houndmaster shaw could ever be, a card that carried hunter all the way until it got put in wild. You're always going to be ahead on board. All this card does against aggro is give your opponent a turn to try to catch up to you until you play your next cycle of bullshit DH cards. And against control it singlehandedly wins you the matchup unless they're mage and they just played an elemental last turn with Elemental Allies to draw their aoe back again. Which is so fringe it's glide's downside. Literally nothing.
Also:
"This card helps your plot twist warlock complete their quest so it's fair!!!"
Congrats the card is balanced because it helps out a meme deck, with a shitty quest reward that fatigues yourself with no aoe, that already lost easily to demon hunter before this latest influx of new bullshit DH cards.
"Lol just waste your aoe against 2 minions then when they shuffle your AOE back to the bottom of the deck you could have used them"
There the card is fixed, not broken anymore i am a genius!
Oh wait. If you're wasting all your aoe against a busted aggro deck early you won't have any for later, which means you have already lost. So it's either waste your aoe on boards that are manageable now, or not have it for later. What fun game design. I'm glad the aggrocentric community of this site, where they constantly want warrior deleted if it has even a tier 3 control-based deck isn't biased against this card at all.
Not to mention, that screwing with mulligan shouldn't be a thing. Hand disruption is understandable, and since they don't want to print mill to screw with greedy control players they see this as their best option? "Fuck you i know you played a bunch of draw to keep card advantage against your greedy aggro opponent that just tempos out cards no matter what they are, throw those four cards you needed to the bottom of your deck" "I know you kept that card from the mulligan specifically because you queued into a demon hunter where it's useful more than any other matchup, but it costs more than four mana, so back to the bottom of your deck it goes."
Fun Game. Both to play with and against blizzard....
They obviously mean it copies a voidcaller in hand.....
Tempo relies on draw. Skull was already nerfed. This is an easy replacement. the mana reduction of the spell itself and the more cards drawn is easily better than that.
Card quality. When your four cards are better than your opponents 4 cards it doesn't matter. And 4 cards from demon hunter are better than 4 cards of any class
Worst case scenario, at the end of turn three you run out of cards in your hand, classic DH. Your opponent also empties their hand on their turn after yours. Your turns starts you topdeck Glide. Here is the downside.
Let's assume you went first this game. You hit four mana before your opponent. The "downside" essentially restarts the game but you're not going second without the coin. Except here's the thing. You're no playing normal cards like your hunter/rogue/shaman aggro opponent. You're playing busted DH cards. That 1 for 1, are always going to be better than whatever your opponent draws. Essentially your four draws are worth MORE than your opponents draws, because your class is more busted.
Now. Let's say you went second. Same scenario. You didn't coin out this card, you played it on four mana, when your opponent also has four mana. You'd be behind a turn right? Right. EXCEPT for the fact your cards are so busted as a DH already that making up that distance takes literally nothing. And by turn four you were probably a turn ahead anyway. So your opponent draws their fifth card, and takes the turn playing catchup to you. Now on your turn you resume where you started playing busted minion after busted minion all over again resuming where you left off.
The downside in any other class, with fair mechanics and balanced cards would hurt. A lot. But not in DH. In DH it's literally nothing.
It's pretty naive how you think this card was printed because it could help the opponent lose their terrible hand after the mulligan phase, where you're supposed to pick the best cards in a matchup, this card making that literally useless. Also playing this on turn five would float a mana, at least it would if the class didn't have an inbuilt way to use solitary mana. But your last take is literally the worst.
"The only annoying thing is that you have to adapt to a certain playstyle of not saving resources for too long when playing against DH."
Saving aoe against board greedy opponents is a mainstay of hearthstone. "Should i used this boardclear now or should i save it until they play more minions" This has always been a thing. But suddenly you're not allowed to keep boardclears in your mulligan against DH anymore. Because it's useless. They can play this and it's gone to the bottom of your deck again, even though you SPECIFICALLY PICKED the card for the matchup you went into. Is this good game design in your opinion? Even in the worst possible scenario, you as a demon hunter play this when you have no cards against an opponent who also has no cards in hand on turn 4. You both draw up to four cards. And your opponent draws up to five on their turn. All this does negatively for you as the demon hunter playing is set you to the second player to start the game and the game resets. Which is literally NOTHING.
Still basically resets the game to the beginning in an aggro vs aggro matchup. A net ZERO. Not even a net zero if your hand was empty, because it draws your four and then resets the game.
Still basically resets the game to the beginning in an aggro vs aggro matchup. A net ZERO. Not even a net zero if your hand was empty, because it draws your four and then resets the game.
Tempo DH can easily, EASILY empty their hand to play this before turn 5. It's not a tech card. It's not something you think about playing with an effect that could inconvenience you. it's 4 mana draw four, screw over your opponent.
Tempo demon hunter can empty their hand before turn 5 for this card EASILY. It's not a tech card. It's not something you think about using. It's draw 4, fuck you opponent.
People in discussion thinking this card isn't batshit busted lmao. People be like....."i don't know if it'll even be played" XD
God bliz really hates people like me that enjoy playing control man. Control warlock tapping so dark skies actually does damage and then DH plays this card and you go from eight cards in hand down to four. and you still have to deal with their endless spam of bullshit minions. Dark skies does 4 damage now it's literally unplayable and you did 8-10 damage to yourself for them. That's right, i don't know if people missed that bit, but it's not magical mallet, it's not plot twist. Your opponent draws back to four cards. I don't know if you've ever played this game called hearthstone before. But i have, and i have played games where i have needed to draw, to get an AOE against a tempo opponent when i had no chance and YOU ALWAYS WHIFF THE DRAW. That's why mulliganning is so important. But this fucks that right off. Who cares about anything anymore. Who cares if the game is fun to play against. They're playing DH.
How bliz expects it to be used:
How it will really be used:
remember guys hunter and rogue couldn't have good card draw for YEARS, because they were the aggrocentric classes. And now one of the most cancerous aggro classes in the game gets 4 mana draw 4 that disrupts their entire opponent's hand. You're a mage and you were saving that blizzard or flamestrike to use against the DH opponent? Woops they ran out of cards on turn 5 because they've been tempo-ing you out all game and now they play this and you don't have ANY AOE AT ALL in your hand to deal with them anymore.
4 mana draw 4 that disrupts your opponents hand in an aggrocentric class. BULL.SHIT.
Coolest minion in a long time.